Hard mouth

jasper

jasper

New member
I have a two year old lab who is giving me some grief. He has a soft carry once the bird is in his mouth but has a hard time picking it up off the ground and chomps on the bird to get a grip on it. He is fine with ducks and geese in the water but any thing on land he struggles. How can I train for this with out the use of live/dead birds? I have access to plenty of birds but funding is going to run out real fast. I also don't want to turn him off of birds either. Any help is greatly appreciated.
Brad
 
Love your dog more. Go hunting more. Train less. And above all, don't worry about it. I think what you are describing is very common, maybe universal. I suspect another season, a few more birds, and a little less "pressure" and you will have a dog you can be proud of. The problem is not your dog, its all those stupid training books and videos that you paid $25 a piece for( I should know I have boxes full of them) These experts want your two year dog to run down a 3 pound wing tipped rooster hell bent on survival and drag it back to you without leaving so much as a mark on the breast - it's really quite absurd if you stop to think about. Good luck.
 
You might try the Dokken Trainer. I use it for my GSP's. I play with them in the yard all the time. It is close to actual weight and you can inject sent into the body. Also the hard head and tail keep the dog from picking it up or shaking it to death. Works for me and is around $25 at gundogsuply.com. (no affiliation). Also, as said before, be patient. It's like kids; all of the sudden when you least expect it, they'll get it. Here is a little Brittany with the trainer.
Lily2.jpg
 
It sort of depends on the damage that is being done to the bird. If he is just having trouble with just getting it in his mouth from the ground then he's probably not hard mouthed just trying to get a grip on the bird. To extend the life of the birds for land retrieves, freeze the birds, in the freezer that your wife wont be in anytime soon. Frozen birds hold up better to that kind of abuse.
 
I have a 10 year old Brittany, he will bring you back all the birds alive, if you only cripple them. But you will find teeth marks in the lower tip of the breast. He does this as he picks them up and gets a firm grip so he can carry the bird. I have never found them to be a problem..........Bob
 
Maybe hard mouthed is the wrong term. He doesn't carry hard he just can't find a good way to pick up the soft body of a bird in the field. He is trying to bite it and turn it over trying to find a way to pick it up. If he grabs it out of water there isn't a mark on the bird. As to the extent of damage we were training with pen raised pheasants last night and one didn't want to fly. He caught it and in the proses of trying to pick it up he killed it/mutilated it. I have the dead fowl trainer goose, mallard and chucker. He retrieves all of those just fine but they all have a hard body. Is there a soft body trainer out there. I have never seen one. Hmmm. Maybe I need to invent one.
 
I don't know if this will work for you, but I use a frozen bird with nails driven through it to play fetch and retrieve. Seems that your dog just gets excited on a live bird or has been spurred before and isn't taken any chances?
 
It sounds like you just need to work in some quick pick up drills. Get the trained retrieve by Dobbs video, along with hold and fetch. It will solve your problem. You put a pile of bumpers out and give the comand of fetch with low stimulas, you don't care which one he grabs just that he grabs one quick. But you need to do some steps before that one on the table which all leads upto that. Force breaking. Do the program and you will polish all that up.
 
You might want to try having a friend walk up to your dog while he is working to pick up the bird, and see if he manages to quickly pick up the bird and run away with it. Then you'll at least know whether your dog is truly struggling with picking up the bird, or just likes chomping on them for a while before he picks them up, and you can then plan your training accordingly. My friend's french brittany was doing similar things with some pigeons, but he suddenly figured out how to pick up the bird when I walked close to him....
 
I can walk up to him and take it away. After seeing him on a couple of more birds I think he just can't figure out how to pick up the soft body. Has anybody used these?
http://www.dtsystems.com/products/softmouthtrainer.html

I'm thinking of picking up a couple. Have all summer to work this out and want to get this corrected because it is driving me nuts. To make matters worse I seem to be training for upland more and more so this is going to be a real problem come fall as I see my self in the field more then in the marsh.
 
never used those I always use feathers and barb wire its a cruel method but after a couple retrieves the hard mouth is over for good
 
My lab is very soft. I have a sportdog sd200 and all it takes is a one for continues to get his attention. I am afraid with this method I would turn him off of birds. Have you every tried that with a soft dog?
 
I dont think I would use the collar if he is soft I would try another method to show your dissaproval
 
I use

a wire brush attatch a wing to the wood side and nothing to the wire side ....it works good!!! I have a 6 yo male that was as soft mouthed as could be but he got spurred real bad last season and decided to hit the birds a little hard on the retrieve and do some mouthing the brush cured him:D
 
At what point do you consider it a problem? My 8 month old will pick up a dead bird no problem but a live one is another issue. He just can't find the handle. I'll have to agree with Niceshot and say this should go away with experience. I wouldn't want him to lose a bird because he was timid and it got away. Perhaps the training table will solve this but then again I would think 8 months is young for this type of correction.
 
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