Brownback Administration to Ramp Up Promotion of Hunting

BritChaser

Well-known member
The new issue of "Kansas Wildlife & Parks" magazine has an editorial by the new secretary, Gov. Brownback's appointee, describing organizational changes calculated to bring more hunters to the state as part of a push for more tourism here. All I know is that as a Kansan who hunts, I like what I have and hope it never changes much. But I now am concered about what the future may hold.
 
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The new issue of "Kansas Wildlife" magazine has an editorial by the new secretary, Gov. Brownback's appointee, describing organizational changes calculated to bring more hunters to the state as part of a push for more tourism here. All I know is that as a Kansan who hunts, I like what I have and hope it never changes much. But I now am concered about what the future may hold.

Me too! My optimistic side thinks we might get a lot more WIHA. My not so optimistic side tells me that we're headed for the South Dakota scenario of pay to hunt everywhere and I don't like that:mad:
 
all I can say is this is bull s!!t we kansans have worked hard for the places we hunt that are private and those out of staters who do have land to hunt here have also worked hard i'm not against out of state hunting but dammit make everyone work for the privalage to hunt here and don't publisize or extort kansas as they have done in the dakotas
 
all I can say is this is bull s!!t we kansans have worked hard for the places we hunt that are private and those out of staters who do have land to hunt here have also worked hard i'm not against out of state hunting but dammit make everyone work for the privalage to hunt here and don't publisize or extort kansas as they have done in the dakotas

Couldn't agree more. I'm all for generating revenue through our hunting program, but there's a point when you go from a balanced approach to an all-out exploit of the resource, which I think Governor Brownback has made clear as his intentions.
 
all I can say is this is bull s!!t we kansans have worked hard for the places we hunt that are private and those out of staters who do have land to hunt here have also worked hard i'm not against out of state hunting but dammit make everyone work for the privalage to hunt here and don't publisize or extort kansas as they have done in the dakotas[/QUOTE

i totally agree. No way that the promotion of hunting in this state benefits us residents. We already have a ton of walk-in, so unless some of this added revenue is used for increasing our opportunities or volume of game, it will be bad for us. Soon more and more pay to hunt places will crop up. I am glad that the small towns get some added revenue, but there is plenty of out of state hunters as it is. I counted 11 different states on license plates in kansas last year, and i only went out 3 times. Used to be after opening couple weekends you kinda had the place to yourself. But with dwindling opportunities in Iowa, missouri and other states, our fields can be crowded year round. That combined with the fact that private ground access in the Dakota's is becoming scarcer. I would prefer it was our little secret.
 
I might be on the other side of the fence with this topic. If done correctly it could be a boom for local hunters if as carptom1 states the increase in revenue leads to better land management and volume of game. I agree that there is plenty of walk in but how many times have you gone to a walk in track of land and you find an over grazed cow pasture that only a prarie dog would live in. The added revenue must be used to show local communities that wildlife is an utapped resource not just a by product of agriculture. I think north east Kansas is a prime example of this. Bird numbers are at all time lows in Marshall and Nemaha counties (imo) and habittat is getting harder and harder to come by with farmers using every available inch of farmable ground. I think the answer is and can be walk-in hunting rates improve but the ground must be managed in such a way to benefit wildlife.
 
I'm reading this thread with a bit of amazement. In my opinion, there is very little difference is what this board does and what gov. Brownback is proposing.

For quite some time I've believed that Kansas was the best kept secret in the hunting world. I can remember a time when locals wouldn't even hunt WIHA's because it was "public ground". In 1998 I hit 96 WIHA's over the season and saw at least one pheasant or quail on each. My, how things have changed.

Boards like this one have promoted use of Kansas' WIHA's, given game reports, given information on where to stay, how to obtain permission, what to shoot, how to dress, what to drive, how to hunt, etc. In short, it has promoted upland hunting in this fine state.

Now some of the major names on the board are worried due to the possibility of increased demand? Hmmmmm....didn't any of you guys see this coming? You're dang right hunting is going to become a rich man's game. The state is simply taking a page out of the Internet forum playbook.

What did you expect?

Point!
 
Point! Makes an excellent case. Upland hunters find ourselves in a dilema. The sport and birds we love have been in a long term decline since the mid 1960's, former states with superior numbers, like Pennsylvania pheasants, Alabama and Georgia quail, have dwindled to remnant populations barely huntable, put and take operations or isolated carefully managed private and pricey habitat. Kansas and South Dakota stand at the apex of the the problem, as the last of the best available. For the record, as a long time hunter of Kansas going back to the late 60's, I can absolutely guarantee that the hunting is a pale comparison to then. With fewer and expensive opportunities elsewhere, it's debatable if we have lost bird hunting opportunities or bird hunters at a faster rate. One thing is certain, the remaining and largely aging, bird hunters are and will continue to find their way to the remaining areas with birds. The concern I here coming through this blog is can this last. Probably not. Already the eastern third of Kansas is primarily lost, a combination of habitat loss, weather changes, farm practices, and population pressure. More pressure stresses an already fragile resource, particularily when quail are considered. We can squeeze waterfowl into small concentrations with carefully managed wetlands, quail and pheasants require huge expanses of ground in specific habitat mixes to acheive the same objective. There is not the will power, and more importantly the financial incentive to reset the clock, barring some natural or man made cataclism. At 56 years of age, I expect, from a practical standpoint, to see an end to wild bob white quail hunting in my lifetime. None the less, I work and pray dillegently to avoid this daily, honestly not sure I even want to live in a world without bobwhite quail. I wish I had savored the glory days even more than I did. I guess we enjoy what we have, for as long as we can. The pressure of states to balance budgets, on farmers to turn a profit, competition for a dwindling resource, will drive up costs to hunt, drive off potential participants, and push the sport toward elitism, much like Europe. The Kansas program of WIHA and other efforts in a handful of other states, is one of the few bright spots if we don't kill the golden goose, by loving it to death.
 
While I somewhat agree with you Point, I believe you are talking about apples and oranges here.

Currently there are 505 active members on this forum. I imagine the state has more than 505 out-of-stater's hunting in Kansas every weekend. I'm sure there are people who aren't registered users that come on here and "glean" from posts made from members, but I doubt you can compare the "adverstising" power of this site to the state of Kansas' tourism budget (which is now part of KDWP).

Anyone that hunts already knows Kansas is a great destination for upland game. I really don't see the need to advertise that fact at all. It's a given. :thumbsup:
 
I'm an out of stater, (barely, 5 miles too far east), but have my lifetime license, and proudly fly my Powercat flag on game day. :)

The problem is Brownback is wanting dollars for the state, which comes from out of staters. Hotels, gas, food, shopping, etc, the more out of staters that come in, the better for the state. To Topeka, it doesn't matter if the locals don't get to hunt the way they used to, because look at all the out of state dollars coming in.

Us common-joe hunters recognize that, and recognize that the more its promoted, the more crowded its going to get. The more crowded it gets, the more the ground is going to be leased so a guy can guarantee a quarter or half section all to himself. The great state of Kansas, is quickly headed the way of Texas. If you spend anytime around a Texan, they don't talk about going out to the farm to hunt, they go out to their 'lease'. Or they ask if anybody knows of a good 'lease' that is open.

Golden Rule, the ones with the gold, make the rules. That isn't necessarily bad, unless it hurts your own self-interest. My problem is I don't have the gold, and the family ground that I grew up hunting, is now leased to outfitters for hunters that do have the gold.
 
Great Posts

Great posts everyone. The scuttlebutt I have heard is that pay hunting will become more prevalent as in TX or SD, with a diminution in walk-in because private money will pay the landowner more than the KDWP.
 
Britchaser, I sure hate to hear that! I wonder what kind of effect 4.00-5.00 gas will have? Along with a sagging economy, featuring eroding residential real estate values? Used Firearms prices have certainly reset in the last year. Some real bargains out there.
 
Great posts everyone. The scuttlebutt I have heard is that pay hunting will become more prevalent as in TX or SD, with a diminution in walk-in because private money will pay the landowner more than the KDWP.

For this reason we as a group must contact our legislators and ask for an increase in the amount the land owner gets to enroll in the walk-in hunting program with the stipulation that the land be somewhat managed for wildlife. I have a strong belief that Kansas can lead the way in this keeping hunting great and accessible to the average Joe.
 
I like RoosterTim's outlook on the situation. If the cards are played right, this could help us in the long run. I too am concerned about pay to hunt becoming a way of life in KS, but I think that will happen eventually anyway. RoosterTim's suggestions may actually postpone this fate.
 
On a side note, I was at a wedding reception a couple years ago and about saw a 75 year old man whip a 30 year old guy for asking if he could lease his farms for deer hunting. The 75 year old farmer (a friend of mine), snapped, and stated (yelled??) that he would never lease his farms, that anybody that asked could hunt his farms, but if he ever saw that 30 year old, or his family, or friends even so much as stop to take a leak in the ditch around his place, he would have them arrested. Might not have been the most appropriate place to let his feelings be known, but that particular crowd (and bride/groom), didn't mind.
 
I can't see how transitioning to a pay-to-hunt model will come close to meeting Gov Brownback's goals. If the only folks coming to KS to hunt are the pay-to-hunt crowd, license sales will plummet, fewer folks will be in restaurants, hotels, etc.

The only way this would work is to bolster the WIHA program to make hunting more accessible to the common man.

How they will keep the outfitters from leasing all the prime ground, ala TX, I don't know. But I can't see how leasing will meet the goals the gov has lined out.

Mike C
 
it always comes down to taxes. Motel taxes, sales taxes, gas taxes, taxes and fees for outfitters. Believe me they will find a way to make it to their benefit. I really don't see how this will help us. The non-resident hunting fees are 40% lower here than in south dakota and you get a whole year instead of two five day periods. Even if our bird hunting isn't quite as good, it is still a tremendous value for an out of stater.

Ps i seriously doubt that us talking about our good hunts on here has much to do with increased out of state hunting. Wildcat said there were 550 members on here and alot of those are out of staters that never come to kansas. Hell i saw that many out of staters on opening weekend.
 
I can't see how transitioning to a pay-to-hunt model will come close to meeting Gov Brownback's goals. If the only folks coming to KS to hunt are the pay-to-hunt crowd, license sales will plummet, fewer folks will be in restaurants, hotels, etc.

The only way this would work is to bolster the WIHA program to make hunting more accessible to the common man.

How they will keep the outfitters from leasing all the prime ground, ala TX, I don't know. But I can't see how leasing will meet the goals the gov has lined out.

Mike C



Thats what common sense tells you, but we are talking about Elected Officials completely out of touch with reality. Sadly I believe common sense eludes most of them in the elected arena.

Time will tell, but Im not keeping my hopes up. Im sick of all the people coming here, its becoming too crowded. They need to enroll more land in WIHA and expand the opportunities before they advertise the hell out of it. Then everyone will benefit. If the overcrowding continues, the ones that drove from out of state will start to go to leasing or if they dont have the money to lease they wont come at all.

After the two timing guy whos name I no longer want to mention left his post at the KDWP I thought all would be better with the world, now Im not so sure.
 
Ps i seriously doubt that us talking about our good hunts on here has much to do with increased out of state hunting. Wildcat said there were 550 members on here and alot of those are out of staters that never come to kansas. Hell i saw that many out of staters on opening weekend.


Its not just this board. Theres many more out there like it where the word spreads. The hotspotting is what irritates me the most.

I think a good college master level research paper would be the affects current social media/wildlife/hunting opportunities.
 
Ok here goes, I have read every post on this topic and cannot believe what I am hearing!! I am from MN and can tell you that from the days that I was a kid hunting with my dad to what it is now, is a large contrast....When I was a child hunting in SW MN with him 25 years ago there were birds everywhere. Now we are finally starting to get some of them back. As for the govenor speaking out about this in a public forum, I see no problem with it. If you would look up some facts about what SD does on a yearly basis as far as resident and non-resident hunters I will clue you in on it sense I looked up the figures because this topic and discussion was driving me nuts. SD in 2009 the resident hunters spent 40.9 million dollars, compared to almost 200 million from non-resident out of state hunters!!! that is almost 5 times the amount! I can tell you from 17 years of hunting experience in SD that the bird populations have done nothing but gone up, right now the 10yr average is up over 13% and I know for the fact that there were more than a few tough winters in that time that brought the population back down. For all you people that a worried about out of staters coming in and buying up all the land and leasing everything. I only have one thing to say, don't worry about it!! I for one do not have the money to do this, but can tell you from my years hunting in SD that this has done nothing but improve hunting for all the people that hunt in the area. One, the farmers become concerned about the habitat on there land and what happens on there land as far as birds go, when this happens habitat improves and we all benefit!! If they plant shelter belts and CRP for hunters to come in and hunt, this benefits everyone not just the guys that get to hunt that land, the birds move around. I hunt a mix of public and private land, and can tell you that any public ground that is close to a nice private field, has just as many birds on it! Also I don't know if you can hunt road ditches in KS but in SD you can hunt them and I can tell you that it is some of the best hunting in SD, this is all made possible by hunters (non residents) and farmers working together even if it may be for leasing/buying land. Again we all benefit from this. So to all you residents, stop your bitching about this because in the long run it will benefit you more than if your state doesn't promote it's great hunting!!!
 
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