Make my lab stop pointing

moellermd

moellermd

Super Moderator
If the birds are holding good my lab will often point them. When looking back at last years hunts in my log, I noticed I missed more birds off of point then on flushes. This fact is of course quite emberrsing when hunting with other people. One I shot at off point had me standing with an empty gun and a rooster still flying :mad: You loose a lot of cool points with the rest of the hunting party when this happens. I seem to do much better on flushing birds. I think the problem is that I approch the bird with the mind set that it is a done deal. I end up shooting under it as I try to watch the bird fall before the pellets hit it. :confused: Anyone else ever encounter this problem or is it just me.
 
Ok, I'll throw out my theory so somebody can shoot holes in it.

My first guess is a pointed bird is missed because the shot ends up over the bird. When a lab points a rooster, that rooster is most likely at the end of the lab's nose. When the hunter comes up behind the lab, the bird flushes straight away and higher than the shouldered gun. The shooter places the gun on the bird and pulls the trigger, but the shot is on the rise as it moves through the air and the bird is probably leveled off and haulin. As a result the shot ends up first behind the bird path and then goes over the bird.

When the lab flushes a rooster, the hunter is probably not right behind the lab. The shots tend to be more crossing shots where there's more perception on the lead needed to hit the bird.

And you are right, it's very fustrating when your lab locks up on a rooster and you end up missing the bird. :eek:
 
Dewey has a good point the bird is still rising. My idea is that you shooting at it while it is to close for the shot string to open up. In other words you are choked to tight for pointed birds. Slow down on your shot and let it get out more so shot opens and the birds levels out. My dog points all my birds and I shoot an O/U. In the top barrel my last shot I have a Regular Modified but in the bottom my first shot. I have an Improved Cylinder or a Light modified---Bob
 
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moellermd said:
If the birds are holding good my lab will often point them. When looking back at last years hunts in my log, I noticed I missed more birds off of point then on flushes. This fact is of course quite emberrsing when hunting with other people. One I shot at off point had me standing with an empty gun and a rooster still flying :mad: You loose a lot of cool points with the rest of the hunting party when this happens. I seem to do much better on flushing birds. I think the problem is that I approch the bird with the mind set that it is a done deal. I end up shooting under it as I try to watch the bird fall before the pellets hit it. :confused: Anyone else ever encounter this problem or is it just me.
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I have a question Do you like hunting ??? I mean the type of hunting where you don't keep logs or don't worry about what other people think if you miss the shot ??

Why is it that hunters over analyze things and worrying about what people think of your dog or if you miss the shot ??. My definition of hunting is going out with my dog or dogs, with or without buddies and just HUNT not worry
what other people think, because if you criticized my dog or the way I shoot you better be pro trainer and a true marksman.

I feel to many people get rapped up in the material thing and forget about the true aspect of what hunting is about, which is to have FUN ,FEEL the Rush of shooting Birds, Watching your dog do what it is trained to do. So basically go out and enjoy nature , don't be anal on things because something will go wrong.... deal with....move on. Also learned to worked with your dog try different things you may be surprised on the results. thats my opinion.

I am DR. Jekl and I approve this message
 
MR HYDE I think that for a lot of people keeping a journal is way to enjoy hunting after the season has closed. A way to look back and reminisce. Do I really care if I get some crap when I miss an easy shot? No, it is all part of the fun of hunting for me. But it is nice to hit what you are shooting at. Do I really want my lab to not point? No. Which part of this makes you think that I "really" do not enjoy hunting is beyond me. I just saw a reoccurring theme in my hunts and thought I would throw it out for discussion. It is all part of the fun for me. :)
 
Well here is a couple of ideas for you. I train and raise pointing labs and love shooting birds off point. Often let my labs range out a couple hundred yrds becuase they point that good.

Get some pen raised birds put them down hard and let the dog catch them. He will more than likely quit pointing them when he knows he can catch them then he should flush wild birds.

Second idea is tell the dog to fetch as soon as the dog gets on point.

Not my idea but done by some is a swift kick in the butt when they go on point.

Best idea is learn to shoot better:D
 
I think you guys are right the bird probably is still rising. I still think that I am shooting under them. I do shoot an IC but waiting a little longer would help. Good point Dewey on the short lab points. Maybe part of the solution is to swing up and through the bird while shooting instead of holding straight on.
 
moellermd said:
MR HYDE I think that for a lot of people keeping a journal is way to enjoy hunting after the season has closed. A way to look back and reminisce. Do I really care if I get some crap when I miss an easy shot? No, it is all part of the fun of hunting for me. But it is nice to hit what you are shooting at. Do I really want my lab to not point? No. Which part of this makes you think that I "really" do not enjoy hunting is beyond me. I just saw a reoccurring theme in my hunts and thought I would throw it out for discussion. It is all part of the fun for me. :)
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MOELLERMD
When I read your post I get the sense you get up-tight with yourself trying to hard prove something to everybody and not enjoying what hunting suppose to be.
The reason why I say that is because I have a friend who basically does the same thing you do he worries about what people think or say about him and doesn't necessarily enjoy himself while hunting, he gets too worried about if he brought the right Ammo or the right gun or if his clothes blended right with the surroundings. So I tell him everytime we go out is to have fun, thats what we are here... for is to have fun.

So if I offended you I'm sorry, I figure there is too much emphasis on Technology these days and not on hunting Chinese Chickens or waterfowl.

Dr.Jekyll
 
moellermd said:
If the birds are holding good my lab will often point them. When looking back at last years hunts in my log, I noticed I missed more birds off of point then on flushes. This fact is of course quite emberrsing when hunting with other people. One I shot at off point had me standing with an empty gun and a rooster still flying :mad: You loose a lot of cool points with the rest of the hunting party when this happens. I seem to do much better on flushing birds. I think the problem is that I approch the bird with the mind set that it is a done deal. I end up shooting under it as I try to watch the bird fall before the pellets hit it. :confused: Anyone else ever encounter this problem or is it just me.
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Yes, you are shooting under those birds. A pheasant flush, like any other good drug, will scramble your brain; and therefore every neuron you have wants to "see too much bird". The discipline, good luck, is to "blot" the rising bird out of your sight picture with the barrel of a rising gun, ergo see the bird - miss the bird. You may also want to try shooting from the hip.
The other problem with your lab is obvious, and I'm afraid it's only going to get worse. You go pheasant hunting to often. Your lab, any lab, and in your case probably a bichon frise will point/flash point if exposed to enough roosters. You may be able to teach it to flush with a verbal command and have the best of both worlds, had a shorthair that would do that (rest in peace Joe), my current shorthair Taz will not flush on command even if I yell and scream and kick him in the butt, so I bought a lab.
Above all just have fun, my older brother John has been shooting flushed birds better than solid points for over 20 years and I love him anyway.
 
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Make your Lab stop pointing! Why? There are a lot of guys out there that would love to have your problem. The problem is not the dog. It's the hunter. :)

I think you should consider yourself fortunate to have a Lab that points that well. Good luck.
 
I have a suggestion: get involved in a gun club shoot some Trap or Skeet. While shooting at the clays have someone that knows shooting help you with the art of a good swing. Meaning when you come up and unto the bird and shoot keep swinging the gun. Your follow-thru in very important and should not be taken lightly. It will help your shooting. I shoot a lot of Trap. When a bird flushes I sometimes say to myself "station 3 hard right" and shoot the bird accordingly.
 
I tend to agree with niceshot about being behind and underneathe in missing pointed birds. It's probably also a matter of doing what your used to, if you have always hunted behind a flusher you are used to those shots and reaction time. Now with a pointer, things are different but whats new becomes old and time afield will resolve.
 
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dont shoot too quickly

I had the rare privilege to hunt with Uncle Buck a few years ago and he said the same thing about my shooting as he stated earlier. Don't shoot to quickly!!! I had a friend give me a gun on credit this year that had the safety in a different position than my previous gun which initially led to alot of frustration when it came to capturing the beloved long tail. That frustration eventually led to a blessing in the fact that I have now slowed way down on pulling the trigger. That "slowing down" has led to many more clean kills, many more single shot birds, and many more completely dead birds delivered to hand.

It is truly amazing that many birds we think may be or will soon become out of range truly come into range as we develop a more diliberate pull on the ole trigger. I can attest that thinking too much is no good but developing a pause on the trigger pull hasn't hurt me at all and I doubt it will hurt anyone.

Here is a toast to all dogs, retrievers or pointers alike, that will make us aware of the bird that rests at our very feet.
 
Tpharkman--I agree completely with your post and slowing down on the shot. Early last season I was missing pheasants with the first shot and hitting them with the second shot. I hunt Huns for six weeks before pheasant season and they get up so fast that I got into some bad habits of shooting to quickly.

Regarding a lab pointing, my lab will go on point periodically and I never saw this as a problem. In fact I kind of got enjoyed it as we both could anticiapte the flush. At other times she will point for a brief moment and then bust into the cover.
 
Don't ever teach your pointing dog to flush. What a way to ruin a good short hair or other pointing dog. And don't knock poodles either. Probly the smartest hunting breed around.
________
Bongo
 
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Uncle Buck said:
Don't ever teach your pointing dog to flush. What a way to ruin a good short hair or other pointing dog. And don't knock poodles either. Probly the smartest hunting breed around.
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??? A dog that will point and then flush roosters with a verbal command is one of life's great pleasures. Admittedly this is against the "rules" but sometimes getting a shot at those buggers requires some creativity. The really cool thing about a dog like this is that no amount of money can buy you one, it just takes a few years a few hundred pheasants and some dumb luck.
 
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niceshot said:
??? A dog that will point and then flush roosters with a verbal command is one of life's great pleasures. Admittedly this is against the "rules" but sometimes getting a shot at those buggers requires some creativity. The really cool thing about a dog like this is that no amount of money can buy you one, it just takes a few years a few hundred pheasants and some dumb luck.
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Dumb luck must of come my way with Ruby. She was not advertised as a pointing lab, but for whatever reason begin pointing from the start of her hunting training. I really like the fact that she will lock up on a bird and then flush the bird when I tell her too. I think it works really great, Ruby can be pointing in a creek bottom and I can be on the banks for a better shot instead of trying to kick the bird up myself.
 
Letting the dog bust the bird might also help my little dilemma. He will bust the bird eventually but usually I walk in close and kick around. Might be better to stand back and let nature happen.
 
Funny...... I pay good money to make sure my labs DO point!! :rolleyes:
 
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