how did ugude's camps do?

moedogee said:
I hate to disagree but bird numbers are not about the same as the last couple of years where I live, South central region. Yep 30 miles from Mitchell. I stop in the local coop and drink coffee all year long. I talk to the locals who till the ground. I'm retired and pheasants are a passion. I also own two top notch pointing labs with noses and drive that don't compare. I hunt DIY mainly on public land. Land all tax payers are entitled to. Why? Most private land is saved for family or friends or dollars the pheasant lease can bring. I travel hundreds of miles on the gravel all year and have a trained eye. I love to photograph Roosters in the spring since that's a time they wont run away Yes I get my share of roosters but the truth is Pheasant populations and habitat conditions such as the management of CRP lands are in a dire condition. I estimate it will probably take at least 2 years of favorable conditions to produce pheasant numbers in most areas of S.D.the state has been known for. Does that make me stop hunting. Absolutely not! But when I see 5 orange coated hunters, many from out of state pushing fields in hopes of all limiting out its not going to happen! Somebody would have to plant some birds. Its impossible for there to be 15 roosters on that land day in and day out. If you watch YouTube and all you here is Rooster Rooster you cant wait to get to S.D. but that's not the real world. No offense to lodges and preserves they are in the entertainment industry and have to produce. But that is a very small segment of the real world in S.D. Its going to take huge changes for CRP in the 2018 farm bill and a real desire for habitat improvement overall. Otherwise plan on breaking out your wallet and hunting the European Style of management.
Feel free to comment that's what a forum is about. You can also PM me if you are the shy type.:)
Click to expand...

Great statement.Would you agree with a 40% decline in pheasants in your area this year?I think they should get 10 guys like you in different locations in the state to give forcast.Your forecast is more boots on the ground.
And you have no reason to pump up pheasant counts.
They could call it BOG report
I am going to call you UHONEST
 
Last edited:
moedogee said:
I hate to disagree but bird numbers are not about the same as the last couple of years where I live, South central region. Yep 30 miles from Mitchell. I stop in the local coop and drink coffee all year long. I talk to the locals who till the ground. I'm retired and pheasants are a passion. I also own two top notch pointing labs with noses and drive that don't compare. I hunt DIY mainly on public land. Land all tax payers are entitled to. Why? Most private land is saved for family or friends or dollars the pheasant lease can bring. I travel hundreds of miles on the gravel all year and have a trained eye. I love to photograph Roosters in the spring since that's a time they wont run away Yes I get my share of roosters but the truth is Pheasant populations and habitat conditions such as the management of CRP lands are in a dire condition. I estimate it will probably take at least 2 years of favorable conditions to produce pheasant numbers in most areas of S.D.the state has been known for. Does that make me stop hunting. Absolutely not! But when I see 5 orange coated hunters, many from out of state pushing fields in hopes of all limiting out its not going to happen! Somebody would have to plant some birds. Its impossible for there to be 15 roosters on that land day in and day out. If you watch YouTube and all you here is Rooster Rooster you cant wait to get to S.D. but that's not the real world. No offense to lodges and preserves they are in the entertainment industry and have to produce. But that is a very small segment of the real world in S.D. Its going to take huge changes for CRP in the 2018 farm bill and a real desire for habitat improvement overall. Otherwise plan on breaking out your wallet and hunting the European Style of management.
Feel free to comment that's what a forum is about. You can also PM me if you are the shy type.:)
Click to expand...

Moedogee’s commentary is so much more useful & interesting than relying only on broad-based statistical guestimates.

But since stats can also be interesting, let’s play around a little.

(prepare yourselves) (numbers rounded)

The 2016 Brood Count Survey reported 3.05 birds/mile (BPM). Remember this is a statewide average of BIRDS SEEN PER MILE ON SELECTED ROUTES OVER A GIVEN TIME PERIOD. 3.05 is a 61% decrease from 7.85 reported 10 years earlier in 2007, when the estimated pheasant harvest topped out over 2,100,000. If the 61% decrease in BPM correlated directly to pheasant harvest, hunters would’ve taken 825,000 roosters in 2016. Instead, it’s estimated that hunters took about 1,200,000 birds, 45% more than 825,000 and only 45% below 2007.

Now if we relate the 2017 brood count of 1.68 BPM to data from 2007, the estimated harvest this year should be about 454,000. I’ll bet dollars to donuts we shoot about twice that number this season.

Now, prior to 2017 the 10-year average brood count was 4.8 BPM, with highs in 2007 & 2008 of 7.85 & 8.56 BPM, respectively. So what do we consider “quite good”? Let’s say 6.0 BPM (last seen in 2010). What would it take to get from 1.68 BPM in 2017 back to 6.0 BPM? It would take 6 years of 25% increases….in a row! 3 straight years of 50% increases would put us close, but not quite (5.67).

In the last 20 years, 9 years have had an increase at Brood Count Survey time, but only 4 reported a 25% increase or greater.
1998: +91.0% BPM; +28.9% harvest; +38.9% adjusted preseason population.
2003: +134.8% BPM; +43.9% harvest; +58.2% adjusted preseason population.
2014: +76.3% BPM; +22.1% harvest; +21.0% adjusted preseason population.
2015: +41.8% BPM; +4.7% harvest; +2.7% adjusted preseason population.

On average, the Brood Count Survey has reported a 7.1% increase over the last 20 years. Sounds good! But…..BPM has decreased 67% from 5.08 to 1.68. WTF??? Let’s just ignore that & focus on the 7.1% average annual increase. To reach 6.0 BPM again (remember, that was last reported only 7 years ago), it’ll take 19 years in a row of 7.1% increases!

Mind-numbing, vaguely interesting, and just about as useful as the Brood Count Survey Report.
 
James O said:
Great statement.Would you agree with a 40% decline in pheasants in your area this year?I think they should get 10 guys like you in different locations in the state to give forcast.Your forecast is more boots on the ground.
And you have no reason to pump up pheasant counts.
They could call it BOG report
I am going to call you UHONEST
Click to expand...
Thanks for the compliment. Ill be 66 this month and was carrying my Dads Michigan Roosters when I was 4 years old. Still feel the same about pheasants now as I did then, just a little more stiff in the wrong places. ..lol Have to pick my places to walk a little wiser.
 
A-5 Sweet 16.....Good numbers to mull over. I hesitate to even say a percentage down this year since it is based on only one mans scale. For instance My wife is in Texas working that disaster with Fema. When she left she made me promise to not road hunt with her new pup she has trained all year. So despite my theory that has worked, all my life which is: If you see some Birds to hunt you save old legs. Last night I drove the gravel 2 hours near me and saw only 2 roosters in the ditch next to cut beans. They sat tight and even my pup was going crazy. I didn't have my shotgun with me avoiding temptation and they finally flew up cackling like HA we fooled you. I just grinned and thought someone else may harvest them. They are still out there! Thats all the birds I saw, when normally I can spot ten to twenty in that same drive in years past.
 
moedogee said:
A-5 Sweet 16.....Good numbers to mull over. I hesitate to even say a percentage down this year since it is based on only one mans scale. For instance My wife is in Texas working that disaster with Fema. When she left she made me promise to not road hunt with her new pup she has trained all year. So despite my theory that has worked, all my life which is: If you see some Birds to hunt you save old legs. Last night I drove the gravel 2 hours near me and saw only 2 roosters in the ditch next to cut beans. They sat tight and even my pup was going crazy. I didn't have my shotgun with me avoiding temptation and they finally flew up cackling like HA we fooled you. I just grinned and thought someone else may harvest them. They are still out there! Thats all the birds I saw, when normally I can spot ten to twenty in that same drive in years past.
Click to expand...

Yah, good numbers to mull over and then forget about & go out & see what's really shakin. In your case, if you averaged seeing 15 birds on your drive in other years, I suppose the State & media would be right in reporting that birds are down almost 87% in your area. Here's one of my favorites. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEOjo0imqKE
 
Our most productive hunting is in December especially if it snows fresh. Thats when most of the pheasants have to seek out the Heaviest Cattail swamp for protection from the elements but will venture out to grain and then right back. That also gives me a great idea on how many birds there really are and how much carry over there really will be. I have a Lab that has no quit and if there are pheasants in that type of cover they will flush. Once a few get up most of the hens flush early but those wily cocks take some nudging. If you are hunting that kind of cover be patient since Wild Roosters are very smart. Last year there were spots we hunted where 50 or more birds would get up with the understandable rooster to hen ratio one would expect for late season. Hopefully there will be some carry over this winter. By the way these spots can be public next to private since in my area in S.D that's the only heavy cover available during Moonscape time.
 
moedogee said:
Our most productive hunting is in December especially if it snows fresh. Thats when most of the pheasants have to seek out the Heaviest Cattail swamp for protection from the elements but will venture out to grain and then right back. That also gives me a great idea on how many birds there really are and how much carry over there really will be. I have a Lab that has no quit and if there are pheasants in that type of cover they will flush. Once a few get up most of the hens flush early but those wily cocks take some nudging. If you are hunting that kind of cover be patient since Wild Roosters are very smart. Last year there were spots we hunted where 50 or more birds would get up with the understandable rooster to hen ratio one would expect for late season. Hopefully there will be some carry over this winter. By the way these spots can be public next to private since in my area in S.D that's the only heavy cover available during Moonscape time.
Click to expand...

In my area closer to Sioux Falls, once there's significant snow on the ground, it seems like the public land roosters will commonly act different than the hens. Hens might return to cattails to hang out for the day, but it seems like the roosters like to find trees, on private land of course. Gaining access to the land is one thing, but even if you can, getting within range is another. Smart, smart, smart.
 
A5 Sweet 16 said:
Moedogee’s commentary is so much more useful & interesting than relying only on broad-based statistical guestimates.

But since stats can also be interesting, let’s play around a little.

(prepare yourselves) (numbers rounded)

The 2016 Brood Count Survey reported 3.05 birds/mile (BPM). Remember this is a statewide average of BIRDS SEEN PER MILE ON SELECTED ROUTES OVER A GIVEN TIME PERIOD. 3.05 is a 61% decrease from 7.85 reported 10 years earlier in 2007, when the estimated pheasant harvest topped out over 2,100,000. If the 61% decrease in BPM correlated directly to pheasant harvest, hunters would’ve taken 825,000 roosters in 2016. Instead, it’s estimated that hunters took about 1,200,000 birds, 45% more than 825,000 and only 45% below 2007.

Now if we relate the 2017 brood count of 1.68 BPM to data from 2007, the estimated harvest this year should be about 454,000. I’ll bet dollars to donuts we shoot about twice that number this season.

Now, prior to 2017 the 10-year average brood count was 4.8 BPM, with highs in 2007 & 2008 of 7.85 & 8.56 BPM, respectively. So what do we consider “quite good”? Let’s say 6.0 BPM (last seen in 2010). What would it take to get from 1.68 BPM in 2017 back to 6.0 BPM? It would take 6 years of 25% increases….in a row! 3 straight years of 50% increases would put us close, but not quite (5.67).

In the last 20 years, 9 years have had an increase at Brood Count Survey time, but only 4 reported a 25% increase or greater.
1998: +91.0% BPM; +28.9% harvest; +38.9% adjusted preseason population.
2003: +134.8% BPM; +43.9% harvest; +58.2% adjusted preseason population.
2014: +76.3% BPM; +22.1% harvest; +21.0% adjusted preseason population.
2015: +41.8% BPM; +4.7% harvest; +2.7% adjusted preseason population.

On average, the Brood Count Survey has reported a 7.1% increase over the last 20 years. Sounds good! But…..BPM has decreased 67% from 5.08 to 1.68. WTF??? Let’s just ignore that & focus on the 7.1% average annual increase. To reach 6.0 BPM again (remember, that was last reported only 7 years ago), it’ll take 19 years in a row of 7.1% increases!

Mind-numbing, vaguely interesting, and just about as useful as the Brood Count Survey Report.
Click to expand...

Wow to much for me to follow.How about we use 2017 brood count survey
Of about 40% decline in pheasants from 2016.Estimate pheasant taken
In 2016 was 1,200,000 take away 40% that gives us 720,000 birds is that
Better? For people from out of state we have no other gauge to decide where to go hunting.I realize that it is not perfect but I believe it is close
In average.
 
Last edited:
Hunted his PC last week and would say bird numbers down 40+ percent. Shot some very small roosters. Some corn standing near the one farm that should make it good for one of the weeks, but all in all....down.
First time, I had 2 hens from a previous group returned to my hand by the dogs. No good.
Great food, drinks and fun with family and friends made up for the numbers.
As many of you know, cover or not, hail and Mother Nature can really impact the numbers.
 
SX3 said:
Hunted his PC last week and would say bird numbers down 40+ percent. Shot some very small roosters. Some corn standing near the one farm that should make it good for one of the weeks, but all in all....down.
First time, I had 2 hens from a previous group returned to my hand by the dogs. No good.
Great food, drinks and fun with family and friends made up for the numbers.
As many of you know, cover or not, hail and Mother Nature can really impact the numbers.
Click to expand...

nice overview...glad you had a good trip!
 
At the risk of being accused of being a rabble-rouser, has anyone been keeping tabs on UGUIDE's hunting results? Easy to find by going to his website. It has been almost 2 months since he has posted here. Looks like it has been a tough season for most of his camps, which lines up with how most hunters have been doing in roughly the same geographies that his camps are located in. Looks like in the past few weeks he has had several groups not show up. This past week or two, where he has had hunters, it appears those camps have averaged around a bird per hunter per day. some better, some far worse. seems the camp around lake andes has done OK, as has the camp around lemmon. He possesses a wealth of information, would be interesting to hear from him. It appears to me that the games that were being played this summer/early fall were, in fact, an attempt at customer retention. Blinding flash of the obvious, I guess. Wish him the best, important business, IMO. By the way, on this website, but within a different thread, I recently suggested to a group of 12 from San Diego that they use UGUIDE next year, so please don't bash me for discussing UGUIDE. All the best...gotta go pack, heading back on the 6th...13th...and hopefully the 2nd....good luck!
 
benelli-banger said:
At the risk of being accused of being a rabble-rouser, has anyone been keeping tabs on UGUIDE's hunting results? Easy to find by going to his website. It has been almost 2 months since he has posted here. Looks like it has been a tough season for most of his camps, which lines up with how most hunters have been doing in roughly the same geographies that his camps are located in. Looks like in the past few weeks he has had several groups not show up. This past week or two, where he has had hunters, it appears those camps have averaged around a bird per hunter per day. some better, some far worse. seems the camp around lake andes has done OK, as has the camp around lemmon. He possesses a wealth of information, would be interesting to hear from him. It appears to me that the games that were being played this summer/early fall were, in fact, an attempt at customer retention. Blinding flash of the obvious, I guess. Wish him the best, important business, IMO. By the way, on this website, but within a different thread, I recently suggested to a group of 12 from San Diego that they use UGUIDE next year, so please don't bash me for discussing UGUIDE. All the best...gotta go pack, heading back on the 6th...13th...and hopefully the 2nd....good luck!
Click to expand...

I also have recommended his site and have come close to going a couple times. The truth is always found out no matter how it is spun. I have a decent spot we hunt with better than average habitat and food plots. We averaged a couple birds apiece second weekend with some hard work. Better shooting would have produced a limit for the 6 of us. Birds down 30-40%. Since 2010 they are down much more than that. Headed back on Wednesday to free lance a couple days then hunt there again this weekend. Farmer is saying roosters are getting thin. Good luck to you
 
benelli-banger said:
my point exactly...don't know...don't want to bash him, but much of what he had to say this summer was utter BS...Do we call him "UHIDE"? "ULIED?" Ok, I am stooping to low levels...my apologies...but those are such slam dunks, I had to "go there"...yeah, he's been gone since 10/7....strange time to vanish...I'm sure he'll reappear and provide interesting anecdotes. I hope his operation does well, it is much needed. I did revisit his rates for 2018...hadn't looked for a while...about $1,000 per trip, +/-...earlier are a bit more, later are a bit less...two camps run 4 day hunts, the others are 3 days...for the latter, you get 4 nights lodging, and 3 hunting days...I was just in Huron last weekend, and paid $50 a nite per guy at a moderate hotel...but I liked it a lot, actually...so, that would equate to about $265/day for land access using UGUIDE's pricing....not cheap...if you don't have to take a trip in the spring or summer to scout, and you spare yourself those $, this is not bad. Especially since you are hunting pretty first class land, from what it appears in the descriptions. Nothing you can do about this year...mother nature had her own plans for the high plains!
Click to expand...
He's probably sipping martinis, in Jamaica.1000 a day? Cha Ching.
 
about a grand per trip, actually...i have been too hard on him, perhaps...again, what he does is much needed...a good service, a good business model...i want him to succeed, it would just be nice to get some real-time intel from him, knowing he has great insight from the 6 camps he has in different parts of the state...
 
I feel that almost all members on this site have dogs and are pretty serious
About upland hunting.Also they tend to know a lot of people with boots on the ground.The problem for me with Uguide was his continual denial of
Bird populations this year to people who know pheasant hunting and the
Results of brood counts.It is almost insulting and like BB says he could have given out great info because of his camps spread out through state
I would not hunt at any of his camps now.I have lost faith in him
 
James O said:
I feel that almost all members on this site have dogs and are pretty serious
About upland hunting.Also they tend to know a lot of people with boots on the ground.The problem for me with Uguide was his continual denial of
Bird populations this year to people who know pheasant hunting and the
Results of brood counts.It is almost insulting and like BB says he could have given out great info because of his camps spread out through state
I would not hunt at any of his camps now.I have lost faith in him
Click to expand...

yes, very damned insulting...exactly. if you read his summer pheasant forecast, on his actual website, it is a bunch of garbage. I feel like a lot of the guys who bashed me for being too hard on him didn't read much of what he had to say throughout the summer or early fall..it was utter bs....sorry, truth...then he started twisting, and changed his tune...my take, anyway...frankly, i have been an advocate of his for years...still am, but he needs to be candid...my .02. Whatever...
 
Have any of the hunters that stayed at the various "U-Guide" camps reported on their hunts? Can't recall reviewing these...
 
Perhaps if one offered a criticism you wouldn't get invited back...

If there were rave reviews, I'm sure we would see them!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top