Possible Lead shot Ban

Marty Vanderploeg, lives about a mile straight east of Tut Hill. He does not farm, he has established a wildlife sanctuary on his property. Lacreek refuge, is across the road. The road ditches are mowed to about three inches, and he has put up a woven wire fence, so if you legally shoot a goose, or pheasant, from the right of way, it is impossable to retreive it, if it falls on his property. I have never seen anyone hunting that property. He has a lot of birds.

Like I said.He is just one of those types. Now just avoid him and he will shut up. Which is what he should do any way. Thats great he takes care of wild life, refuge and all. But harassing the rest of the world is none of his business. Some just think they own the world. little Hittlers.:D
 
Marty Vanderploeg, lives about a mile straight east of Tut Hill. He does not farm, he has established a wildlife sanctuary on his property. Lacreek refuge, is across the road. The road ditches are mowed to about three inches, and he has put up a woven wire fence, so if you legally shoot a goose, or pheasant, from the right of way, it is impossable to retreive it, if it falls on his property. I have never seen anyone hunting that property. He has a lot of birds.

The truth is now known. Lead shot has nothing to do with his motive. He hates anybody hunting near his place. The birds in the ditch belongs to him he thinks.
 
LOL, we did just fine with smaller farms and hoes when I grew up. We farmed 360 acres with that and your back.

I tell you what, next summer you come show me how to get rid of leafy spurge with a hoe. I will provide the hoe. I am talking about the ones with a wooden handle. While your here I could stand a lesson on hoeing out canada thistle too.
 
I would like to go back to the old ways of the hoe. Maybe all those farmers who can barely fit in the cab would be a lot more thankful. Not too many guys would be farming 5000 acres.
 
I would like to go back to the old ways of the hoe. Maybe all those farmers who can barely fit in the cab would be a lot more thankful. Not too many guys would be farming 5000 acres.

I get just enough hoeing from my garden. Believe it or not I do miss hauling bales. It probably wouldn't take too long to get over that.
 
My my how anti-farming this website has become, well expect for the guy who raises free-range hogs in the woods guys seem to like him. It might come as a shock to some that the reason farmers are in the business is to make money not raise birds for hunters to shoot.
 
I have a lot of farmer friend and one of my uncles is a farmer so I am very sympathetic to their need to make a living. At the same time I see a need for farming practices that are both profitable and sustainable. A balance that creates healthy farms and a healthy ecosystem. I am said to say that the central valley is grossly over farmed to the point of unsustainability. Like some one else mentioned my home, the valley, is one harsh drought away from a dust bowl.:( The most fertile soil in the world is being over worked and now requires far to much input to turn back now. I hope you guys never see what we have here.
 
I don't think anyone here is anti-farmer. But to paraphrase it's also amazing how anti hunter some farmers are as well. We all used to be on the same page, ruralists, farmers, hunters who appreciate the rural life, we all used to look on each other with at least benign acceptance and tolerance. Tolerance being the fastest disappearing quality in America. Disappearing much faster in the cities than small town, and rural America. Just because some here advocate for change, from a non sustainable and subsidized sytem, to a system which allows us all, farmers, and consumers who share the enviornment alike to move into a mutual, sustainable, and long term profitable future. My client farmers, especially livestock farmers, are struggling mightly,right now, have been for some time. It wasn't so long ago corn was 3.00, might not be long before it is again, does that future seem profitable to you? If we don't speak up here for what matters to pheasant hunters, where do we do it? Last time I looked this was the Pheasant Hunters Forum, not Modern Farming Today. Suprisingly, many modern farming practices are directly opposed to the welfare of pheasants, and in the long run human beings, likely, even the human beings doing the farming. A future devoid of wildlife, a monoculture of moonscape, with water we have to spend millions to treat in order to drink, rapidly spiralling consumer food costs, every farmer a slave to debt on green paint, and outrageous inputs from Agri-giant consortiums which patent seed, lifeforms, and pesticides/herbicides developed by our public supported Universities. If this is the future your darn right I want to change it.
 
I don't think anyone here is anti-farmer. But to paraphrase it's also amazing how anti hunter some farmers are as well. We all used to be on the same page, ruralists, farmers, hunters who appreciate the rural life, we all used to look on each other with at least benign acceptance and tolerance. Tolerance being the fastest disappearing quality in America. Disappearing much faster in the cities than small town, and rural America. Just because some here advocate for change, from a non sustainable and subsidized sytem, to a system which allows us all, farmers, and consumers who share the enviornment alike to move into a mutual, sustainable, and long term profitable future. My client farmers, especially livestock farmers, are struggling mightly,right now, have been for some time. It wasn't so long ago corn was 3.00, might not be long before it is again, does that future seem profitable to you? If we don't speak up here for what matters to pheasant hunters, where do we do it? Last time I looked this was the Pheasant Hunters Forum, not Modern Farming Today. Suprisingly, many modern farming practices are directly opposed to the welfare of pheasants, and in the long run human beings, likely, even the human beings doing the farming. A future devoid of wildlife, a monoculture of moonscape, with water we have to spend millions to treat in order to drink, rapidly spiralling consumer food costs, every farmer a slave to debt on green paint, and outrageous inputs from Agri-giant consortiums which patent seed, lifeforms, and pesticides/herbicides developed by our public supported Universities. If this is the future your darn right I want to change it.

Great post OaN :10sign: I could go on and on about environmental atrocities that came from "progress" but I won't. Let's remember our past and the plight of the heath hen and passenger pidgeon lest we have to relearn the lessons they taught us.
 
That was very eloquent O&N. I just happen to differ with your opinion. Livestock producers are still able to lock in a profit even with high commodity prices. The great evil of the world "Big-Ag" brought us RR crops which are much better for the environment than the chemicals used in the so call "glory days" of farming, Round-Up has no residual effect compared to chemicals of the past. Farmers take out fences because they have no use any more, not because they hate hunters or wildlife. Farmers need to make a profit just like anyone else does. They use the most efficient ways possible to make those ends meet.

All of those who complain about modern agriculture practices I ask you this. Do you buy any of your food at supermarkets? Do you enjoy having the lowest food cost of the modern world? Do you like your 99 cent double cheese burger, I think they taste like crap but do eat a few? If you do it is because of the great evil of modern Ag which provides these to you.

It would be interesting to see someone describe in detail the farming system that they in vision in there mines eye that would be both environmentally friendly and economically feasible. Or is it just pie in the sky?

I am now going to drink a beer brewed from barley that I am sure was grown in an unsustainable way that is sending the world to its ultimate destruction. :cheers:
 
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That was very eloquent O&N. I just happen to differ with your opinion. Livestock producers are still able to lock in a profit even with high commodity prices. The great evil of the world "Big-Ag" brought us RR crops which are much better for the environment than the chemicals used in the so call "glory days" of farming, Round-Up has no residual effect compared to chemicals of the past. Farmers take out fences because they have no use any more, not because they hate hunters or wildlife. Farmers need to make a profit just like anyone else does. They use the most efficient ways possible to make those ends meet.

All of those who complain about modern agriculture practices I ask you this. Do you buy any of your food at supermarkets? Do you enjoy having the lowest food cost of the modern world? Do you like your 99 cent double cheese burger, I think they taste like crap but do eat a few? If you do it is because of the great evil of modern Ag which provides these to you.

It would be interesting to see someone describe in detail the farming system that they in vision in there mines eye that would be both environmentally friendly and economically feasible. Or is it just pie in the sky?

I am now going to drink a beer brewed from barley that I am sure was grown in an unsustainable way that is sending the world to its ultimate destruction. :cheers:

Moe does your quality of life come from that 99 cent double cheese burger or your cheap budweiser? Mine doesnt, mine comes from being able to enjoy my passion which is the outdoors.

The next time you eat an almond, pistachio, walnut, raisin, table grape, cherry, orange, tangerine, grapefruit, peach, necterine, plum, apricot, kiwi, strawberry, cantoloupe, asparagus, artichoke, lettuce, garlic, onion, rice, dairy product, chicken, turkey, beef, or wear a cotton shirt thank California for plundering its natural resources for you to have it so cheap. And believe me I left a lot of other products off that list.
 
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Moe does your quality of life come from that 99 cent double cheese burger or your cheap budweiser? Mine doesnt, mine comes from being able to enjoy my passion which is the outdoors.

Actually I have recently discovered Ayinger Celebrator Double Bock which is $3 a bottle. :cheers:

My problem is that everyone seems to address the issues of modern farming under the premise that the producer does not care about the land. Every farmer that I know wants the ability to pass there operation down to there next of kin. They can only do that if they believe what they are doing is sustainable. That is what they strive for. I do not agree with all of my neighbors farming practices but I do believe that there feelings are in there minds for the best.
 
My minds eye, pie in the sky, perfect world farm would be one that doesn't dry up rivers or natural basins, that doesn't drain wetlands, that conserves top soil, that needs minimal inputs, and still earns a farmer a honest living without the need for subsidies. Why do we have to feed the world at the expense of mother nature?
 
Since this was originally about lead shot in public right of ways, let me ask this question. How important is road hunting to the people here?
 
Since this was originally about lead shot in public right of ways, let me ask this question. How important is road hunting to the people here?

Honestly? Not at all important. But then again I have never hunted in SD. Doesn't SD talk about how much public access they have? Does that acreage # include road right of ways? If I do come out there to hunt someday I'll stay out of the ditches since I've heard to many stories of irate land owners hassleing legal hunters.
 
I for one don't have any desire to road hunt, honestly I can't believe it's legal anywhere. As to farmers and enviornmental concerns, I believe their concern ends where another extra bushel of corn picks up, all gains in farming were either economically advantageous to farmers, or forced on them by USDA decree, which prohibited certain practices at economic gunpoint. No participation, no government program safety net. This makes them proud card carrying citizens, just like you, me, the auto industry, the power companies, mining concerns, and all other heavy industries. I'm sure the previous generation that plowed us into the dust bowl believed they could farm sustainably too! Explain, if Iowa farmiing is sustanable why is Iowa #1with a bullet in poor water quality. In the top 5 in soil erosion. Eventually this affects everyone's quality of life. Food has been cheap, in relative terms because the government policy since the depression has been to subsidize farmers, and all middle men in the food chain, like trucking, to keep it that way. Not because of any noble sacrifice by a farmer. A well fed citizenry is a placid and content citizenry, willing to vote the status qou. We have spent that capital forward, now it's gone. Food is spiralling up without any ceiling, food safety is now an issue. We can now all look forward expensive food, expensive fuel, expensive, dirty, water, dangerous air quality, and a lower overall standard of living because this entire economic system, from farming to the assembly worker is not sustainable at this level. It's a bitter pill. Your ag giant saviors are now marketing to the world, one third of our beef is imported now. Row crop farmers around the world will create surpluses which on again,off again tank the commodity market, land prices will collapse again like the late 70's, early 80's. If I lived in the hot zone of Illinois, Iowa, I'd sell in a heart beat at these prices. I'll bet within 10 years you can buy it back cheaper. Don't believe it? Check out the housing market, or commercial real estate. High land cost is a national curse, because it creates more pressure to wring more out of every corner of every acre. The previous generation of farmers was not under that kind of pressure, had lower expense, nearly no debt, and lower expectations in lifestyle. It's a lesson all of us, personally, whatever we do, should get comfortable with, like it not.
 
Funny how a thread about lead shot can take a turn to how Agriculture is the evil empire. Since so many of "you" hunters out there think what I do is so evil and I am purposley destroying the earth, I may have to start an anti acess movement with every landowner/farmer I know. I don't really see the need to let anyone hunt who thinks me or my peers are the evil empire, dead set on destroying mankind. I suppose we can switch to the way some of you want and cut our production in half. Then between spending 3 times as much food as you ever have and $3.51 a gallon for gas, you should have all kinds of money left over for recreation like hunting pheasants.
This country doesn't have hardly any manufacturing anymore. We don't make anything here anymore. I think we should be more concerned that the USA is a service based economy now, and how unsustainable that is. Agriculture is the only industry we have to export anymore. I am not going to lie to anyone, there is a tremendous amount of money to be made in agriculture. The world is going to need more food in the next 50 years than it needed in the last 2000 combined. As far the grain markets up and downs, it has more to do with fund buying and selling by "banker/stockbroker" types than it has to do with real supply and demand anymore. Those big $.30 moves in the corn market a day or $.60 in soybeans have nothing to do with actual production agriculture and everything to do with the funds taking profit.
 
One more fun fact for you guys. In 1980 there was roughly 300 million acres farmed in the USA, today it is roughly 220 million. 80 million acres lost in 30 years. Roughly 30 million enrolled in CRP still leaves 50 million lost to other factors.
 
O&N it is sad that you have such a lack of faith in Humanity.

You are correct land prices will correct themselves. Univ of Ill predicts a 1% increase in interest rates will cause a 10-20% drop in land prices just as it did in the past.

Were do find that IA is #1 in water pollution?
 
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