First guns for kids

D

Daisybuck

New member
Here's one for you all:

When my dad introduced me to hunting I got a piece of crap, single-shot .410. Never had a chance on a bird on the wing. Luckily, the bug bit anyway hence, here I am. On the other hand, the odds of success are astronomically poor with such a piece. But they are safe(r).

Now I am beginning the process of considering which, if any, of the guns I own will fit for the boys as they get closer to hunting age. I have an Ithica Model 37 in 20 ga. and a Remington Model 1100 in 12. I can get an Ithica sxs in 12 ga. Only the 20 seems to make sense, but it makes my wife nervous.

Do I go out and get some single-shot with a hammer and a crooked barrel (as I had) to make sure of no accidents?

Or do I get something nice for them that they might actually use again someday because they enjoyed the successful experience.

And guys, if you are routinely bagging birds with a .410 you have my utmost respect and STAY THE HECK AWAY FROM MINNESOTA, SHARPSHOOTERS. :D
 
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I started with a win. model 37 steelbilt .410 that my dad used for rabbit. He let hunt 1 season with that gun then let me go to a 20 ga. single shot to use on quail and phez.Still have both and have added other guns to my arsenal for hunting.Don't know if this will help or not but that's how I got started.
 
Scrap the .410 idea. I too started on a .410 and I would never start a kid on one. Which shotgun and gauge depends a lot on the kid. His size and ability to responsibly handle a pump or auto loader. Get a gun that fits him now and maybe something you can change stocks on when he grows more. My one concern with the Mod 37 20 ga. might be recoil unless you use low base rounds. But on the other hand can he handle the weight of a 12 ga. Sometimes a 12 ga. will have less recoil than a lightweight 20 ga. Here's what I did with my stip-son when he was about 12 years old. I had a 12 ga. 870 Wingmaster with a 26" barrel. He could handle the gun okay except the length of pull was too long. So I took off the recoil pad and had a gunsmith fit it with a plastic butt plate. That reduced the LOP by about 3/4" and made the fit for him much better. Once he grew and could handle to original LOP I re-installed the recoil pad. With him starting on a 12 ga. I kept the loads light but the gun still had as much shot and velocity as a 20 ga. and probably patterned better. Good luck, but I believe it's all about getting a gun that will fit the youngster properly.
 
I used a Sears and Roebuck 20 Ga. single shot exposed hammer full choke for my first Pheasant gun...HATED it. Almost to the point that I gave up hunting.

Yea it is safer then say a semi auto with a full magazine. But what about the idea of giving your son one shell at a time.
Kinda a pain each time he shoots to walk over and give him another shell, but then again the concept of being able to coach him on his last shot is nice too.

Also if he is able to get use to the feel of the Ithica, he is able to advance to multiple shots in a gun he feels comfortable with.
If it were my son I would use the 20 Ga. Ithica
 
I bought my boys Browning 20 g pump. They each grew up with that. Then we moved on to 12 g in late teen years.
 
IMO a .410 is not the best chioce for a youth gun. You want them to have success. The dost of shell is another problem with a .410.

I started my some with a youth Rem 870. He shot it well and had success on quail and pheasants.

Think I still have that gun somewhere.

I really wanted to start him with a 20 ga 1100, but I didn't want to shorten one up enough to fit him at the time.
 
how old are you boys? i started both of my sons out with 20 GA. single break open. found them cheep at gander mtn. now i just picked up a 870 20GA. then i looked online and found a youth stock.
 
Were I in the position to need such an item, I would look high and low for an old Savage 220 in 16 gauge and choked modified.
Being a single shot with a top tang safety, it would represent a fine first scattergun.

Barring that, a single loaded Beretta 20 gauge 391 with a 24" barrel would be an equally fine choice and one into which the younker could grow.
 
OldDublin said:
Were I in the position to need such an item, I would look high and low for an old Savage 220 in 16 gauge and choked modified.
Being a single shot with a top tang safety, it would represent a fine first scattergun.

Barring that, a single loaded Beretta 20 gauge 391 with a 24" barrel would be an equally fine choice and one into which the younker could grow.
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My first gun was a Savage 220A in .410 ga. bought new in 1956 for $25. Still have it. A few years ago I picked up a 220B in 16 ga. but I sold it about 2 years ago. The Savage 220's are great guns and actully somewhat ahead of their time since they were hammerless. Another nice feature that they had for a new/young shooter is that the safety automatically reset after you opened the action. And they had a case hardened receiver.

Here's a 16 ga. for you. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=270254737
 
I think I would find an auto or a pump that the kids can continue to use as they grow.

The idea of removing the recoil pad until the kid grew a little, and then reinstalling it is a good idea. The 1100 with the recoil pad removed might fit the kids pretty well.

With the pump or auto, cut a pencil to the correct length and insert it in place of the plug so that they can't load any shells into the tube. Limit the young shooter to one shot that way.
 
Thrasher said:
I think I would find an auto or a pump that the kids can continue to use as they grow.

The idea of removing the recoil pad until the kid grew a little, and then reinstalling it is a good idea. The 1100 with the recoil pad removed might fit the kids pretty well.

With the pump or auto, cut a pencil to the correct length and insert it in place of the plug so that they can't load any shells into the tube. Limit the young shooter to one shot that way.
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Here! Here! I went through this a couple a years ago with my twin girls, with the added complication of the fact that they are both small. We tried single shot 20ga. guns. found the quality to be poor, resulting in a wicked recoil even with a pad and light loads. I shot them myself,and have fired 10ga. guns with less punch, they tend to be muzzle heavy and stock light, pushing the gun up and delivering the blow to your cheek. At one time we owned youth models of Winchester 1200's (2), a winchester 1400 youth, found the safety to be difficult on these because it is forward the trigger and we had issues with short fingers, Model Remington 870 Jr., A little long through the reciever but really nice, and incidentally both girls shot the Winchesters and Remington well at clay targets, A Ithaca 37, and a Remington 1100Y, determined to be to heavy and forward biased. Ended up with 1910-1920 vintage Ithaca flues 20ga. weight 5.75# short reciever, tang safety. Big enough to handle any gun now, but haven't been able to pry them away. I would certainly pick a gun with some room to grow, fit and finish, pride of ownership should not be ignored, and physical fit is everything in a youth gun, or we risk discouraging the young shooter from success and continuation in the sport. Weight too, We carry these things a lot more than we shoot these days!
 
First off, any gun with a hammer is out. They are the most dangerous gun in the woods. buy a gun that fits the kid and they can shoot without it kicking the snot out of them. Nothing more deterring to a new young shooter then a ill fitting gun and one that kicks like a mule. A good gun that won't break the bank, is soft shooting and comes in a youth model, is the Weatherby SA-08 20ga youth auto loader. Priced around the $500 mark. You might find a used Remington 1100 20ga that could be cut to fit for around $350-$400. Stoeger makes a nice little SxS 20 that could fill the bill for around $350-$400 New.

http://www.weatherby.com/product/shotguns/sa_08
 
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oldandnew said:
Here! Here! I went through this a couple a years ago with my twin girls, with the added complication of the fact that they are both small. We tried single shot 20ga. guns. found the quality to be poor, resulting in a wicked recoil even with a pad and light loads. I shot them myself,and have fired 10ga. guns with less punch, they tend to be muzzle heavy and stock light, pushing the gun up and delivering the blow to your cheek. At one time we owned youth models of Winchester 1200's (2), a winchester 1400 youth, found the safety to be difficult on these because it is forward the trigger and we had issues with short fingers, Model Remington 870 Jr., A little long through the reciever but really nice, and incidentally both girls shot the Winchesters and Remington well at clay targets, A Ithaca 37, and a Remington 1100Y, determined to be to heavy and forward biased. Ended up with 1910-1920 vintage Ithaca flues 20ga. weight 5.75# short reciever, tang safety. Big enough to handle any gun now, but haven't been able to pry them away. I would certainly pick a gun with some room to grow, fit and finish, pride of ownership should not be ignored, and physical fit is everything in a youth gun, or we risk discouraging t.he young shooter from success and continuation in the sport. Weight too, We carry these things a lot more than we shoot these days!
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The ole man started me on Win 1200 Youth.I don't even know where the safety is,or if it works(still have it)because my Dad would kick my ass for using a safety.The only way I was allowed to carry a gun,and the way I still carry,is with the action open.He allowed one shell,partially chambered,not to be closed until the gun was shouldered.And to be removed well before meeting back with the party.This way anyone can see,at a glance that my gun is not going to be the one to kill them.I would never let a kid carry a gun with a closed action,ever.I do not allow anyone in my vehicle with a closed action either.The only gun I carry with safety on is my Benelli Super 90 auto-banger because you pretty much have-to.Even then,as soon as I'm done,that round comes out and is placed sideways in the action,for all to see.No one has ever been harmed by a gun with an open action,but I could document hundreds of cases where people thought they had the safety on.
 
I started out with an old side by side 20 with one hammer removed. Then at twelve my grandfather gave me a browning twelvette, that I still use today. I was a small kid and had to learn how to use the gun and grow into it.

I then started my kids out on a single shot 20, but with that I would have spent the money for a pump for them.
 
Thanks for the feedback. I was surprised to see that there were suggestions for models/makes that I would have thought were out of the price range. Nice to hear. I think the Ithica model 37 is probably out unless I go with Rancho's suggestion and just have one shell in the mag and nothing chambered. Still thinking grandad's sxs Ithica with one round in an ultra-light might be the way to go if it fits.
 
This past season, my son hunted again on the mentor program in Wisconsin. We switched off carrying my Stevens 5100 16 gauge. Its light and does kick a little but he likes it.

I started out with my dads stevens 311 .410 and carried it for two seasons. Got a few squirrels with it.
My youngest will carry it when he starts.
 
For a small kid a 20 gauge model 37 is hard to beat. When the kid is 5' tall and 100+ pounds get him a 12 gauge model 37. A browning BPS would be an ok sub.

I've shot a lot of guns and that model 37 or BPS is very soft from a recoil standpoint. As a 110 pound high school kid I had no issues with a 10 gauge BPS with heavy steel, buckshot or slugs. The really strange thing is as a grownup I shot a benelli with dove loads and found it kicks too much. I think a lot of it has to do with the buttstock design.
 
My first hunting season was with an old stevens pump in 12. It kicked a little, but not near as much as my grandpa's SxS.
My dad cut a pencil to length and inserted it in the magazine tube in place of the plug so that there was no way to have more then one shell in the gun. I was 12 and shot a few pheasant. After I had shown that I was responsible, sometime during the next season, he removed the pencil and replaced the plug and I was allowed to have three shells in the gun.
 
My first shotgun was a Fox 16 gauge SxS. I was probably 6 or 7. All we had at our house was double guns so if I wanted to shoot, that was what it was gonna be. I know those old Fox and Savage 311's kicked the crap out of me but I didn't know any better. We shot almost every day and reloaded shells on Saturday nights while watching Hee Haw. My dad taught me early and very thoroughly about handling guns. I guess what I'm trying to say is get them something they can shoot successfully and for a long time. And make safe gun handling second nature. It takes time and patience and I thank God my daddy had both.
 
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