Ditchmaster
Well-known member
Don't forget these guys, worth a look.
http://hk-usa.com/product/pistols/
http://hk-usa.com/product/pistols/
9mm
- Thread starter iowa labs
- Start date
FCSpringer
Moderator
The XDM has a grip safty, and a trigger safety. No fuss fumbling looking for a other safety. It shoots when your ready to shoot. Also has a couple fail safe gadgets that show you if you have a round in the chamber. Very cool. Safest pistol I have owned. Have a Glock, 19ll Smith m and P. All decent pieces. But the XDM is my new safe queen and the finest hand gun I have laid eyes on. Between this and a Glock, its a toss up with all my cop friends. Glock was the king for a while with them, but the XDM is taking over quick. Basicaly as soon as you let one of them use it.
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.I'm just curious, but how effective are 12 guage slugs against bears. Are we talking, black, brown or both ?
koja48
New member
Very effective, Fred. I had cause to shoot one troublesome black bear one time & it dropped immediately. Shotties with slugs & .45-70 Marlin guide Guns are carried by a lot of guides in big bear country up north, which is the reason I started doing so back in Montana when I was guiding elk hunters in my youth. A short-barreled shotgun is easy to carry, access, & get into action quickly when needed.
I've never hunted out west before. I would love to go elk hunting one day. I was watching a show on the outdoor channel a couple years ago and the guides were using Benelli slug guns for back up on bear hunt in Alaska. I always wondered how a large lead slug would work on a heavy boned animal such as a bear. Do any companies make a specialized slug for bear ?
Shawk
Member
These would probably be my favorite three. I thought the Glock thing was all hype until I bought one and it's probably my favorite now. There's something about the XDM's that just say quality to me... don't know what it is, but I like these guns and the M & P's have a big following to. Dry fire each... you may not like the trigger on one of them... I do, but the are quite different. Take a peak at each, see which one fits the best and go with it.
This guys videos are fun to watch and pretty informative... he's a big Glock guy but gives good reviews on just about everything.
https://www.youtube.com/user/hickok45/videos
Nimrod has it pegged:
Glock-well established record of reliability
M&P-catching up quickly, better fit with changeable backstraps
XD- not bad, but bigger/chunkier in size
PPQ-best trigger/accuracy of the bunch
For a bump up in price, the new H&K VPM's are very nice.
Finally, the 9/40/45 debate is over. With the best of today's defense ammo, FBI reports that the 9 is as effective as the other two. In fact, LE is switching over to the 9 from .40's in droves, not only for the higher capacity, but their folks can qualify easier than than with the snappy .40's.
I shoot a lot of pistol ammo in USPSA, and shoot 9's much better than .40 or .45. If most people are honest, they will admit to shooting 9's more accurately as well. Most of those I still see carrying/shooting .45's do so out of reverance for the caliber/1911, rather than their actual shooting ability.
Glock-well established record of reliability
M&P-catching up quickly, better fit with changeable backstraps
XD- not bad, but bigger/chunkier in size
PPQ-best trigger/accuracy of the bunch
For a bump up in price, the new H&K VPM's are very nice.
Finally, the 9/40/45 debate is over. With the best of today's defense ammo, FBI reports that the 9 is as effective as the other two. In fact, LE is switching over to the 9 from .40's in droves, not only for the higher capacity, but their folks can qualify easier than than with the snappy .40's.
I shoot a lot of pistol ammo in USPSA, and shoot 9's much better than .40 or .45. If most people are honest, they will admit to shooting 9's more accurately as well. Most of those I still see carrying/shooting .45's do so out of reverance for the caliber/1911, rather than their actual shooting ability.
FCSpringer
Moderator
I own 3, the XDM, a Glock, and an MP. My fav is the XDM, smoothest trigger, largest round factory mag and the gun will speak for itself when you look at the features. I find it the opposite in my 4.5", it is the least bulky. No one has as nice a factory gear kit. And if the 4.5 is too bulky, which I find hard to believe, there is compact shorter barrel ones with identical features. It is my most accurate, and it is not even the 5.25" target model designed yet for even further accuracy. (My next one). Even stepping up in price its hard to beat. For 500 bucks, real hard. As far as the name goes I think Springfield speaks for itself. No maker has such American history. "The shot heard round the world" This line they added and perfected, just speaks American pride.
Massachusetts is a bit of a dichotomy. In a region rich in firearms history, the state has some of the most restrictive gun laws.
It was in Massachusetts where the shot “heard ‘round the world” was fired: American colonials who refused to be disarmed by British troops. How ironic then, that where the free men of that state made a stand and declared they would not be disarmed, is the same location where citizens are not allowed to own scary looking rifles or even standard capacity magazines.
But, it is this region of the United States where many of the country’s guns have been manufactured during the past 230+ years. The nation’s first, last and most important national armory was located in Springfield. It is the Springfield Armory that has helped to keep the USA free for all of these years.
The Armory is now a National Historic Site with a museum that warms the hearts of gun enthusiasts and makes hippies cry.
Massachusetts is a bit of a dichotomy. In a region rich in firearms history, the state has some of the most restrictive gun laws.
It was in Massachusetts where the shot “heard ‘round the world” was fired: American colonials who refused to be disarmed by British troops. How ironic then, that where the free men of that state made a stand and declared they would not be disarmed, is the same location where citizens are not allowed to own scary looking rifles or even standard capacity magazines.
But, it is this region of the United States where many of the country’s guns have been manufactured during the past 230+ years. The nation’s first, last and most important national armory was located in Springfield. It is the Springfield Armory that has helped to keep the USA free for all of these years.
The Armory is now a National Historic Site with a museum that warms the hearts of gun enthusiasts and makes hippies cry.
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FCSpringer
Moderator
This is a fun thread. Hey I just dug all mine out. The G17 is the lightest, well almost exactly the same as the MP. But the grips are bigger on both then the XDM. The XDM has the best palm fit, because of ergonomics. Bulky? no. None of them are bulky. The XDM weighs 4 ounces more then both. But S & W weighs the gun with out a mag it says, where the XDM is weighed with an empty mag. So I believe they weigh about exactly the same. If there is a slight more weight on the XDM it is not noticeable, and I bet it would come from the capability of 2 more rounds and slightly longer barrel. XDM 4.5, mp 4.25 G17 4.48. All are fine guns, all are in similar price points. Still even after digging out my other girlfriends, the XDM would be the last one I would sell ya. The MP would be out the door first. But none are for sale LOL. I just love the fit of the XDM, the 2 extra rounds, and the features it has over the others. Now I have no idea about how any of them will hold up in weather rust wise. I never have shot in the rain or hunted with any of them. I would weigh that in as well. If there is anyone who has battle tested them as far as finish. My guess is all would rust easy if not attended to. Also in your search, heck, just buy the one you get a steal on LOL.
FCSpringer
Moderator
I am a fan of the striker fire guns. H and K looks like they want a piece of the pie Glock SW and Springfield now all have. Not sure this one will catch on though. I would have to shoot it to see if the more money thing is worth it. I doubt it. But I would really love to try out that 45 tactical :thumbsup:
Nimrod
Member
I was trained to believe that the 45 was far better than a 9mm but two technological advances have convinced me otherwise.
One is the significant improvement in performance from ammo manufacturers to ensure consistent penetration & expansion. The other is the proliferation of security & dash cam footage that proves beyond a doubt that ALL HANDGUN CALIBERS SUCK.
There is simply too much evidence of people being shot who didn?t stop fighting. If you understand that the only places you can put a bullet to ensure a one top stop? are so small & difficult to hit under realistic conditions that the best tactic is to put multiple holes into an assailant as quickly as possible, you?ll choose the 9mm.
I don?t care how good you are w/ a 40 or 45, you will be able to put multiple rounds on target faster w/ a similar sized 9mm.
LOl your wrong period. the wyoming 500 will blow you off the planet in one shot. it will pick you up and deposit you down range bout 50 feet. so be more informed or be quiet. The 9mm is not enough ang if you cant believe it. Why was the the usmc and others dumped it. Wow man
Nimrod
Member
Cool story bro.
So by your "logic", I guess the USMC is going with the Wyoming 500? Why not the more powerful 500 S&W? Oh, because it would throw them too far backward I suppose.
I'm actually pretty well informed on this subject. The U.S. military is restricted to ball ammo which is far less effective at (realistic) handgun velocities than Hollow points. If I was limited to ball, I'd prefer a 45 but that isn't the point of this thread.
Law enforcement agencies including the FBI are transitioning from the 40 cal back to the 9mm these days for the reasons I mentioned.
FCSpringer
Moderator
Jmac your a little out of line here LOL. Easy big fella. Nimrod is right. Its the new big thing for law enforcement. A 9 is plenty big. And the subject is actually about a 9, and which ones he can buy that give the most bang for the buck.
The reason around here in my town that you can not get the 9mm ammo is because of law enforcement. 45 acp never went out of stock here. 9mm is gone as fast as it hits the shelf. They have a cop school here, and a large force. They go through loads of it. It will work fine on gang banger intruders if needed. The only thing better then 19 rounds at ya to me would be 1 in each hand so I had 38.
The reason around here in my town that you can not get the 9mm ammo is because of law enforcement. 45 acp never went out of stock here. 9mm is gone as fast as it hits the shelf. They have a cop school here, and a large force. They go through loads of it. It will work fine on gang banger intruders if needed. The only thing better then 19 rounds at ya to me would be 1 in each hand so I had 38.
koja48
New member
I carried & shot .45's (and .357, .41, & .44) for years & still do on occasion. However, as I've aged & my hands/knuckles became a bit arthritic, I found that .380's & 9mm's became much more enjoyable to shoot & carry than the larger calibers. With the right ammo, both will do the job I want them to do. While I have several striker models, for downright accuracy & multiple round shooting days at the range, my CZ75B tops them all in my old hands. Same with long guns; I tend to avoid calibers that kill at one end & detach retinas or maim at the other. Bottom line: Carry & shoot what you want, which pleases you, and which you can use accurately and efficiently; it comes down to personal choice & comfort level/proficiency. Over the years, I've seen a lot of folks shoot terribly with firearms that thumped them so much that they were afraid of them.
WOW what a range of opinions
I went to the gun range with my aunt (a pistol packing grandma:thumbsup. She swears bye her glock 9mm. Fun to shoot heck i even let my daughter squeeze off a few rounds. So far I'm leaning towards the Springfield (i like the safety).
My process of looking around has been slowed because of PHEASANT HUNTING. Well that's over now so back to the gun hunt. :cheers:
I went to the gun range with my aunt (a pistol packing grandma:thumbsup
. She swears bye her glock 9mm. Fun to shoot heck i even let my daughter squeeze off a few rounds. So far I'm leaning towards the Springfield (i like the safety).My process of looking around has been slowed because of PHEASANT HUNTING
. Well that's over now so back to the gun hunt. :cheers:
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WOW what a range of opinions!
I went to the gun range with my aunt (a pistol packing grandma:thumbsup. She swears bye her glock 9mm. Fun to shoot heck i even let my daughter squeeze off a few rounds. So far I'm leaning towards the Springfield (i like the safety).
My process of looking around has been slowed because of PHEASANT HUNTING. Well that's over now so back to the gun hunt. :cheers:
I went to the gun range with my aunt (a pistol packing grandma:thumbsup
. She swears bye her glock 9mm. Fun to shoot heck i even let my daughter squeeze off a few rounds. So far I'm leaning towards the Springfield (i like the safety).My process of looking around has been slowed because of PHEASANT HUNTING
. Well that's over now so back to the gun hunt. :cheers:
kick them up
Active member
Depending on the intended use I may have some input here.
The most widely carried .9mm by military and LEO worldwide is a CZ 75B. With that said I am bias since I work for CZ but would be happy to help you in your quest for a .9mm.
Please feel free to PM your questions.
Rich AKA Kick Them UP
CZ-USA Prostaff.
The most widely carried .9mm by military and LEO worldwide is a CZ 75B. With that said I am bias since I work for CZ but would be happy to help you in your quest for a .9mm.
Please feel free to PM your questions.
Rich AKA Kick Them UP
CZ-USA Prostaff.