Possible Lead shot Ban

Wirehairs, I am not anti farmer or think farmers are evil, like I said some of my best friends and family are farmers. I do however see, in my neck of the woods, the impact on our environment. I live a stones throw away from the San Jauquine river which used to be home to one of the biggest salmon runs on the west coast. Last year was the first time in some 50+- years that it flowed to the ocean. The farmers and water districts struck a deal a few years back to restore water flows to "revitalize" the river. Already a lot of farmers want to take back the deal so they don't lose one drop of irrigation water. Never mind one of the biggest aquifiers in the valley is recharged by the new water flows.

If you want to see a true "monoculture" take a look at Google earth and look west of the city of Madera. That is what you guys in the mid west need to fight.
 
I feel sorry for you folks out there. Many of you have never road hunted before, and I sence that you may be turnning your nose up at the idea. We in South Dakota, shoot stuff were we find it. The game, unlike in other states, belongs to us the public, not the land owner. The road ditch also belongs to us, the public. To me, it makes no sence if your a hunter, not to hunt the ditch, if that is where the game is. Try to pass shoot geese, without using road ditches. We hide in the ditch, the geese fly out to feed, we jump up, and shoot them, untill they die. If by chance the geese are a mile down the road. We move. We don't ask someone if we can move, we move. You see, the game belongs to us.
 
No need to feel sorry for me for never having hunted a road ditch. It is still possible for me to gain access to prime private land with a simple knock on a door, a firm handshake, and a simple offer to share my quarry. Also game is not owned by landowners here and not many hold that type of thinking.

I was hunting private land near a fence line when my springer busted a covey of quail. My aim was true and I folded a double that crossed over the fence. My dog promptly retrieved the first quail but wasn't casting far enough for the other, so I left my gun at the fence to help him find it. The landowner of this property was watching (unknown to me) and came to ask how the hunting was and why I left my gun at the fence. I told him I was just retrieving my downed bird and he said "well that covey just lit down this draw, go get your gun and give them hell." I didn't even ask, he offered his land to me. So don't feel sorry, we do just fine without road ditches.
 
sdditchpig said:
I feel sorry for you folks out there. Many of you have never road hunted before, and I sence that you may be turnning your nose up at the idea. We in South Dakota, shoot stuff were we find it. The game, unlike in other states, belongs to us the public, not the land owner. The road ditch also belongs to us, the public. To me, it makes no sence if your a hunter, not to hunt the ditch, if that is where the game is. Try to pass shoot geese, without using road ditches. We hide in the ditch, the geese fly out to feed, we jump up, and shoot them, untill they die. If by chance the geese are a mile down the road. We move. We don't ask someone if we can move, we move. You see, the game belongs to us.
Click to expand...

You are right, wild game belongs to the public and it is legal to hunt the right of way. Please remember that we pay taxes on the right of way. So it is our land too. We tax our selves to maintain the roads. Last year when they culverts washed out it was the local landowner that took the time to replace them. Some of the field roads we maintain at our own expense. Please remember that next fall when you come to a muddy dirt road that maybe you could park the pickup and walk the ditch instead. Also don't forget to take care of the canada thistle in that ditch that belongs to you.
 
haymaker said:
You are right, wild game belongs to the public and it is legal to hunt the right of way. Please remember that we pay taxes on the right of way. So it is our land too. We tax our selves to maintain the roads. Last year when they culverts washed out it was the local landowner that took the time to replace them. Some of the field roads we maintain at our own expense. Please remember that next fall when you come to a muddy dirt road that maybe you could park the pickup and walk the ditch instead. Also don't forget to take care of the canada thistle in that ditch that belongs to you.
Click to expand...

Didn't old govenor Janklow want to put a stop to over weight trucks hauling grain on country roads. Who is paying to fix those roads. Don't we have a noxis weed program in this state. You have a thisle in your ditch, call the county extension agent.
 
sdditchpig said:
Didn't old govenor Janklow want to put a stop to over weight trucks hauling grain on country roads. Who is paying to fix those roads. Don't we have a noxis weed program in this state. You have a thisle in your ditch, call the county extension agent.
Click to expand...

Wild Bill was all over truckers on paved roads. I have never seen a truck weighed on a township road. There is some funding that comes from gas tax and some other sources, but the majority of what gets spent on township roads comes from taxes paid by township landowners. Also FEMA did help pay for repairs to roads last year. I don't want to fail to mention that, but I know of 3 township supervisors that donated time and equipment to repair roads. I think that is how it should be we are the ones who use them the most. There are roads that the township does not maintain. Those are left up to the people that use them. I think that is fine too. I am just asking for a little consideration when the roads are muddy. The attitude that they are our roads and we can use them for our personal mud run probably has more to do with poor hunter-landowner relations than anything else. As far as the weed board taking care of the the thistle, well they do what they can but that is kind of like asking Barney Fife to protect the southern boarder. That is my job too after all I am paying taxes on that land.
 
I don't know about anyone else but I guess I'm not willing to go to the mat over ditch hunting. We probably lost the lead shot issue years ago. I am also not anti-agriculture, big or small. I suggest there may be ways that we can make things work better, for everybody. Should we shelf discussion of any ideas which challenge the conventional status quo? Most farmland lost to us in the last 20 years was lost to development, sold off by a farm family for more money than it's possible to make with agriculture for both commercial and residential use, we see how that worked out! I'm sure those farm families were just as invested in their land as anyone else, but conditions forced their hand. As a clarification to my previous post, I find Iowa is now 14th poorest in water quality, as ranked by EPA, former score meaningless, skewed by a written "standards" issue. Many of us live in the midwest in states equally challenged and worse ranked. As to organizing farmers to deny access, my thought is they probably already do that now, which is why the ditch pig is in the ditch now!
 
haymaker said:
Wild Bill was all over truckers on paved roads. I have never seen a truck weighed on a township road. There is some funding that comes from gas tax and some other sources, but the majority of what gets spent on township roads comes from taxes paid by township landowners. Also FEMA did help pay for repairs to roads last year. I don't want to fail to mention that, but I know of 3 township supervisors that donated time and equipment to repair roads. I think that is how it should be we are the ones who use them the most. There are roads that the township does not maintain. Those are left up to the people that use them. I think that is fine too. I am just asking for a little consideration when the roads are muddy. The attitude that they are our roads and we can use them for our personal mud run probably has more to do with poor hunter-landowner relations than anything else. As far as the weed board taking care of the the thistle, well they do what they can but that is kind of like asking Barney Fife to protect the southern boarder. That is my job too after all I am paying taxes on that land.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry but I have never seen a dirt road in a township ever bladed by a farmer. I have seen torn up roads. It seems that most of the time, it dries up and the ruts just kind of work themselves out. Now about that thistle, that isn't your road ditch now, and I don,t know if want unautherized folks spraying 2-4-D in a publicly owned ditch. I thought Barney was watching the boarder.
 
I have never heard of or thought of organizing to deny access. I say yes or know depending on the situation. I believe that is what my neighbors do to. We do keep an eye on things for each other, but I have no right to tell someone they can or can't hunt on someone elses' land.
 
Haymaker, That suggestion was by Wirehairs. For the record I support your right to allow or disallow access as you see fit. All the best.
 
sdditchpig said:
I'm sorry but I have never seen a dirt road in a township ever bladed by a farmer. I have seen torn up roads. It seems that most of the time, it dries up and the ruts just kind of work themselves out. Now about that thistle, that isn't your road ditch now, and I don,t know if want unautherized folks spraying 2-4-D in a publicly owned ditch. I thought Barney was watching the boarder.
Click to expand...

It may not be my ditch but if I don't mow the weeds on it I am the one who gets in trouble. The township can come and mow the weeds and put the bill for that on MY taxes. If you would like to see a dirt road that is bladed by and maintained by landowners I can show them to you. We fill in the holes, level it off and blade it to shape it so the water runs off. Then after a soaking rain somebdy has to drive on it to see if his pickup can make it through.
 
haymaker said:
It may not be my ditch but if I don't mow the weeds on it I am the one who gets in trouble. The township can come and mow the weeds and put the bill for that on MY taxes. If you would like to see a dirt road that is bladed by and maintained by landowners I can show them to you. We fill in the holes, level it off and blade it to shape it so the water runs off. Then after a soaking rain somebdy has to drive on it to see if his pickup can make it through.
Click to expand...

Back to the lead shot issue. If the road hunter, cannot use lead, it is my proposal, that hunters on private land, stay 660 feet back from the road, or use steel, because I don't want lead to contaminate my ditch,I already have 2-4-d out there, and I'm afraid of the chemical reaction.
 
sdditchpig said:
Back to the lead shot issue. If the road hunter, cannot use lead, it is my proposal, that hunters on private land, stay 660 feet back from the road, or use steel, because I don't want lead to contaminate my ditch,I already have 2-4-d out there, and I'm afraid of the chemical reaction.
Click to expand...

Counter offer. How about if we agree to start hunting at the road and walk away from the road so that we are shooting in the other direction. That way we won't hit the road hunters that are waiting for the ones we miss.
 
I hunt in South Dakota every year. If they ban lead no big deal for me because I have to take nontoxic to hunt the state or federal land anyway. I have to agree with another poster about the attitudes by some on here about farmers. I have always allowed people to hunt when they ask, but with the way some talk about farmers I am starting to have second thoughts. I am seriously thinking of limiting it to family and close friends. This attitude of rich farmers raping the environment is getting to prevalent. I have overheard this same type of conversation among city hunters one too many times.
 
fsentkilr said:
I hunt in South Dakota every year. If they ban lead no big deal for me because I have to take nontoxic to hunt the state or federal land anyway. I have to agree with another poster about the attitudes by some on here about farmers. I have always allowed people to hunt when they ask, but with the way some talk about farmers I am starting to have second thoughts. I am seriously thinking of limiting it to family and close friends. This attitude of rich farmers raping the environment is getting to prevalent. I have overheard this same type of conversation among city hunters one too many times.
Click to expand...

I don't see this being as big of of deal. Isn't the ditch public land anyways? We have to use non tox on public land around my hometown, I don't see why the ditch should be any different? I don't think there is enough lead in the shot to do much, but it does build up.
 
That is a land owners right to allow or deny access to anyone for any reason. I have never once thought that I have a right to hunt private land, it is a great privilege to hunt any land public or private. And I don't have anything against a farmer trying to earn a good living. I have worked on my uncles far pruning and tying grape vines and believe me it is not easy work. But I believe the Bible tells us to be stewards of the land.

So I pose this question. How many more acres of prarie must we lose to the plow before the prarie chicken ceases to exist? How much more over grazing can the great basin handle before it becomes a cheat grass wasteland and only the leks remember the strutting of a sage grouse? How many more damns and diversions can our rivers take before the only salmon we eat is farm raised? How many more marshes can be tiled before the sandhill crane is just a bird on a page of a book? How many briars can be pulled before the quail whistles his last song?

To paraphrase Aldo Leopold "Poor land can be rich country, and vice versa."
 
fsentkilr said:
I hunt in South Dakota every year. If they ban lead no big deal for me because I have to take nontoxic to hunt the state or federal land anyway. I have to agree with another poster about the attitudes by some on here about farmers. I have always allowed people to hunt when they ask, but with the way some talk about farmers I am starting to have second thoughts. I am seriously thinking of limiting it to family and close friends. This attitude of rich farmers raping the environment is getting to prevalent. I have overheard this same type of conversation among city hunters one too many times.
Click to expand...

There are people out there that are trying to end road hunting. That is their objective. This is not about lead shot. This is not about rich farmers. This is about people looking for another way to impose their will as they see fit. You want to shut your land down, go ahead. It's my opinion that you are looking for a reason anyway. I for one don't grab my ankels for anyone. I'm just happy that the snowgeese are comming in, and I don't have to put on a fake smile, and knock on some strangers door to kill one. Happy in the ditch for now.
 
sdditchpig said:
There are people out there that are trying to end road hunting. That is their objective. This is not about lead shot. This is not about rich farmers. This is about people looking for another way to impose their will as they see fit. You want to shut your land down, go ahead. It's my opinion that you are looking for a reason anyway. I for one don't grab my ankels for anyone. I'm just happy that the snowgeese are comming in, and I don't have to put on a fake smile, and knock on some strangers door to kill one. Happy in the ditch for now.
Click to expand...

I don't know where you live but if you want to hunt spring snow geese, come on down. I don't know when they will be here or how long they will stay. We had a lot of prevented planting last year so there is not as much feed as usual.
 
Let's clarify the road ditch ownership. The public does not own the road ditch. The land owner owns to the center of the road and pays property tax to the center of the road. The ditch is public right away. Which gives access to the ditch. The landowner is responsible for weed control, mowing according to township ordinance, and keeping the trees from growing up in the ditch.

As far as changing agriculture, I think what would be good for all of us is if people who didn't physical own or buy and use commodities couldn't trade them on paper. Think if we actually used supply and demand for Crude Oil for example. We have no shortage of crude right now, but because people can buy it on paper, the price has went wild and is screwing us all. Same thing with crops, to many people own paper drive the price up beyond what it is really worth. Which in turns drives up the price of land, fertilizer, equipment, ect. The world needs alot of food, but when the traders drive the price up to far it isn't good for anyone long term, because a lot of people get caught on the wrong end when the traders pull out, and the price comes crashing down. The traders pull out because the fake demand they create actually causes real user to quit and now there is a real lack of demand and the prices spiral down.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top