CRP Haying Scenario - Right or Wrong?

haymaker said:
So as a landowner I book a hunt in December, guys show up with their German Shorthairs and the high for the day is -15 degrees and the wind is blowing 25 mph. They say we can't hunt in this and want some kind of compensation. Am I responsible for the weather? Likewise am I responsible to assure hunters that if a drought comes that they won't be affected? I have spent all the money on seed, chemical, planting plus tied up the land so I have made the investment should I be responsible for the weather and refund there money? Who is going to refund mine?
Click to expand...

I'm with you...
 
I agree about the weather but if someone books with you expecting 700 and get 350 that's a different story. When they booked the 700 was implied as huntible lands. The weather is not under someone's control. The grass getting cut is under someone's control. If I'm paying for something I want what I paid for, not half. If I choose not to hunt because the weather is crap, that's on me. In truth it really doesn't affect me because I don't pay anyone to hunt since I have plenty of relatives and friends as well as public land knowledge.
 
If I booked a hotel room and the place burned down, I might want a refund.

If I hired a stripper and.., well never mind about that.
 
The hotel room is a good example. Say you book a room with two beds because there are enough people that you warrant having two beds. Then you arrive at the hotel to find only a single bed and the the hotel informs you that they knew you booked two beds but that now they only have single bed rooms. Would you not want a discount or an additional room? And to top it off they're going to charge you the same rate for the single as the double.
 
Quite frankly, i have seen lots of groups come and go...not with me personally, but I know plenty of farmers that do pay to hunt stuff for the first 3-4 weeks of the season. Most of these groups have about one dog per every 4 hunters, sometimes less. They aren't looking to walk 8-12+ miles per day in switchgrass, cattails, etc. They usually have food plots set up for them. If half the grass was cut, from 750 acres to 375 acres, it would help their hunting...concentrate the birds more. If this outfit caters to more serious hunters who have a dog or two per hunter, then the landowner better call them. It is quite likely that he could strip some corn and leave it for a month longer than he had planned, and create some really good hunting for groups that may not have as much dog power and who don't want to hunt all day. I have no idea what kind of hunters he caters to. My guess is that each group probably has at least one guy that is somewhat of a pheasant nerd, who reads about what is going on, talks to farmers, etc. The word will get out to them when the brood count survey comes out...my newspaper in duluth mn has a blurb every year right after that comes out...if the guys ended up out there without knowing, and they had to do some scouting in the am and find some spots to supplement what they already have, I would guess it would add a dimension to their hunt...yes, they may indeed be justified in being a bit mad...whatever. new scenario, please!
 
Good points.

The number of birds probably won't be reduced much, but would be concentrated.

But adjustments should be made, the farmer made a decision based on his best interest.
 
David0311

McFarmer said:
Frequently here folks talk about pitching in and helping the farmer out, has anyone actually done that ? I mean, it's a good intention and all, but as a farmer I can't think of anything I would allow someone to walk onto the place and do.

Maybe mow the lawn.
Click to expand...

Yes--

Over the years I have--

Run the grain cart-- and loaded the semi's-with up to three but usually two combines working the fields
Helped repair fences
Moved cattle from summer pastures to home place-over some long distances
Helped with vaccination of new cattle
Hauled bales
And ran for parts from the farm to wherever parts were available
Among any thing else I could do to help out
Put in some long hours and days when help was needed--gladly
 
Just drove thru eastern SD and to the farm. I noticed the CREP was hayed for the most part. What this means is the 85,000 acres of CREP open to public hunting is being hayed at 50% resulting in what will be 42,500 acres roughly. This is certainly "right" because within the contractual bounds of CREP.

May make some hunting easier but some folks will surely be shocked and the reduction in cover.

Another way to look at this is say SD has 1 million acres of CRP. Now only 500,000 is huntable from emergency haying. Hmmm. Interesting.
 
david0311 said:
Yes--

Over the years I have--

Run the grain cart-- and loaded the semi's-with up to three but usually two combines working the fields
Helped repair fences
Moved cattle from summer pastures to home place-over some long distances
Helped with vaccination of new cattle
Hauled bales
And ran for parts from the farm to wherever parts were available
Among any thing else I could do to help out
Put in some long hours and days when help was needed--gladly
Click to expand...

Pretty much exactly the same experience with my group. We have done all those things...and hosted dinners as well. It's just the right thing to do. IMO.
 
Failure of crp

McFarmer said:
CRP as originally conceived is a soil conservation and water quality program. Those benifits are achieved, as are the ones related to nesting habitat when limited haying takes place. The benifits to society is certainly reduced somewhat however.

Heck, the Iowa DNR has ground they take hay off of, land they lease out to producers to graze and land they grow row crops on.

I have always had a considerable (for me) of ground I raise hay on, and I have some CRP. I didn't take any hay off the CRP because I didn't need the forage. I offered it to some South Dakota ranchers but the trucking costs were prohibitive.
Click to expand...

Not sure how CRP was conceived, but I know wildlife habitat is listed as one of the three primary purposes.
I agree lands need to be managed, but I think all will agree cutting and grazing starting in April in some areas is not management, when habitat is already slim due to dry conditions. I think CRP is sold as beneficial to everyone, but really is meant to buy votes from Agriculture in early voting states. Just another wasteful use of my money.
 
Actually you do burn, graze, or mow early to cut down the cool season grasses. Cool season grasses are not what is desired in CRP fields but will out compete the warm season grasses by starting to grow earlier. Cool season grasses provided little in cover or help to wildlife so eliminating it is best. The best way to so that is early so the warm season grasses can come through. In essence you sacrifice one season for the success of the next four or five.
 
If we have 24,000,000 acres enrolled nationwide currently at an average annual rate of $150/acre (could be more, could be less), the cost is 3.6 billion annually...if we have 50 million taxpayers (could be more, could be less), than those of us who actually pay any federal tax are shelling out $72 annually for this. $6/month. For the experiences I have had over my 27 years of hunting in the Dakota's, I would pay a lot more than that. But I only speak for myself. Again, my #'s could be way off...but I think I am in the ballpark.
 
I looked it up...we spend 2.1 billion for fiscal year 2018 on CRP...24 million acres...average rate is about $88 per acre...that is two-tenths of one percent of our federal outlay. That is $2 out of every $1,000 that you owe the federal government....
 
Last edited:
benelli-banger said:
I looked it up...we spend 2.1 billion for fiscal year 2018 on CRP...24 million acres...average rate is about $88 per acre...I suspect that that represents about 2% of our federal outlay, which is about a trillion...I did the math, I am spending a lot more than $72/year...but I am very OK with that.
Click to expand...

Nice work BB gun! Seems like once we get facts in order on issues good things happen. CRP will carry its weight.
 
I stand corrected...2.1 billion represents .2% of our budget...two-tenths of one percent...NOT two percent like I said...so for every $10,000 of federal taxes you owe, CRP is $20....less than a case of bad beer!!!
 
benelli-banger said:
If we have 24,000,000 acres enrolled nationwide currently at an average annual rate of $150/acre (could be more, could be less), the cost is 3.6 billion annually...if we have 50 million taxpayers (could be more, could be less), than those of us who actually pay any federal tax are shelling out $72 annually for this. $6/month. For the experiences I have had over my 27 years of hunting in the Dakota's, I would pay a lot more than that. But I only speak for myself. Again, my #'s could be way off...but I think I am in the ballpark.
Click to expand...

You can not divide the 3.6 billion equally among all tax payers, some pay just a fraction of taxes....and some pay a heck of a lot more then their share. Your $72 figure may be the MEAN of what tax payers shell out. CRP is just another entitlement from the govt., whether you agree with it or not.
 
Montana Husker said:
You can not divide the 3.6 billion equally among all tax payers, some pay just a fraction of taxes....and some pay a heck of a lot more then their share. Your $72 figure may be the MEAN of what tax payers shell out. CRP is just another entitlement from the govt., whether you agree with it or not.
Click to expand...


right. that is what i was getting at in my 2nd post it is two-tenth's a % of whatever you pay at the federal level. it is $2 for every $1,000 of federal taxes you pay...
 
UGUIDE said:
Actually every business has externalized costs. Farmers have farmed conservation out of their business like clean air and clean water and wildlife to name a few. CRP is you the taxpayer having to pay for their externalized business expenses to maintain an environment your family can survive in..
Click to expand...
What is your definition of "externalized cost'? Second, to say "Farmers", you lump all together, just like most business, each has it's own way of doing things, some good, some bad. Third, who are you to tell me what I need to do for MY family to survive? Fourth, CRP funds do not go just to farmers...LOL, to think so is wrong.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top