Hunting Lodge & Land in Miller

K

ksimons

New member
My father-in-law owns two houses in Miller and lives in Aberdeen. His brother owns several thousands acres and charges $52.50 per day to hunt. He approached my father-in-law about setting up some kind of partnership where by my father-in-law rents out his extra housing and his older brother rents the land for hunting.

We plan to take this summer and retrofit an older mobile home on a city lot. It was left to them by my mother-in-law's mom when she died. I have convinced him that renting out the mobile home is more 'doable' than the whole house (which needs come de-cluttering and a lot of work).

My questions are:

1) it is a two bedroom mobile home with a 3rd 'room'. We plan to build bunks. How many do you all think would be 'desirable'? I know the max hunting party is 20, but realistically we would probably shoot for more like 8-12 people in the 'lodge' with the opportunity to hook up an RV. What do you all think is the 'sweet spot'?

2) We plan to re-do the plumbing from start to finish and update the electrical as needed. It also has an entry way, and I plan to add a laundry tub and counter for a bird cleaning station. In the kitchen we plan to include a range, fridge and deep freeze. Other considerations are basic appliances like microwave, coffee pot, etc. I think we can also rustle up some pots and pans. Anything else you all think is a 'MUST HAVE'? We can bring in a TV and DVD/VCR player, but anything more is risky given it is a rental.

3) I suggested putting in one of those pre-fab dog kennels and a nicely insulated dog house on an existing cement slab. Do you think this would be desirable or a good selling point?

4) We also plan to find some used furniture like a couch, an end table and some of those folding stadium chairs. Is there anything else that is a must-have?

5) For entertainment we wanted to leave some cards, poker chips and a bunch of dice. . . thoughts?

6) any advice for charging? We thought about per week, per day, per guy, etc. We are learning towards a hybrid of so much base per day, with a minimum number of days for the first 3 weeks. Then tacking on a per guy rate to help make things more fair for larger/smaller groups. We might also put in an early register/pay discount. My struggle is trying to be fair to the folks who hunt in smaller parties and hunt for less than the 5-days. We don't want prime weeks of hunting chopped up, but I don't want to force people into paying huge amounts for unused time. Ideally, we want to find good groups, charge a fair amount and get them locked up year after year.

Any advice on what you would want as a hunter, what you have experienced as a hunter and what you feel is fair as a hunter would be appreciated. We are just in the planning phase now, but come July/August we will plan to fully renovate and get this little endeavor off the ground. My father-in-law is a great guy, and at 68 he works full-time and very hard. I am hoping to help carve a nice little retirement money out for him. I know he and his dog would love to 'guide' all season long too. I am just hoping I can convince him to retire before he can't enjoy thinks like pheasant hunting anymore.

Thanks for any tip, ideas, opinions or advice!
 
Alright since nobody else has responded I will give you my .02 cents:)

1. I agree with keeping the housing pretty basic, theft and maintenance become an issue. Keep it simple, most hunters going for a hunt like this are pretty easy to please.

2. I would set 6-8 hunters as a target. It is really hard to get more than that on the same page. I have been putting groups together for years to come to sd and it's like herding cats:eek:. If you end up with more that's great. You have to have a minimum of six to tie up ground at least the first 3-4 weeks. After that you could drop the minimum.

3. I don't know the land you hunt, or how much of it is good hunting land, but the most important thing is the land needs to be rested more than it is hunted throughout the season. After the first couple weeks I would suggest that you limit the hunts to three days of every seven. Especially if #'s are like they were this year. If it is pounded 4-5 days every week, hunting quality will suffer. I hunt with two different farmers in SD. Both rest the land more than it is hunted. Both have 15k+ land. One guy only runs 5 or so large groups. The other guy has 8 or so but they range from 2-8 guys. With up to a week between groups. Guess what? The hunting is as good as anywhere, and they don't advertise and are booked solid with the same good guy's every year. Work to give quality and you will have success. Give crappy hunts and you will have to find new guy's every year:)

4. Make sure you get hold harmless agreements drawn up. That may help protect you from accidents in your house as well as the field.

5. As far as cost, quality hunting land along with a nice clean place to stay should go for 150-175 per gun per day. Good luck. Sounds like fun. I know the guy's I hunt with up there make a few bucks and have a blast doing it.
 
Question: if you already have two houses, why invest in renovating a mobile home? Perhaps I missed something.

Assumption: two homes will be filled and the mobile home necessary; not sure I agree with your initial launch assumptions.

What kind of track record have you had with hunters? I believe you already have competition (U-Guide) in the Miller area. Also I believe there are two or three other hunt facilities in the area. What do they offer? Will your facility be the same or an upgrade?

Bear in mind, some of us prefer to sleep in a motel vs gang style like an Army barracks. How does a motel rate compare to your rate?

Bottom line: I would start small and expand as necessary...

PS: I believe I hunted one of the Simmons farms - N.E. of Miller - many years ago!
 
I'm a lot more interested in what You guys have got going on your several thousand acres as far as habitat?
What are you doing to make sure of quality hunts?
The expense your putting into this, your going to charge accordingly. How do you plan to maintain the pheasant hunting. That is, Wild pheasant hunting?
 
My 2 cents. If you are really looking to get into the business contact uguide. He runs a great operation. You will make money and provide a great experience for your clients
 
Most guys that go to SD want good cover and lots of birds. Personally, I want a place that's clean but where I sleep is last on my list. Our group did not go to SD this year like many many NR hunters. Put your money in habitat. If guys can see a couple hundred wild birds a day, you will be full every year.
 
I totally agree with the previous two posts regarding habitat and wild birds. Focus on the hunting , not on the accommodations. We currently hunt at two farms, neither have any accommodations - just good hunting.

For years I hunted with a farmer that provided a basic dump to stay - we stayed at the local motel, but enjoyed his hunting facility. Investing in brick and mortar, initially, might not be the best idea.
 
Thanks for the thought.

I may not have been clear. My father in law own a home, my wife's childhood home, but it is vacant and we use it off and on when we are in the area. I needs work. . . a lot of work.

He also owns a mobile home in town. It is empty and would be simpler (read cheaper) to fix up.

We would only be responsible for the lodging. My fater-in-law's brother has the land and already manages it. From what we have heard from many of the groups we bump into when we are hunting his land, pickings for lodging are slim and of low quality. They have inquired about staying at the house or at the mobile home, but we honestly haven't put much effort into exploring that.

So, we (the father-in-law, with my weak mind and strong back) are just interested in setting up a rent-able housing unit. We plan to start small. I know the guys who stay at the motel say they pay $1000 per room for their 5-day hunt, of which they only stay 4 days. I think we can beat that and offer, what for some, would be considered an upgrade. With a kitchen there money is saved on food. There is also a place to socialize and have a few beers. That should save some 'bar money' costs.

You all have given me something to think about. We are definitely going to start small. I am also thinking we might want to limit the amount of 'bunks' we put in. I might make one room the 'Master' and then the other two can be a bit more 'bunk house' That way the older guys can get some sleep while the young guys play some cards.
 
My 2 cents is allow dogs in the trailer even if only to be crated in there or run a kennel off of the trailer. Also having gone this year we were disappointed that the land owner ran an unknown amount of relatives through the property the week before we got there on opening weekend. Had we known that upfront we would have picked a different week or probably went with someone else.
 
Hard to believe the motel charges $250 per night, per person! Years ago I stayed at the Super 8 in Miller and was charged the same fees as other guests.

I still maintain if you provide quality hunting at a fair price, hunters will find places to stay.

Thought: wouldn't it be more reasonable to fix the house vs invest in renovating a trailer? When you are in town, stay in a motel...
 
I've stayed at the Miller Super 8 for 23 years straight, the most we have ever paid per night was 80.00, the motel across Hwy 14 is even cheaper. Now with the AARP discount we paid 70.00 a night this year.

The Miller area has seen several pheasant operations close in recent years, I know Dakota Expeditions right west of town by a mile is no longer operating. And the one 20 miles south and ten miles west of Hwy 45 looks shut down also.

I know I would want to be on the property where I'm going to hunt, warm area for the dogs, able to cook my own food, and cable TV, and a decent cleaning station for the birds(out of the cold for late season).
 
There are two or three hunt facilities east of Miller; Wessington, St. Lawrence and I believe one north of St. Lawrence (high buck).

I too, have hunted the Miller area since 1992, until this past year. I found the pheasants have declined quite a bit and hunted elsewhere this past year. Starting a new facility, with declining bird counts...not sure I would invest in the enterprise.
 
My 2 cents on the venture.

1. Sleeping quarters for my group need to be no more than 2 guys per room.
2. Shower is a must every day.
3. Bird cleaning room that has running water, freezer, and indoors! Outside in late season is no fun cleaning birds.
4. Dogs need to be warm and dry. Some dogs are pampered more than others and need to stay in the house. This is not a deal breaker for me, but it needs to have heat in it for late season hunting.
5. Birds are everything. If you don't have cover, birds, and the opportunities to see lots of birds, guys will move on.
6. Price is a huge factor as well. It seems like the breaking point for my group is about $125-$135 per day per guy. If you charge over that I can go to a game farm close by and shoot way more birds than 3 for less money.
7. Some sort of cable/dish tv is important. Some guys don't drink or party and they want to sit down and watch a movie or a tv show in the evening to unwind and relax.
8. A dryer is nice for the clothes that get wet on nasty days.
9. Lots of room around the kitchen table is good for feeding a group of guys or playing cards or just making a plan of action for the next day. Small kitchens are a pain for a hunting group.
 
david0311

ksimons said:
My father-in-law owns two houses in Miller and lives in Aberdeen. His brother owns several thousands acres and charges $52.50 per day to hunt. He approached my father-in-law about setting up some kind of partnership where by my father-in-law rents out his extra housing and his older brother rents the land for hunting.

We plan to take this summer and retrofit an older mobile home on a city lot. It was left to them by my mother-in-law's mom when she died. I have convinced him that renting out the mobile home is more 'doable' than the whole house (which needs come de-cluttering and a lot of work).

My questions are:

1) it is a two bedroom mobile home with a 3rd 'room'. We plan to build bunks. How many do you all think would be 'desirable'? I know the max hunting party is 20, but realistically we would probably shoot for more like 8-12 people in the 'lodge' with the opportunity to hook up an RV. What do you all think is the 'sweet spot'?

2) We plan to re-do the plumbing from start to finish and update the electrical as needed. It also has an entry way, and I plan to add a laundry tub and counter for a bird cleaning station. In the kitchen we plan to include a range, fridge and deep freeze. Other considerations are basic appliances like microwave, coffee pot, etc. I think we can also rustle up some pots and pans. Anything else you all think is a 'MUST HAVE'? We can bring in a TV and DVD/VCR player, but anything more is risky given it is a rental.

3) I suggested putting in one of those pre-fab dog kennels and a nicely insulated dog house on an existing cement slab. Do you think this would be desirable or a good selling point?

4) We also plan to find some used furniture like a couch, an end table and some of those folding stadium chairs. Is there anything else that is a must-have?

5) For entertainment we wanted to leave some cards, poker chips and a bunch of dice. . . thoughts?

6) any advice for charging? We thought about per week, per day, per guy, etc. We are learning towards a hybrid of so much base per day, with a minimum number of days for the first 3 weeks. Then tacking on a per guy rate to help make things more fair for larger/smaller groups. We might also put in an early register/pay discount. My struggle is trying to be fair to the folks who hunt in smaller parties and hunt for less than the 5-days. We don't want prime weeks of hunting chopped up, but I don't want to force people into paying huge amounts for unused time. Ideally, we want to find good groups, charge a fair amount and get them locked up year after year.

Any advice on what you would want as a hunter, what you have experienced as a hunter and what you feel is fair as a hunter would be appreciated. We are just in the planning phase now, but come July/August we will plan to fully renovate and get this little endeavor off the ground. My father-in-law is a great guy, and at 68 he works full-time and very hard. I am hoping to help carve a nice little retirement money out for him. I know he and his dog would love to 'guide' all season long too. I am just hoping I can convince him to retire before he can't enjoy thinks like pheasant hunting anymore.

Thanks for any tip, ideas, opinions or advice!
Click to expand...

I would really consider contacting Chris at U-Guide before getting into this without prior experiance--as others have said land management and birds--quality land and birds are the the key--

believe U-Guide does not have a operation in the Miller area at this time--may be a good time to contact him his help

Stayed in Miller this year at motels nothing fancy but clean-cheap and nice people to deal with

Good luck--
 
U-Guide shows "Wolf Creek" as one of their offerings - at least it's been partially booked for 2014.

I still would recommend waiting a year or two before getting into the "hunting & lodging" business. Establish the hunt part of the business first...
 
Yes we hunted at Wolf creek, a Uguide hunt, in Miller this year and have it again for next year at the same time. First class operation but not cheap.
 
The last two years we found the bird count way down in the Miller area. What was Wolf Creek like?
Wild birds?

What basis would you consider switching to another camp?

Just curious...
 
You have to start with habitat on your hunting ground, food and cover. Ample rest between your hunts is a must, this ain't the SD of 5-8-12 years ago. There are less birds and much less cover and habitat for the birds as the price of corn has gone up pheasant cover has gone down.
 
I know I didn't make this clear in the first post, but I do not own the land and will not have anything to do with managing it. Basically we are trying to set up a mobile home as a rental to people staying in town to hunt on our relatives land.

He runs his land anyway he wants, I don't have any say over it. We are just trying to provide a nice little place to stay at a reasonable rate for those who do come to hunt. We plan to use it for 3-4 days anyway and figured we might as well set it up for others and then charge a decent rate.

As far as where you stay when you hunt, what do you look for?

This is our plan so far:
Beds for 6-10 guys
kitchen
living room for lounging
heated bird cleaning space
heated space for dogs
outside dog run
hot water, toilets
couches, appliances, TV (no cable though)
Freezer for storing birds
Possible hook-up for RV
Just a hop-skip and a jump from the down town bars
 
If I may be so bold - what is your budget for this venture? And what sort of return do you expect?

Business plans: usually have extensive research as a part of the plan and some estimate of the revenue generated.

Question: How and where will you find customers? Who are they?
 
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