Another contribution of from Concentrated Agriculture

This one hits very close to home as I live no more than 15 miles from Fresno Co. Looking around everyday its easy to see that we are farming the great central valley into oblivion. The Salinas valley isnt to far from me either and if you eat any strawberries, artichokes, asparagus or garlic produced in the US I bet it comes from the Salinas area, but hey, its our job to feed the world.
 
quail hound said:
but hey, its our job to feed the world.
Click to expand...

Says Who? We have no obligation to feed anybody but ourselves right here in the U.S. They breed like rabbits and have no way to feed themselves. That's their problem.
 
onpoint said:
Says Who? We have no obligation to feed anybody but ourselves right here in the U.S. They breed like rabbits and have no way to feed themselves. That's their problem.
Click to expand...

That is my stance also. The San Jouquine river is the border between Madera co (my home) and fresno co on the South and West sides of Madera. The once magnificent river was damned in the 40s to provide more irrigation water to eastside farmers and ended what was once one of the biggest salmon runs in Ca. A dispute (and series of lawsuits) an agreement was struck to return water flows to the ocean (last year was the first time the SJR saw the ocean in over 50 years) and the salmon who called the river home. This is the second year of the river restoration and we are experiencing a drought year and the cries from the farmers have begun. "Youre sending our water to the ocean, while we are trying to feed the world." How exactly does one come to own water from a watershed live the Sierra Nevada mountains? Why don't I have a stake in this water? Why am I a radical for wanting to see a balance struck between a healthy farming community and a healthy landscape?
 
Last edited:
Any third world country that cannot sustain food for themselves does not have the right to eat strawberries, artichokes, asparagus. We have people in the US that cannot afford these pleasure foods.
 
OKIEGunner said:
Any third world country that cannot sustain food for themselves does not have the right to eat strawberries, artichokes, asparagus. We have people in the US that cannot afford these pleasure foods.
Click to expand...

I agree but my point was that these areas are farmed so extensively as to become a detriment the quality of life in these communities.
 
OKIEGunner said:
Any third world country that cannot sustain food for themselves does not have the right to eat strawberries, artichokes, asparagus. We have people in the US that cannot afford these pleasure foods.
Click to expand...

What about people from India, South Korea and China who can afford to pay more than quite a few Americans? Do we sell to them?
 
haymaker said:
What about people from India, South Korea and China who can afford to pay more than quite a few Americans? Do we sell to them?
Click to expand...

At what cost to our water quality and environment is the real question. I will also say, if hardship is because of tyrant government/upper class that is suppressing the people and driving them into poverty is the cause. I tend to see things different. Then I'm all for kicking some @$$
 
onpoint said:
At what cost to our water quality and environment is the real question. I will also say, if hardship is because of tyrant government/upper class that is suppressing the people and driving them into poverty is the cause. I tend to see things different. Then I'm all for kicking some @$$
Click to expand...

For the moment let's forget about the enviroment. I don't like us selling gas to some other country and making it more expensive here. However we are selling meat to other countries and that is raising the price here. As a cattleman I am benefiting from that. I am torn because someone in another country can afford beef that alot of Americans can't. However the benefit that I get I can spend and improve the economy here. There is nothing I can do about it and I am not going to turn it down but on one hand I like it and another I don't. By the way there is no feed lot involved my cattle just eat grass.
 
haymaker said:
For the moment let's forget about the enviroment. I don't like us selling gas to some other country and making it more expensive here. However we are selling meat to other countries and that is raising the price here. As a cattleman I am benefiting from that. I am torn because someone in another country can afford beef that alot of Americans can't. However the benefit that I get I can spend and improve the economy here. There is nothing I can do about it and I am not going to turn it down but on one hand I like it and another I don't. By the way there is no feed lot involved my cattle just eat grass.
Click to expand...

You realize we are a net importer of beef, with fully 30% of our beef from foreign sources. By the way, the height of irony, 32 foreign countries import beef and other meats to the U.S., without USDA inspection or requirement, but it is illegal for your state lisenced packing plant to sell meat across state line. Meat from China is OK but not meat from South Dakota, in Minnesota, without USDA inspection. Nice!
 
oldandnew said:
You realize we are a net importer of beef, with fully 30% of our beef from foreign sources. By the way, the height of irony, 32 foreign countries import beef and other meats to the U.S., without USDA inspection or requirement, but it is illegal for your state lisenced packing plant to sell meat across state line. Meat from China is OK but not meat from South Dakota, in Minnesota, without USDA inspection. Nice!
Click to expand...

Not exactly a true statement.

http://www.fsis.usda.gov/Factsheets/Importing_Meat_Poultry_Egg_Products/index.asp

Importing Meat, Poultry & Egg Products to the United States

Summary
The Food Safety and Inspection Service is the U.S. Department of Agriculture’s public health regulatory agency that protects consumers by ensuring that meat, poultry and egg products are safe, wholesome, and accurately labeled. A substantial amount of imported meat and poultry products are available to American consumers.

In the United States, FSIS regulates meat, poultry and egg products. However, all remaining foods are regulated by the Department of Health and Human Service’s Food and Drug Administration (FDA). As such, there are different import requirements for different types of imported food.

Comparison of the FSIS & FDA Import Process
FDA relies solely on point-of-entry inspection. FSIS, on the other hand, works collaboratively with the importing establishment’s government and uses a three-part process to verify that other countries’ regulatory systems for meat, poultry and egg products are equivalent to that of the U.S. and that products entering the U.S. are safe and wholesome.

FDA’s inspection requirements are company specific, meaning companies must register with FDA before importing food products other than meat, poultry and egg products.

FSIS, instead of dealing directly with individual companies, coordinates with the government of the country before accepting meat, poultry or egg products for sale into U.S. commerce.

The FSIS Reinspection Process

Every day, FSIS carries out a stringent and comprehensive program designed to ensure the safety and wholesomeness of imported meat, poultry and egg products.
Thirty-three countries are eligible to import meat and poultry products to the U.S. In 2002, meat and poultry product imports were 3.8 billion pounds (1.7 million metric tons).
Reinspection begins with FSIS determining that a country’s federal inspection system is equivalent to that of the U.S. While other countries’ meat, poultry and egg product regulatory systems do not need to be identical to the FSIS system, they must employ equivalent measures that provide the same level of protection against food safety hazards.
FSIS uses a comprehensive system that involves document reviews, on-site audits and port-of-entry examinations of every shipment of product that enters the United States.
The term reinspection is appropriate because all products are previously inspected and passed by the importing country’s equivalent inspection system. Thus, reinspection is a second level of protection for the American public.
Each meat, poultry and egg product shipment enters the country under the authority of U.S. Customs and USDA’S Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS) and is transferred to FSIS where inspectors visually inspect every shipment as well as its accompanying documentation.
FSIS import inspectors stationed at ports-of-entry across the country conduct in-depth, random reinspection of selected shipments as directed by a centralized computer programmed to identify products that may be problematic.
A new system for random selection of shipments was implemented in the fall of 2002. Shipments are reinspected at a frequency that provides a 95 percent confidence level that any problem affecting the safety or wholesomeness of the product will be identified by FSIS inspectors.
The new system is a more scientific approach to sampling because it assures that sampling is spread across all types of products that are imported from another country. As a result, FSIS can be assured that all products under FSIS jurisdiction, regardless of the volume imported to the United States, are sampled. In general, the higher risk ready-to-eat products are being sampled at a higher rate.
In September 2002, FSIS began to deploy the first of its 20 new, highly-trained FSIS Import Surveillance Liaison Inspectors in major ports across the U.S. to conduct intensified oversight activities, with an emphasis on biosecurity concerns. They work closely with other Federal agencies to ensure our nation’s biosecurity efforts are seamless.

FSIS Import Application Process

To import to the U.S., countries must first complete the FSIS eligibility application package. To ensure that this process goes smoothly, FSIS provides as much advice and guidance as needed to other governments concerning any portion of the process.
When FSIS receives the completed application, it conducts an initial document analysis to compare the country’s inspection system sanitary measures with the ones that are applied in the U.S.
After reviewing the entire application, FSIS decides whether the foreign food regulatory system for meat, poultry and egg products is equivalent to the FSIS regulatory process. Additionally, FSIS makes certain that the other country’s regulatory system provides the same level of public health protection that is attained in the U.S.
If it is determined that both of these objectives are met then FSIS sends a multidisciplinary team of experts to that country to conduct an on-site audit of its entire meat, poultry or egg products regulatory system. This is done in order for FSIS to verify that the country has satisfactorily implemented all laws, regulations, and other inspection or certification requirements cited in the initial application.
After the on-site audit has been successfully completed, FSIS will publish a proposed regulation, which proposes to add the country to FSIS’ list of eligible exporters. There is a period of time in which the Agency must collect public comments to this proposed regulation to help FSIS make a final decision as to whether the country can be eligible to export meat, poultry or egg products to the U.S.
It is important to note that FSIS does not conduct food inspections in another country, nor does it certify individual foreign establishments for export to the U.S. After it is determined that a country has an equivalent food regulatory system, FSIS will rely on that system to carry out daily inspection and then re-inspect upon arrival at U.S. import stations.
Any foreign establishment that desires to export to the U.S. must apply to its own government, and that country’s chief inspection official must certify to FSIS a list of all establishments in that country that meet FSIS’ import requirements.
 
Wirehairs said:
Also China can only export Chicken to the US.:D


http://www.fsis.usda.gov/pdf/Countries_Products_Eligible_for_Export.pdf
Click to expand...


How about the mountains of Chinese raised tilapia fish along with others farm raised fish in china, raised in sewage ponds?

http://www.newjerseynewsroom.com/healthquest/the-dangers-of-farm-raised-tilapia-from-china

BY DR. MICHAEL L. SMITH
COMMENTARY
Appeared originally on Studio V Health Wordpress

As a proponent of healthy eating and educating the public on sound evidence based research, I find it very alarming that there is a significant trend in this country whereby many people accept as fact, “the foods that we import that are so abundant in our supermarkets must be okay to eat, otherwise the government wouldn’t allow it”. Sound strange?

Well, I heard one of my patients say this to me just the other day when we were having a discussion about the pros and cons of eating fish as a regular source of protein in our diets. Let me introduce to you, what has become extremely popular on the average Americans dinner table over the past few years and that is tilapia. You’ve seen it, perhaps have eaten it at home or even in your local restaurant. In fact, it’s become so popular that Kevin Fitzsimmons, a professor at the University of Arizona and board member of HQ Sustainable Maritime Industries, that sells Chinese farm-raised tilapia was recently quoted, “Tilapia is going to be basically where chicken is with poultry”.

The U.S. currently imports about 80 percent of the frozen tilapia from China. So what’s the problem with this scenario?

Consumers need to be made more aware of the problems with eating tilapia that is imported from this world’s largest producer of the farm raised variety. Numerous environmental warnings about Chinese-raised tilapia from such groups as the Monterey Bay Aquarium’s Seafood Watch have put this fish on their “avoid’ list of seafoods, this despite the fact that the U.S. has increased it’s imports every year from 2005 on. Many of the farm raised tilapia are grown in the notoriously polluted areas of China’s Guangdong province.

Recently, the U.S. Agriculture Dept.’s Economic Research Service raised questions about Chinese safety standards for farm-raised fish. The report mentioned, “Fish are often raised in ponds where they feed on waste runoff from poultry and livestock”. It has also been noted that Chinese farmers save money on the cost of raising these fish by dumping animal wastes into the ponds which cause algae to grow and serve as their food source. And don’t forget all of the problems with many other products made in China- toys with lead and toothpastes found to contain diethylene glycol, a poisonous chemical. Even more alarming is the usage of carbon monoxide which preserves the color of the fish and can make the fish appear fresher than it is! If you read the label of many brands (WalMart is one), the only two ingredients listed are “Tilapia” and Carbon Monoxide (To Retain Natural Color)”.

From a nutritional standpoint, tilapia fails miserably when stacked against salmon, tuna, mackerel, sardines and other marine sources of the omega-3 oils which have been shown to have positive effects on cardiovascular disease, blood pressure, stroke, inflammation, and brain health. Tilapia’s flesh doesn’t contain any. And the reason? If the producers used sources of omega-3 enriched meal to feed the tilapia to make them more of a viable healthy food source, the price would increase and that unfortunately is one of the reasons why this fish has become an American dietary staple. So it always comes down to the idea of how much of a price do you pay for eating unhealthy foods to save some money in the long run.

In my office we have a saying, “If you don’t take time for your HEALTH, then you will have to take time for your illness”. Educate yourself by becoming a label reader and asking the question: “Is this really good to put in my body?” and if you can’t pronounce an ingredient and the number of ingredients are many, it’s probably best to avoid.

Strive to be healthier!
 
A very intresting read but I am still a bit leary of all the "its completely safe stuff" ---there are so many shipments and I'll bet not that many inspectors and there is always the bribe thing.;) To many problems within our own food supply--bad burger comes to mind-- that it makes one think--other countries inspection process?

But it is the way it is.
 
Wirehairs said:
Not exactly a true statement.

http://www.fsis.usda.gov/Factsheets/Importing_Meat_Poultry_Egg_Products/index.asp

Importing Meat, Poultry & Egg Products to the United States

Summary
The Food Safety and Inspection Service is the U.S. Department of Agriculture’s public health regulatory agency that protects consumers by ensuring that meat, poultry and egg products are safe, wholesome, and accurately labeled. A substantial amount of imported meat and poultry products are available to American consumers.

In the United States, FSIS regulates meat, poultry and egg products. However, all remaining foods are regulated by the Department of Health and Human Service’s Food and Drug Administration (FDA). As such, there are different import requirements for different types of imported food.

Comparison of the FSIS & FDA Import Process
FDA relies solely on point-of-entry inspection. FSIS, on the other hand, works collaboratively with the importing establishment’s government and uses a three-part process to verify that other countries’ regulatory systems for meat, poultry and egg products are equivalent to that of the U.S. and that products entering the U.S. are safe and wholesome.

FDA’s inspection requirements are company specific, meaning companies must register with FDA before importing food products other than meat, poultry and egg products.

FSIS, instead of dealing directly with individual companies, coordinates with the government of the country before accepting meat, poultry or egg products for sale into U.S. commerce.

The FSIS Reinspection Process

Every day, FSIS carries out a stringent and comprehensive program designed to ensure the safety and wholesomeness of imported meat, poultry and egg products.
Thirty-three countries are eligible to import meat and poultry products to the U.S. In 2002, meat and poultry product imports were 3.8 billion pounds (1.7 million metric tons).
Reinspection begins with FSIS determining that a country’s federal inspection system is equivalent to that of the U.S. While other countries’ meat, poultry and egg product regulatory systems do not need to be identical to the FSIS system, they must employ equivalent measures that provide the same level of protection against food safety hazards.
FSIS uses a comprehensive system that involves document reviews, on-site audits and port-of-entry examinations of every shipment of product that enters the United States.
The term reinspection is appropriate because all products are previously inspected and passed by the importing country’s equivalent inspection system. Thus, reinspection is a second level of protection for the American public.
Each meat, poultry and egg product shipment enters the country under the authority of U.S. Customs and USDA’S Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS) and is transferred to FSIS where inspectors visually inspect every shipment as well as its accompanying documentation.
FSIS import inspectors stationed at ports-of-entry across the country conduct in-depth, random reinspection of selected shipments as directed by a centralized computer programmed to identify products that may be problematic.
A new system for random selection of shipments was implemented in the fall of 2002. Shipments are reinspected at a frequency that provides a 95 percent confidence level that any problem affecting the safety or wholesomeness of the product will be identified by FSIS inspectors.
The new system is a more scientific approach to sampling because it assures that sampling is spread across all types of products that are imported from another country. As a result, FSIS can be assured that all products under FSIS jurisdiction, regardless of the volume imported to the United States, are sampled. In general, the higher risk ready-to-eat products are being sampled at a higher rate.
In September 2002, FSIS began to deploy the first of its 20 new, highly-trained FSIS Import Surveillance Liaison Inspectors in major ports across the U.S. to conduct intensified oversight activities, with an emphasis on biosecurity concerns. They work closely with other Federal agencies to ensure our nation’s biosecurity efforts are seamless.

FSIS Import Application Process

To import to the U.S., countries must first complete the FSIS eligibility application package. To ensure that this process goes smoothly, FSIS provides as much advice and guidance as needed to other governments concerning any portion of the process.
When FSIS receives the completed application, it conducts an initial document analysis to compare the country’s inspection system sanitary measures with the ones that are applied in the U.S.
After reviewing the entire application, FSIS decides whether the foreign food regulatory system for meat, poultry and egg products is equivalent to the FSIS regulatory process. Additionally, FSIS makes certain that the other country’s regulatory system provides the same level of public health protection that is attained in the U.S.
If it is determined that both of these objectives are met then FSIS sends a multidisciplinary team of experts to that country to conduct an on-site audit of its entire meat, poultry or egg products regulatory system. This is done in order for FSIS to verify that the country has satisfactorily implemented all laws, regulations, and other inspection or certification requirements cited in the initial application.
After the on-site audit has been successfully completed, FSIS will publish a proposed regulation, which proposes to add the country to FSIS’ list of eligible exporters. There is a period of time in which the Agency must collect public comments to this proposed regulation to help FSIS make a final decision as to whether the country can be eligible to export meat, poultry or egg products to the U.S.
It is important to note that FSIS does not conduct food inspections in another country, nor does it certify individual foreign establishments for export to the U.S. After it is determined that a country has an equivalent food regulatory system, FSIS will rely on that system to carry out daily inspection and then re-inspect upon arrival at U.S. import stations.
Any foreign establishment that desires to export to the U.S. must apply to its own government, and that country’s chief inspection official must certify to FSIS a list of all establishments in that country that meet FSIS’ import requirements.
Click to expand...

It's that same theory of ironclad inspection that got us the imported ( China), wheat gluten contamination, or deliberately cut with melamine a couple of years ago. Only the naive would put faith in visual container inspection, at the dock, by the same people who are considered to be the weak link in National Security, by the NSA, especially when the import is from a major trade partner we can't afford to offend. In any case the entire process revolves around the sworn statement of foreign dignataries, as we know they never lie or have an agenda. You miss my point completely, the point is you can import all sorts of meat, without USDA, including China, but you can't import meat from South Dakota to say Minnesota, state inspected meat without costly USDA intervention. Who do you trust more, China or South Dakota. We are still a net importer based on dollar for dollar agricultural trade including meat since sometime mid 2010. It is possible that we do not need to be, but the fact is we are!
 
oldandnew said:
California's Salinas Valley nitrate poisoning of groundwater, via fertilizer and dairy runoff. Midwest states probably the same but don't want to do the test and find out. Enjoy. Probably just another exageration by a left wing leaning, liberal bias, anti farmer news rag. http://www.kansascity.com/2012/03/1...ate-contamination.html#storylink=omni_popular
Click to expand...

My cousin's well water is no longer potable due to nitrates, some of which he applied himself to his crops as do all the farmers in that part of Kansas where it's strictly commodity crop farming.
 
USA has been the worlds largest exporter while being the worlds largest importer of beef, we import more tons then export. Exports mainly high quality beef and import commercial grade grinding beef. Mexico has become our biggest export, but lots of calves from Mexico go North to US feedlots.
Brazil has the worlds largest beef herd most exports go to Europe and Asia.
As land gets to valuable for cattle production in the USA look for South America to supply the beef.
I would be Very careful about buying any meat from China, especially fish and sea food. It's not from the sea it's from poop soup.:eek::(:confused:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top