Looking for my first flusher!!

Remi

Remi

New member
Hi all im looking to buy my first flusher for hunting upland here in the northeast. Im stuck between labs springers and boykins. I want a dog that will do good as a house dog with my wife 3 yr old daughter and a golden and i also have a 3 yr old gsp who i use when hunting the open fields. Any help towards my decision is appreciated.
 
I'm a lab guy, I have a chocolate and 2 yellows. They are great with the kids and listen to the wife. The two yellows are inside dogs, the 6month old puppy sleeps on my bed and the 6 year old sleeps on my kids bed...they have kennels but no need for them to be in it, they have not destroyed anything in the house yet!
My cousins husband runs two springers, a male and a female. Part time kennel dogs, in the house fall-spring. Also great with their kids.
I know nothing about the other breed, heck I don't know anything about the breed I have other than they are awesome in the house and unstoppable in the field.
I'm sure the guys on here will have better information for you.

Good luck, I'm sure they'll all be fun
 
Well, there's nothing wrong with a lab or boykin, but when it comes to an all out flushing dog for upland game nothing can top a field bred Springer, and if it's pheasants you're after your search is over,the field bred Springer Spaniel is second to none!
They are outstanding house dogs and will win your wife over in no time, but in the field they are all busines and when they lock onto to a rooster it's flush or die. They are also natural retrievers and very easy to train.
 
Remi said:
Hi all im looking to buy my first flusher for hunting upland here in the northeast. Im stuck between labs springers and boykins. I want a dog that will do good as a house dog with my wife 3 yr old daughter and a golden and i also have a 3 yr old gsp who i use when hunting the open fields. Any help towards my decision is appreciated.
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heck, any untrained dog will work at that, maybe keeping up with it might be a problem, don't waste your money on a good dog

cheers
 
mustistuff said:
heck, any untrained dog will work at that, maybe keeping up with it might be a problem, don't waste your money on a good dog

cheers
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Don't mind musti, he's been staring at the pretty of one of those german dogs too long. Once you work some good bird cover behind a good springy dog you'll know what you've been missing.:cheers:
 
Here we go again:eek:. Just remember with a Lab you won't have to buy a bunch of flags:thumbsup:.
 
FLDBRED said:
Well, there's nothing wrong with a lab or boykin, but when it comes to an all out flushing dog for upland game nothing can top a field bred Springer, and if it's pheasants you're after your search is over,the field bred Springer Spaniel is second to none!
They are outstanding house dogs and will win your wife over in no time, but in the field they are all busines and when they lock onto to a rooster it's flush or die. They are also natural retrievers and very easy to train.
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Where's northeast?? So I'll assume Mid Atlantic or New England or thereabouts? Grouse/ woodcock/ pen raised pheasants/ quail/ doves/ small water ducks etc ??

We lived/ hunted there for three decades so I can speak with some authority. A hunting spaniel is very tough to beat for a great hunting dog/house dog package. And for all practical purposes, that means a fieldbred English Cocker or English Springer as noted above. We run fieldbred E. Cockers, which are grouse/wc specialists here in the upper Midwest but pull duty in South Dakota each November. SoDak guides, whose opinions I value, tell me they do OK there too. One thing I value most about a well bred ECS or ESS is that they come out of the nest box with what they need to know to be an effective gunning companion "already built in". Easiest dogs to train for the field I've ever seen. Goes for both breeds.

Labs are great and if I hunted pheasants/ ducks west of the Mississippi I'd have at least two. Boykins are a nonstarter for me because of that coat and very high incidence of congenital hip dysplasia deeply imbedded into that breed.
 
All good breeds but of course pay attention to breeders and breeding. I have a field bred cocker and a Boykin. The Boykin is a serious retriever but if you hunt big water or geese I'd go lab.
 
Thanks for the replies. My concern with the ESS is that so called "springer rage"? And as far as Boykins go the ones i have been looking at have 3-5 generations of good to excellent OFA's
 
Remi said:
Thanks for the replies. My concern with the ESS is that so called "springer rage"? And as far as Boykins go the ones i have been looking at have 3-5 generations of good to excellent OFA's
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I hope Ken (FLDBRED) will chime in here but from what I know "springer rage" is/was seen in show/pet bred ESS. Temperment is a highly important quality in a fieldbred/house dog and I'd don't think you will ever see it in dogs from top breeders. They are highly selective in what dogs they breed.

Re boykins, if you have 3-5 generations, both sides, of OFA clean hips you are GTG. :D I have always heard of boykins as being excellent "canoe dogs". But maybe that's what you are looking for! :10sign:
 
Remi said:
Thanks for the replies. My concern with the ESS is that so called "springer rage"? And as far as Boykins go the ones i have been looking at have 3-5 generations of good to excellent OFA's
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The disorder you are concerned about is Rage Syndrome, it is also present in other breeds as well, such as Papillion, Border Collie, Dachshund, Golden Retriever, German Shepard, etc. Somewhere along the line Springer got attached to it. It can be traced in Springers back to some very important SHOW winners. It has NEVER BEEN REPORTED IN FIELD BRED SPRINGERS!

I've been around Springers all my life and a sweeter temperment you will not find, much like the Golden Retriever. I've trained, hunted, trialed, these dogs for a lifetime and I have NEVER seen it.

So you can put that concern aside! A man couldn't ask for a better hunting buddy than a Spinger Spaniel.

Dan
 
carptom1 said:
Here we go again:eek:. Just remember with a Lab you won't have to buy a bunch of flags:thumbsup:.
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OK I know the jokes not funny anymore when you have to explain it but care to take pity on me and explain??? Feel like I'm the only guy in the bar not laughing. :eek::D

To get back to the original OP I would have to agree with what others have stated about ESS rage stuff. Talking to different ESS breeders they all say it's a show dog problem and not a field bred problem. All the springer's I have been around have been great dogs.
 
Curious said:
OK I know the jokes not funny anymore when you have to explain it but care to take pity on me and explain??? Feel like I'm the only guy in the bar not laughing. :eek::D

To get back to the original OP I would have to agree with what others have stated about ESS rage stuff. Talking to different ESS breeders they all say it's a show dog problem and not a field bred problem. All the springer's I have been around have been great dogs.
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Curious. The joke has to do with my dogs and the "tame" quail I hunt with them. I guess hunting wild quail with flushers is either impossible or illegal or both in somes mind.
 
quail hound said:
Curious. The joke has to do with my dogs and the "tame" quail I hunt with them. I guess hunting wild quail with flushers is either impossible or illegal or both in somes mind.
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you got it, it is all of the above. from my experience with quail in Kansas and somewhat Colorado, not sure how your dogs would work, the gamble's in ariz. I hunted they would work great I think at least if they figured out the cactus. in as much as I have never hunted over a springer, it would be interesting anyway, if it didn't work, so what. if I had the dogs, I would use them pure and simple, there ya have it

cheers
 
OK guys, stop the jabs please LOL. First Mustif or who ever I Think the world is perfectly capable of realizing that a good field bred ESS is capable of hunting any bird, anywhere on the planet. Aside from Ostrich and others of that nature LOL. If you need references of how they do on Quail, ducks, geese, grouse etc, let me know. I can give you plenty of names to call that have dogs of mine doing it in all corners of the US on every American game bird just fine and dandy. Some hunt TX quail exclusively, some ducks exclusively and so on. They are very versatile. Most cases great in the house. But as with any breed, there are some slobs too LOL. Rage yes is a show thing as far as I know. I have seen some field bred dogs that just don't get along with others, or will act tough in the crate toward strangers. But never seen any ones just fly across the landscape to attack people or that sort of thing. Mostly they can be annoying wanting you to do something with them LOL. The flag thing got going I believe quite some time ago when some ones dog never cut the mustard in a trial or hunt test so they chose to cut it down. Flags are used to set a coarse, where dogs are still judged by use of wind, control, finds, trailing ability, steadiness, honors and much more. It is live birds, and in most states simulates hunting to the best they can within a certain large field. They are used to keep order to otherwise kayos and be able to do an event in a functional manner. But with anything, if your not good at it, you may put it down. I do both, I trial, and I hunt. The dogs are perfectly capable of knowing the difference. Happy to show what a field champion can do on wild birds any time someone wants to tag along. Good luck in your search and decision. Let us know what you find and if you want help Let us know. Always happy to help a person find a good ESS that fits if that's the way you go. I know lots of good folks.:thumbsup:
 
My dogs have the pleasure to hunt 3 species of quail every season and they do well at producing all three to the gun though the cactus has a way of turning a hard flush into a flash "point" so I don't recommend gambles quail to field trial springers but field trial dogs mine aren't. Springers excel at pheasant hunting for sure but they are all around bird dogs and I would expect mine to make game in any bird cover I drop them in. Would they do as well as a big ranging pointer hunting chickens in the sand hills, of course not but that doesn't mean I wouldn't try it.
 
oh oh

don't get sensitive, this isn't the place for it. anybody that would truly put down a dog just ain't worth listening too. kidding ought to be allowed however and sometimes a thicker skin is in order. I for one would love to hunt over a springer, never had the chance, read about them and like most of the other breeds, they don't walk on water either. enjoy them, I do mine

cheers
 
Kidding is just fine. Its false information that someone has no clue about that is unwarranted;). Most can take jokes all day. But as we have seen in the past the dog threads have a certain path they can take. So best to clear the air right away when people are being mislead. If this were about pointing labs I would offer no advice. But yes, I would expect my dog to do well or as good in any cover we put them in. Field trial dog or not. Fact is when we travel they do. I have ran out west, out east, mid west, and in texas. We trained in cactus in TX:D. So that thinking or thought is just an opinion. QH I know some folks out your way that trial and hunt those same birds along with wild chukar:thumbsup: The fella who owns one in TX deals with cactus all the time. When I was there I trained for 2 weeks with Gary and Cindy Wilson, Bill Boeckman. Some of the most successful pros in the ESS game. Trust me, we disliked cactus, but we dealt with it, and the flush is fine:D. No they don't walk on water, but they love it. When it comes to any breed if someone wants info and you have no real knowledge of the breed and don't own one, it is best to just refrain from providing false info.;) Not whining, and don't need thick skin here, just clearing the air with facts.:cheers:
 
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