Should CRP, CREP and other program $$ require public access?
- Thread starter tmrichardson
- Start date
M. R. Byrd
Well-known member
My CRP contract expires in 2012. If I have the opportunity to re-enroll it, I will consider it, but should public access be required I will not re-enroll it, even if I was offered twice the normal payment.
Some landowners would jump on any premium, such as is the case currently with the WIHA payments in Kansas. I will not.
Some landowners would jump on any premium, such as is the case currently with the WIHA payments in Kansas. I will not.
captaincoot
Banned
That gov't site that has the dollars farmers got from the gov't has a major flaw it only gives the amount the gov't paid farmer does not give the actual figure. Why because up to about 2 years ago you would seal your grain lets say 1.84 a bushel it was a loan from the gov't to be paid back in full with int. They only give amounts with the loan $ never subtracted the amount you paid back. Why? so they could put that money in other non farm bill related programs.
I feel the programs should be cut/changed some yes but not altogether. Why? Gov't likes to use grain as a weapon remember cold war. Do you not think that this money goes to equipment companies, South in the winter to help AZ, FL, main streets. Or would you rather have it go to the bad banks, auto companies that never had a sound finacal plan.
There would be no crp if you allowed public hunting on it. It only takes one stupid hunter to leave garbage or what ever to ruin A guys opinion on wildlife. I've seen that happen alot.
I feel the programs should be cut/changed some yes but not altogether. Why? Gov't likes to use grain as a weapon remember cold war. Do you not think that this money goes to equipment companies, South in the winter to help AZ, FL, main streets. Or would you rather have it go to the bad banks, auto companies that never had a sound finacal plan.
There would be no crp if you allowed public hunting on it. It only takes one stupid hunter to leave garbage or what ever to ruin A guys opinion on wildlife. I've seen that happen alot.
tmrichardson
Banned
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wesslpointer
New member
Thanks
I think you said it best. Any public money must have public access plus any public money spent on habitat on private land must also have a conservation easement that gos with the land. Your better of in the long run, spending public funds on public lands and let " The rich landowners and paid hunting take care of its self" It's Called free interprize!
I think you said it best. Any public money must have public access plus any public money spent on habitat on private land must also have a conservation easement that gos with the land. Your better of in the long run, spending public funds on public lands and let " The rich landowners and paid hunting take care of its self" It's Called free interprize!
captaincoot
Banned
How do you figure it will help to allow public access? Crp would be ZERO acres which means ZERO wildlife and habitat. Does it not make sense to pay landowners to put habitat in it's cheaper you get more acres it's spread out. Go all public what happens to the hunting industry its gone. Then what will the tax payers say lets sell all the hunting ground what goods it doing just a wasted program look at all the money we the tax payers are going to save. Think about it when was the last time taxes have went down? If the Gov't wants to hand money to landowners to help wildlife let them it's not going to hurt. At least there's something to show for the money spent.
UGUIDE
Active member
Hmmmm, yes James.....please pull the car around and do make sure it is well stocked with Caviar won't you please hmmmmmm. Tell me James, how did we ever live before we enrolled half the ranch in CRP? At least you have a job now James. Please make sure the dogs are fed won't you?
wesslpointer
New member
In the long run
crp is dead! It's about price support and not conservation anyway! And with gasanal and china needing more food. why pay people "not to farm" , who said you can tax all USA taxpayers for hunting for a few. If you stop wasting hunt lic revenue on advertising and spend other public money to inprove public lands, or on land's that people well give conservation easements you well have something that well last. The hunting industry well be fine, they can change there farming practices if hunters well spend enough to hunt on there land. If not its dead any way. Its called free interprize. Sorry about "rich" in other post!
crp is dead! It's about price support and not conservation anyway! And with gasanal and china needing more food. why pay people "not to farm" , who said you can tax all USA taxpayers for hunting for a few. If you stop wasting hunt lic revenue on advertising and spend other public money to inprove public lands, or on land's that people well give conservation easements you well have something that well last. The hunting industry well be fine, they can change there farming practices if hunters well spend enough to hunt on there land. If not its dead any way. Its called free interprize. Sorry about "rich" in other post!
WesselPointer!!! What the?
Well I've read a lot of cockeyed things on blogs, but a hunter who wants to end CRP? That's a first. It is about supporting the commodity price of crops, it's also about clean water, preserving the soil quality, not to mention just plain quality of life. As an aside we get some at least marginal nesting, brood cover, winter habitat for gamebirds. There isn't enough public land to provide for a quality sporting opportunity for more than a handful of hunters, unless you want some kind of lottery system like the "poor line" duck hunters, where you draw for a blind at 4AM, winners hunt losers try tommorrow. Of course we solve all these problems with your idea, hunters will quit, or retire in excellerated fashion, already in my state we had 250,000 quail hunters 30 years ago, today barely one tenth, and we are a grizzzled bunch, we have lost our quail hunters even faster than our quail! If you want to end sport hunting, sounds like a good start. We tried the free enterprise system of farming with Earl Butts, as ag secretary, remember " farm fence row to fencerow", we'll sell it to the world. That was nearly the doom of both farmers, and in some states the end of bird hunting. Problem with your naive idea of free enterprise is, it doesn't exist, not anywhere really, but particularily agriculture. The rest of the world subsidizes inefficient domestic ag practices, there is no level playing field, people will not "choose to create wildlife habitat, if it's a choice between habitat and bankruptcy. It's hard to do the right thing, when your hungry. You might want to consider the broader implications of the hatchet approach before contemplating where all the dominos will fall.
Well I've read a lot of cockeyed things on blogs, but a hunter who wants to end CRP? That's a first. It is about supporting the commodity price of crops, it's also about clean water, preserving the soil quality, not to mention just plain quality of life. As an aside we get some at least marginal nesting, brood cover, winter habitat for gamebirds. There isn't enough public land to provide for a quality sporting opportunity for more than a handful of hunters, unless you want some kind of lottery system like the "poor line" duck hunters, where you draw for a blind at 4AM, winners hunt losers try tommorrow. Of course we solve all these problems with your idea, hunters will quit, or retire in excellerated fashion, already in my state we had 250,000 quail hunters 30 years ago, today barely one tenth, and we are a grizzzled bunch, we have lost our quail hunters even faster than our quail! If you want to end sport hunting, sounds like a good start. We tried the free enterprise system of farming with Earl Butts, as ag secretary, remember " farm fence row to fencerow", we'll sell it to the world. That was nearly the doom of both farmers, and in some states the end of bird hunting. Problem with your naive idea of free enterprise is, it doesn't exist, not anywhere really, but particularily agriculture. The rest of the world subsidizes inefficient domestic ag practices, there is no level playing field, people will not "choose to create wildlife habitat, if it's a choice between habitat and bankruptcy. It's hard to do the right thing, when your hungry. You might want to consider the broader implications of the hatchet approach before contemplating where all the dominos will fall.
captaincoot
Banned
Crp is about saving rivers, soil, improved water and so on not about making people rich. Your perfect world is farming up to river banks letting soil erode poluting the water. Thats right throw away all the work thats been done that makes sense. Hell lets bring back the dust bowl:thumbsup: I bet you'll be the first to bitch opening morning when 50 other people want to hunt the same spot. I suppose you don't like food stamps or unemeployment benefits. Tell the gov't to not use food as a weapon? Who needs gun dealers, dog trainers/Raisers, outfitters, guides and what ever else goes with hunting Walmart can supply us with all that. You don't care about the little guy. I'm all for cutting farm payments but not Crp payments. It's a tool for helping wildlife,and hunting in general. And lets face it farmers do a better job then gov't at having productive habitat. Animals from crp don't go over to public hunting areas? Thanks for wanting to kill the hunting tradition:thumbsup:
wesslpointer
New member
I never said I wanted crp to end! I said that the economics well KILL it. We need to think out side box inprove what we have. crp is renting " with fed tax money" and that well soon end too. So we need to think about buying "easement's" est and spending lic moneys improving what we have. In my state crp is a joke in bad winters you can hay it! And sheep herds "slip in " and mowe it down to nonting!
wesslpointer
New member
I wish it was about saving rivers,soil water. For a lot of people its how to buy cheep land with Gov. money. In a perfect world a farmer would make more off hunting than farming up to river banks est. All new gov regs you cant aney way. If farmers would plant a winter cover crop it would do more good than crp. CRP is a farm payment??? Price supports or crp take your pick. Till there gone.! What I'm trying to bring up is what can we do to save Pheasant Hunting when CRP is gone!
I don't disagree that CRP may disappear someday but your way off base with how profitable it is and how easy it is to buy land with CRP money. I am not a banker but I can do some simple loan stuff. Oldandnew, I believe you are a banker so you can correct me if I am wrong. I will use Tripp County SD as an example. Some of the best pheasant hunting in the world. You buy 160 acres for $1500/acre. So you have $240,000 you somehow talk the bank into letting you put just 10% down so you borrow $216,000 for 20 years lock in your interest for 6% because you only put 10% down. Your payment is $18569.88 per year. Out of this 160 acres you have 4 acres in roads and another 15 in a slough(you bought it for hunting it has to have a slough!
) so no CRP payment on those 19 acres. So now you have 141 acres of CRP at $49/acre in Tripp County SD. So you end up with $6909 per year to put towards your $18569.88 land payment. But wait we forgot we have to pay property taxes on the 160 acres and Income taxes on the CRP payment. The good news is we don't have to pay FICA and medicade because it is investment income. So yes by all means use CRP to buy Cheap land it really works out wellcaptaincoot
Banned
What gov't reg's not to farm up to rivers? You take crp away there goes the buffer strips.. How is crp a program to buy cheap land? Is it not the gov'ts employs fault where they let crp rules to be broke tell them to do their job. Why do you think crp is done? It's doing fine around here. Alot cheaper then any public area the gov't buys. The world won't quit turning if you turn the 24 hour tabloid news channels off
captaincoot
Banned
:10sign: Stop it you're making to much sense
If farmers do such a crappy job on crp acres wesselpointer why you want to hunt on it anyway?
Don't forget the cost of maintaining the wildlife area. yup I'm going to be rich on my 20 acres of crp
I'm going to buy 160 acres of 7000 dollar ground and turn it into crp:thumbsup: Bill Gates here I come