How far do u let ur gsp range
- Thread starter DIRKNPHEZ
- Start date
kansasbrittany
Banned
What is your personal comfort level with ranging? I've found that when my GSP disappears in the CRP, he's not ranging, he's tracking a rooster. 9 times of 10 when I can't find him, a rooster busts in the distance. He doesn't range much until he finds something to track.
I know this doesn't answer your question, but it is a matter of personal comfort. I just let 'em go. Sure, he bumps roosters occasionally, but some of them will hold long enough for me to get there. His range is perfect for quail IMO (100 yards or more depending on the cover/terrain).
I usually only hunt with one other guy and his gsp. His doesnt range like mine does. I trust my dog to get out. He has bumped a couple here and there but thats gonna happen. I too have noticed when i loose him in the crp a rooster tends to jump somewhere and thats where he is. At first it used to bother me but now after a couple yrs im figuring him out and it seems to be working. When quail hunting i let him range as long as i can see him. He will hold them till i get there 9/10 times.
kansasbrittany
Banned
We're having a very similar experience with our dogs. Those of us that like to hunt both Q&P at the same time spend a lot of time thinking about how far our dogs should range. If you plan to primarily hunt one species at a time it's pretty easy to figure out . I don't necessarily want an underfoot dog quail hunting and I don't necessarily want 'em to be out 500 yards when pheasant hunting.
The other challenge for me is hunting in groups vs. 1 or 2 guys. By myself or with one other person I can just follow him wherever he goes. I love big CRP fields by myself. There is no game-plan; no "walk this edge down, that one over, back through the blah, blah, blah". When it's just us, he's always between 30 and 50 yards out and we haul butt through the field until he slows down or stops. It's not so much him ranging as it is me keeping up with him.
In groups, he's expected to just go back and forth in front of the line. He does tend to move a little too fast for most folks when he's on a scent. Most group hunters I've been around like the underfoot dogs. Duke (GWP) is always everyone's favorite. Truth is, he gets a lot of retrieves because he's always right there by you. The GSP finds 5 times more pheasants than the GWP. He also finds more coveys of quail, but if you know where the singles are, the scales are balanced for the close-ranging GWP and they're about equal. The GWP never bumps birds out of range....he never gets out of range. The GSP bumped a few birds out of range this weekend, but we never would've saw 'em if he hadn't
I only hunted quail behind V-john's V-dogs, and it was only one time, but they're the real deal when it comes to quail. I'm not sure how they'd be in a big grass patch that's just packed with birds (see SD pheasant hunting or W KS on a good year). I mean, you wouldn't want to have to walk 500 yards to a rooster point in a place like that
Setternut could tell us. I believe he's the one that mentioned he doesn't care for the SD style hunting for this reason or something similar. wolfcreeknc, get out here buddy! I don't get to go back to pheasant country until you get here. 10-15 posts from me today.....I'm on a 3-day-pheasant-brain-bender....ok, maybe 4 or 5
shorthairs4life
New member
Most importantly it depends on if your dog is broke or not. If the dog is broke then I'm willing to let it go a little further. (80 to 100 yards tops)
Next it would depend on the cover. If its cover I can see the dog in, then I'm more forgiving with a broke dog. If the cover is thick I don't let the dog get very far (40 to 50 yards max). Also if we are in spot that typically holds birds I try to keep the dog in unless he's telling me otherwise.
mustistuff
Banned
broke dog
range is like how far is up. a broke dog's range will mostly be controlled by his confidence level and bird spoor. dogs hunt closer in heavy cover cause they don't know where you are, in sparse cover they range further cause they can see you and keep track of you, therefore they are comfortable, they should still be biddable however. if you do your job, rule # 1 it is your responsibility to put the dog down in a field that has birds. if you do, the dog won't range far cause he is too busy hunting, dogs come to hunt, no birds, expect the dog to smarten up and look harder and that will include more range. no dog should be hunting in the next field but you should let him hunt and rule #2 is to follow the dog. that's all there is too it. also with a broke dog, he knows far more about what's in the field than you do, don't boss him around
cheers
range is like how far is up. a broke dog's range will mostly be controlled by his confidence level and bird spoor. dogs hunt closer in heavy cover cause they don't know where you are, in sparse cover they range further cause they can see you and keep track of you, therefore they are comfortable, they should still be biddable however. if you do your job, rule # 1 it is your responsibility to put the dog down in a field that has birds. if you do, the dog won't range far cause he is too busy hunting, dogs come to hunt, no birds, expect the dog to smarten up and look harder and that will include more range. no dog should be hunting in the next field but you should let him hunt and rule #2 is to follow the dog. that's all there is too it. also with a broke dog, he knows far more about what's in the field than you do, don't boss him around
cheers
kansasbrittany
Banned
Wow KB your so drunk on the pheasant you posted it twice
Thanks Tom, didn't even notice
Time to eat some pheasant nuggets with the family
We'll see how the baby girl reacts to her first taste.
HUNTIN4FUN
Member
You always hear everyone saying trust the dog, in this case that is exactly what you have to do provided you given him all the tools to do the job right. I have a big running female GSP that I have no problem letting get out there well past 100 yards. A few years back in western KS she had made a huge cast at about 300 yds or so and locked down a handful of roosters. Truth be told I probably wouldn't have went to these birds if it weren't for her, the cover was less than ideal. We are bias as hunters on what habitat we think looks best but a good dog will search it all. IMO if the dog can range and hold the birds provided the conditions are right I would let them. It all comes down to personal preference.
KATroutman13
Member
Breed of the dog shouldn't matter, there are fellas out in Idaho hunting chukars with GSPs that are running at 700-800 yards. As a previous poster said, you need to figure out what you want out of the dog. With that being said, here are my opinions, for what they are worth:
1) It depends on the cover and a dog should adapt to that cover. For instance, we go to Montana every year. These are wide open spaces, even compared to Kansas and I can see a dog and a dog can see me for an incredibly long distance. In that cover, if I look down at my Garmin and he's at 600 to 700 yards, I think -- good dog. If we are hunting CRP, my dogs adapt because it is harder to run through and it is harder to keep in contact with me, but I would still say 100 yards is too close for me. I still like to see a dog at 200 or so in the CRP. If we are hunting creek bottoms or field edges (something linear), about my only cares are that the dog not be on a road and that he be on the land that we have permission to hunt. If he's hanging around at 100 yards, to me, he's not trying hard enough to find birds.
2) By limiting the dogs range, you limit your hunting success. People have this idea that if a dog is too far out of gun range that you aren't going to be able to shoot the birds. To that I say, you need a different dog because that one is not doing its job. I know roosters are wily and I know that they can get jumpy, but the dog should learn how to stand off of those birds and get them pointed. If you've got 2 guys hunting 30 yards apart and a dog not ranging more than 100 yards, the dog really isn't doing much to increase hunting success.
3) Embrace technology. One of the best dogs I hunt with now, my hunting buddy wanted to give him to me as a "companion dog" because he thought the dog just ran off. Well, out comes the Garmin Astro and bam, we realize that this dog isn't running off, he's out finding birds and because of the cover we can't see him a lot of time, not because he's a runoff. When the Astro came out there were numerous times where' he'd be off 300 yards or so on point. We'd walk to him and flush a covey of quail or a pheasant, pleased as punch. Even if you have a dog that does not run that big, if you hunt CRP, finding a dog in thick stuff can be nearly impossible and this technology helps a ton. I've also found that being able to hunt without saying a word increases your chances of killing birds over points, especially when it comes to pheasants.
Just my thoughts, take them for what their worth or ignore them like my wife does.
1) It depends on the cover and a dog should adapt to that cover. For instance, we go to Montana every year. These are wide open spaces, even compared to Kansas and I can see a dog and a dog can see me for an incredibly long distance. In that cover, if I look down at my Garmin and he's at 600 to 700 yards, I think -- good dog. If we are hunting CRP, my dogs adapt because it is harder to run through and it is harder to keep in contact with me, but I would still say 100 yards is too close for me. I still like to see a dog at 200 or so in the CRP. If we are hunting creek bottoms or field edges (something linear), about my only cares are that the dog not be on a road and that he be on the land that we have permission to hunt. If he's hanging around at 100 yards, to me, he's not trying hard enough to find birds.
2) By limiting the dogs range, you limit your hunting success. People have this idea that if a dog is too far out of gun range that you aren't going to be able to shoot the birds. To that I say, you need a different dog because that one is not doing its job. I know roosters are wily and I know that they can get jumpy, but the dog should learn how to stand off of those birds and get them pointed. If you've got 2 guys hunting 30 yards apart and a dog not ranging more than 100 yards, the dog really isn't doing much to increase hunting success.
3) Embrace technology. One of the best dogs I hunt with now, my hunting buddy wanted to give him to me as a "companion dog" because he thought the dog just ran off. Well, out comes the Garmin Astro and bam, we realize that this dog isn't running off, he's out finding birds and because of the cover we can't see him a lot of time, not because he's a runoff. When the Astro came out there were numerous times where' he'd be off 300 yards or so on point. We'd walk to him and flush a covey of quail or a pheasant, pleased as punch. Even if you have a dog that does not run that big, if you hunt CRP, finding a dog in thick stuff can be nearly impossible and this technology helps a ton. I've also found that being able to hunt without saying a word increases your chances of killing birds over points, especially when it comes to pheasants.
Just my thoughts, take them for what their worth or ignore them like my wife does.
kansasbrittany
Banned
#3 is great advice for a guy that is where I'm at currently. I didn't embrace the technology of an e-collar until 2 years ago, which was many years later than it should've been. I'm going to have to find a reasonably priced GPS system so that I don't have to wait for a rooster to flush to find my dog anymore
519vx
Member
It's not my intention to turn this into a pointer vs. flusher thread, but if you really believe this, how does anyone with a flusher ever put up any birds?
KATroutman13
Member
It's not my intention to turn this into a pointer vs. flusher thread, but if you really believe this, how does anyone with a flusher ever put up any birds?
Okay, 519vx, since you didn't give me a break on the OP being about a pointing breed, I won't give you a break on your error in your post. A flusher can still put birds up at 300 yards, but it will be hard for the hunter to bag them.
Likewise, because you have to limit a flushing dogs range to shotgun range (in order to bag birds), I think that you limit your likelihood of success because you limit the amount of ground that you are "hunting."
KATroutman13
Member
#3 is great advice for a guy that is where I'm at currently. I didn't embrace the technology of an e-collar until 2 years ago, which was many years later than it should've been. I'm going to have to find a reasonably priced GPS system so that I don't have to wait for a rooster to flush to find my dog anymore
KB,
We used to run beeper collars on point only. I don't know how many times we'd see a dog lock up. Beeper goes off, birds go flying. That is frustrating as hell.
519vx
Member
The only time my flusher is going to be 300 yards from me is if she's in the truck in the parking lot at Cabelas and I'm inside the store.
quail hound
Moderator
No, we just walk farther and when the dog starts trailing we follow.
Dog Gun Time
Member
Well said. My experiences match what you are saying. Tell me where the birds are and I'll tell you how far a dog should range. Until then I will trust the dog and do my best to keep up.
KATroutman13
Member
Honestly, I bet if you compared apples to apples, there's very little difference in the total distance walked by the hunter. Contrarily, I bet if we put apples to apples on dogs, the pointing dog covers significantly more ground than the flusher.
KATroutman13
Member
The only time my flusher is going to be 300 yards from me is if she's in the truck in the parking lot at Cabelas and I'm inside the store.
Therein lies the problem...that and it ain't a pointing dog.
mustistuff
Banned
range
the most common quoted range is about 70 yards, 100 yds on average in good cover should be the fringe. lots can influence this but in many cases when a rooster is being pointed, time is of the essence and the dog can't do anything about it. pheasants have their own mind
cheers
It's not my intention to turn this into a pointer vs. flusher thread, but if you really believe this, how does anyone with a flusher ever put up any birds?
the most common quoted range is about 70 yards, 100 yds on average in good cover should be the fringe. lots can influence this but in many cases when a rooster is being pointed, time is of the essence and the dog can't do anything about it. pheasants have their own mind
cheers