NRA - Why or Why Not?

[cheesy]

Wow, am I ever late to the party.

-The Second Amendment has nothing to do with your right to carry a Purdy SxS in the pheasant fields. Its about the people being able to fight against the government, something the founding fathers couldn't do when they lived across the pond.

-Its not a damned assault rifle. Its a semi-automatic firearm, that operates the same as my Beretta 391 or your Remington 1100.

-If you think that the far left is just going to take the 'assault' rifles and leave your fancy O/U's alone, you're an idiot. You might not have a need for an AR-15 with a 30 round clip, but as soon as they get those banned, they'll keep working up the line. Give them an inch and they're going to take a mile. Their goal is to completely disarm the world. That includes your kids H&R singleshot .410.

-If you're not with us, you're against us. Look at the big picture people, its not hard to see.

 

[Uncle Buck]

I am a member, but I don't like them at all. I have no love for the NRA after "Ruby Ridge". They were wrong......Bob

What do you mean by this comment? At Ruby Ridge the first two parties to die were a Lab, a wife and mother. The husband ultimately won in court! They had no business proceeding as they did. The ATF-- BLUNDERING FOOLS.HOW ABOUT THE " WALK THRU " GUNS TO MEXICO?

 

[Uncle Buck]

New Orleans post Katrina.

And a huge number of individual cases. Come on J-bros. Deny it.

 

[NCKHusker]

What do you mean by this comment? At Ruby Ridge the first two parties to die were a Lab, a wife and mother. The husband ultimately won in court! They had no business proceeding as they did. The ATF-- BLUNDERING FOOLS.HOW ABOUT THE " WALK THRU " GUNS TO MEXICO?

The shooting at At Ruby Ridge... you forgot about the 10 year old boy.

They shot the dog, then sprayed the kid up his back with a machine gun as he tried to run away, then they shot the mom in the head as she stood in the door holding her 10 month old daughter. The government was so far out of line on that it is scary. The U.S.A had to pay millions to the family after it was all settle in court.

Yes the family was fanatical but all they wanted to was mind their own business. I have heard a U.S. Marshall say from his own mouths that it was wrong and he would have never believed that his fellow agents could be capable of what they did at Ruby Ridge.

 

[cheesy]

The shooting at At Ruby Ridge... you forgot about the 10 year old boy.

They shot the dog, then sprayed the kid up his back with a machine gun as he tried to run away, then they shot the mom in the head as she stood in the door holding her 10 month old daughter. The government was so far out of line on that it is scary. The U.S.A had to pay millions to the family after it was all settle in court.

Yes the family was fanatical but all they wanted to was mind their own business. I have heard a U.S. Marshall say from his own mouths that it was wrong and he would have never believed that his fellow agents could be capable of what they did at Ruby Ridge.

I might be mis-remembering, and welcome a correction if so-

Wasn't the whole premise that .gov knew Randy Weaver was an extremist, but didn't have any dirt on him. One of the ATF agents approached him and asked if Randy could supply him a shotgun with a barrel of 17 inches (or slightly under what is legal, 18" isn't it?). Weaver supplied the shortened barrel, so ATF brought all the firepower they could find to take the 'criminal' down.

Again, if that is incorrect, I welcome a correction, going off what I read, in extremist magazines and websites.

 

[NCKHusker]

I might be mis-remembering, and welcome a correction if so-

Wasn't the whole premise that .gov knew Randy Weaver was an extremist, but didn't have any dirt on him. One of the ATF agents approached him and asked if Randy could supply him a shotgun with a barrel of 17 inches (or slightly under what is legal, 18" isn't it?). Weaver supplied the shortened barrel, so ATF brought all the firepower they could find to take the 'criminal' down.

Again, if that is incorrect, I welcome a correction, going off what I read, in extremist magazines and websites.

That is how the story goes from all I have read, heard, and watched etc. The reason they wanted dirt on him in the first place is because the gov. asked him to be an undercover agent in some of the militia groups he was around as a fringe participant. He told them "No" and told all the militia groups that the feds were trying to recruit narcs. He basically blew the whistle on the gov and they didn't like it. That is why he became a target in the first place. He made the wrong people mad so they set him up.

Yes, he broke the law. Shooting a kid in the back and his wife in the head while she held a baby is an illogical escalation of events.

If you want to watch a documentary on the incident and make up your own mind there are several on youtube. Just type in "Ruby Ridge" and decide for yourself.

I want to be clear that I am no fan of Randy Weaver and his beliefs. However, his story shows how the government can and will chose it's own agenda over the rights and freedoms of any individual.

Do any of us really think we are that important to the powers that be? Do we really think they truly care about what we care about and will stop at nothing to help us protect it?

 

[oldandnew]

Don't forget Waco. Janet Reno even used tanks! Seems like after the dust settled there wasn't a whole lot of real evidence that justified that over the top response. Could have arrested the ringleader queitly anytime in Waco, away from the compound. Instead a military assualt on US citizens. Whether or not we agreed with these people in both cases, we can all agree that neither incident should have happened. made the so called radical fringe look sane, in the end their supposed, delusional fears were proven out.

 

[siouxcitysmitty]

As you're considering your support for the NRA, be sure to read the other thread on this forum regarding the proposed lead ban.

In addition to the NRA's support of semi-auto's and big clips that some on this thread seem to have such a problem with, the NRA can be counted on to fight all these chicken-$hit ammo bans, ammo-taxes, ammo-castrations, etc.

Don't sit around with-holding your support just because the govt hasn't come after anything you care about yet...cuz if you're on this site, you're kidding yourself if you don't think the anti-gun crowd has your hunting/firearm passions in their cross hairs.

 

[CRP]

The biggest problem with the aftermath of Ruby Ridge was a judge not allowing Lon Horiuchi (sniper) to be charged in court with killing that "unarmed" mother holding a baby in her arms. Thus, once again, the feds are allowed to be above the law.

The NRA is FAR from perfect, but I can't imagine who would fight for our 2A rights if they were not around.

 

[Jeremy1]

I might be mis-remembering, and welcome a correction if so-

Wasn't the whole premise that .gov knew Randy Weaver was an extremist, but didn't have any dirt on him. One of the ATF agents approached him and asked if Randy could supply him a shotgun with a barrel of 17 inches (or slightly under what is legal, 18" isn't it?). Weaver supplied the shortened barrel, so ATF brought all the firepower they could find to take the 'criminal' down.

Again, if that is incorrect, I welcome a correction, going off what I read, in extremist magazines and websites.

What is Extremist about wanting to be left alone?

Or Not wanting public education? Or Rap Music and Pop culture decay? Schooling Indoctrination? No Bailouts for criminal Banksters? Taxation without representation?
Or Not believing the Federal Reserve is a legal entity or in the best interests of America (US Dollar has declined 95% Since 1913)?

You throw that word out there, just like the media does. Our own founding fathers were considered extremists..
It bothers me.. and those that use it carelessly.

Randy Weaver did shorten a barrel but it was still within the legal limits and over 1 inch from the prohibited length, he was later vindicated in court.
But his family was Slaughtered.


Bottom Line:
Gun Control is not about guns, its about Control.
It works...Just ask Josef Stalin, Pol Pot, Idi Amin.

Russia killed 66 Million Christians from 1917-1949, there was gun control imposed there and all grain and livestock was confiscated. The sterile sounding word was collectivization which means..we take your stuff, you go to work camps and are free slave labor.
Not bad for a $20 Million investment from Jacob Schiff, take over of all of Russia.

"And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family?
Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, polkers, or whatever else was at hand?
- Aleksandr Isayevich Solzhenitsyn, The Gulag Archipelago: 1918-1956
Nobel and Pulitzer Prize winner, 10 years in the Gulag.

 

[sneem]

If you own a gun and don't belong to the NRA, you are just a leech. Sit back, whine about the NRA and watch while others do the heavy lifting. The NRA and AARP are the two most respected lobbying groups in Washington. When the NRA speaks, the politicians listen. The NRA is not about hunting, or land ownership or taxation. They are about you being able to keep your guns. It is a never ending fight. Nobody, not the Second Amendment Foundation or anybody, has the clout or ability to keep the likes of Schumer and Boxer at bay.
If you own a gun and wish to keep it, the NRA is the best and only vehicle that can actually make that happen. Don't donate, give money to the second tier gun rights groups or expect Ducks Unlimited to protect you guns? Don't worry. Be happy.

 

[Labman]

AMEN Hen Hen Rooster!!!!!!

Dang, I'm SKEERED to wade into this ruckus - might get waylaid Daniel Boone style with a "one-shot/one-kill" muzzleloader or scattergun, riddled full of holes w/a class III, or blasted into oblivion w/a 50 cal!!!

Feel free to fire away after I'm done - as usual some good points being made on all sides, but I for one simply do not have the luxury of time to get drug/bogged-down into in an endless tit-for-tat...

My measly two cents:
The 2nd amendment has far more to do with those "crazy" self-defense militia types some of you are talking about, rather than hunting - it says absolutely NOTHING about a sportsman's right to carry genteel arms for the purpose of pursuing wildlife, but rather something-something about a "well armed militia" (written with an Englandesque version of Hitler, Stalin, ect. lingering fresh in mind)...ALL of us gun owners (hunters included - especially of helpless little birds, rabbits & cute bambi) are increasingly portrayed as a bunch of bloodthirsty psycos, extremists & killers by a subtly brainwashed & softie, pie-in-the-sky society. "A Kingdom Divided Against Itself" hurling accusations at each other of what is appropriate/acceptable according to each of our own personal taste or standards is of little help to our cause as fellow gun owners.

My weigh-in for the record: I own brown guns, black guns & itty-bitty ones with pearly white handles. I am a member of the NRA solely because of their clearly-stated primary mission/goal of protecting our 2nd amendment right for citizens to bear arms period - even though I do not like many of their current approach/PR-tactics any more than some of you (and I do hope they are watching/listening-to/taking-note-of this kind of chatter from their constituents). But I wholeheartedly agree with their bottom-line & unwavering mission! Do not think 4 a NY millisecond that some of the "loonies" on the other side of the aisle have in mind stopping @ "assault rifles" & high capacity mags if they can ever manage to get their foot firmly wedged in the crack in the door.

Remember: A "fanatic" or "extremist" is nothing more than someone who happens to be a little too excited about something that you or I are either "radically" opposed to or don't give a rat's-@$$ about...God bless the USA, where at least for now we are all still free to be so passionate/expressive in our wildly disparaging positions!!! :cheers:

 

[still_steamn]

heck yes!

Of course I am an NRA member. If you want to own any gun whatsoever, you need to be an NRA member. I used to think AR-15 type rifles were a little extreme, but like anything else after exposure to them they are just another gun. If you want to let them take away folks' AR-15's then be prepared to give up your 11-87, Benelli shotgun, and your dad's Browning BAR hunting rifle as well. What's the difference? Not much.

I'm hearing that Obama is getting ready to try an end-around Congress for making all us gun owners outlaws by issuing a presidential "executive order", just as he made an end-around all of us citizens by cramming Obama-care through Congress when not a single Congressman or Senator had read what was in it.

 

[grouchyolddude]

Of course I am an NRA member. If you want to own any gun whatsoever, you need to be an NRA member. I used to think AR-15 type rifles were a little extreme, but like anything else after exposure to them they are just another gun. If you want to let them take away folks' AR-15's then be prepared to give up your 11-87, Benelli shotgun, and your dad's Browning BAR hunting rifle as well. What's the difference? Not much.

I'm hearing that Obama is getting ready to try an end-around Congress for making all us gun owners outlaws by issuing a presidential "executive order", just as he made an end-around all of us citizens by cramming Obama-care through Congress when not a single Congressman or Senator had read what was in it.

obammy speaks without a teleprompter... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHM7UHoqeDk&feature=youtu.be
:laugh::laugh:

 

[Dakotazeb]

If you own a gun and don't belong to the NRA, you are just a leech. Sit back, whine about the NRA and watch while others do the heavy lifting. The NRA and AARP are the two most respected lobbying groups in Washington. When the NRA speaks, the politicians listen. The NRA is not about hunting, or land ownership or taxation. They are about you being able to keep your guns. It is a never ending fight. Nobody, not the Second Amendment Foundation or anybody, has the clout or ability to keep the likes of Schumer and Boxer at bay.
If you own a gun and wish to keep it, the NRA is the best and only vehicle that can actually make that happen. Don't donate, give money to the second tier gun rights groups or expect Ducks Unlimited to protect you guns? Don't worry. Be happy.

I realize you are entitled to your opinions but I take exception to being called a "leech". There are quite a number of us on this site that are not members of the NRA and we have our reasons. I also am not a member of AARP (I'm 65 years old) because I take exception to there stand on a number of issues. Just watch the name calling!!

 

[CRP]

To those non-NRA members that think the SCOTUS is their savior, you better think again. Because none of the GOP candidates will stand up and be counted, many folks think that Bam Bam will be re-elected. If that happens, he might have the chance to put two leftist anti-gunners on the bench. If you recall, all of the recent SCOTUS "gun" decisions have been a 5-4 split. If you are smart enough to do the math, the 5-4 "for" decision could become a 4-5 or 3-6 loser!

Are you ready to join now???

 

[Dakotazeb]

I'll join as soon as the NRA quits sending members a ton of useless $hit in the mail. I figure the cost of all the mailing each year far exceeded my dues. That's why I am no longer a member. Not that I don't believe in the cause.

 

[CRP]

I don't like all of the mailings or Wayne LP's salary either, but feel the cause trumps my gripes.

 

[oldandnew]

I am politically independent, I like to think for myself, speak for myself, and stand up for myself. I resist leftist radical mantras, as well as the fear mongering extreme right. I would not propose to be your leader, or example, tell you how to live or what to believe, nor will I be told by Obama, the Tea Party, the NRA, or any of you. Our politicians should vote based upon a belief of whats right for their constituents and the entire country as well. I realize this is influenced by lobbists both to the advantage of causes we may believe in, as well as causes we may most decidedly not believe in. It's wrong, it exists, and has existed since ancient Greece, and probably before. All paid hired professional lobbists should be banned, period. Nothing more than corrupting influence peddlers. Dollars for votes. Possible solutions may be strict term limits for all political positions, and no cushy lobbiest job when you retire. Make the decisions of the day based on merit of the debate, go home, where you came from, not retire with a lifetime pension in Palm Springs, and become a contributing member of your community. Make it political service, not a destination dream job. We just might get better people, better decisions, and representation as concieved by our forefathers, something we haven't seen since the last of the original signers passed from the scene. The political PAC's won't invest millions in a guy with a 4 year term. Just because one lobby or another happens to espouse a cause we embrace, does nothing to mitigate the fact that professional lobbying is no different than buying votes outside the local election polling place. two equally bad acts do not make a righteous outcome. As stated by Eugene Debs, in 1920, "I would not lead you to Utopia, because if you would follow me there, you would follow someone else out! You must find your own way". I commend everyone here on the well thought out positions expressed, one position we can all support, is freedom of speech, it is the debate which moves us forward. Ironically a right threatened occasionally through history, by our own government, and courts, as well.

 

[grouchyolddude]

I'll join as soon as the NRA quits sending members a ton of useless $hit in the mail. I figure the cost of all the mailing each year far exceeded my dues. That's why I am no longer a member. Not that I don't believe in the cause.

Do what I did. Simply request that you be taken off of their mailing lists. Worked perfect.