Feral cats

Cass said:
No, I'm just saying that using the non-native invasive species point about cats is a weak argument. Cats were here long before the pheasants were introduced.
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You must have missed what I actually stated.

I stated that "Feral cats are a destructive invasive species."

I backed that statement with documentation.

Your statement that pheasants are an invasive species lacks merit.

Pheasants are a desirable species that have been introduced to the North American continent in an environment that was substantially altered by agriculture.

They provide significant cultural, social, and economic benefit in such environments.

Feral cats are destructive to wildlife management in such environments.

Do you still wish to equate feral cats to pheasant on a pheasant hunting forum?
 
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John Singer said:
Do you still wish to equate feral cats to pheasant on a pheasant hunting forum?
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Of course not, I'm just using the fact that pheasants are also non-native to point out the weakness in the "non-native invasive species" argument. I don't doubt that cats kill birds, but the 2.4 billion survey has been argued for years too, and has been questioned by many as "fake news".
 
Just curious if you guys shoot on sight all predators when bird hunting, including stray dogs, meaning dogs with no collars. Had an experience couple years ago in SD when hunting a public property and a dog came out of a fence line and joined us. No collar, was concerned how my dogs would act in response, made the decision i would only act if there was a confrontation.....nothing happened, stray was not a good thing but stayed with us until we finished. Most states have leash laws for dogs but not cats. I was brought up dont shoot anything you dont intend to eat and i still live by that, hell have a tough enough time trying to kill what i want to eat.

Here in michigan guys shoot porkies just because their dogs like to mess with them....from what i know they dont impact grouse numbers only grouse dogs....i dont see why they should be shot just because.

Just remember crep, wia, wiha, plots etc are not public but private lands gracioualy leased to allow ua to hunt on private lands. Most farms have barn cats and tbey are not fair game when hunting their property.
 
wow, this topic took off quick..... opinions galore just like buttsholes everyone has one.

I kill anything that the state I am hunting in states is legal. Coon possum skunk porcupines feral cats etc.... they all are detrimental to native and nonnative species. we've done enough damage to the landscape for our native and nonnative birds that I feel if I can give them an upper hand then I will do my part.

edit: I don't kill cats if I am near a farm house or if it has a collar on. most of where I hunt has no farm houses nearby. nor do I just shoot random cats while driving down the road. i think ive shot 2 cats in my 26 years of hunting. probably have hit more with my vehicle.
 
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I live across the street from a WIHA. My cats don’t suddenly become feral because they crossed the street. They do rodent control on my house and outbuildings. And they are pets.

Some cats, you can’t keep inside No matter how hard you try. I’m supposed to escort them to the outbuildings? How about unless something is presenting an immediate threat to you or your dog you leave it alone?

Some of you are coming off like trigger-happy morons.
 
If a pet owner has pets they take on the responsibility of maintaining them. When they walk on to someone else property that property owner has the right to escort them off however they see fit. Once they leave your property they are not feral but are stray. If I want a cat on my property I will go buy one. A cat owner should be just as responsible as a dog owner. I am not trigger happy and won't shoot your cat but I will relocate it 2 counties away in hopes I never see it again.
 
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I guess the consensus is that we need to abide by the rules that apply to whatever land we are hunting on, public or private.

Just don’t expect warm fuzzies from me if you want to blast away.

Out of curiosity, how many of us have seen stray/feral cats when out hunting ? I haven't hunted to the extent many on here have but I don’t remember seeing one. Several dogs over the years. I have shot dogs that came onto my property but never while hunting.

Several years ago I had a neighbor that let his three labs run. I had cows with calves, told him about it probably twice and the third time I told him I would shoot them the next time. Few days later they were all three in with the cows and I shot the oldest, the others never came back. Didn’t like doing it but he had the chance to correct the situation.
 
I am not really talking about ones I encounter out hunting. That's not my property. I am talking about the ones that are all over town peeing on my porch, in my garage when it's open, and jumping on the hood of my vehicles. They feast under my bird feeders. I won't tolerate them and keep the trap set every night and the bb gun by the door.
 
I guess this should boil down to: If you own the ground, you make the rules and can do what you want within the law....If you don't own the ground (ie: public, IHAP or other equivalent programs) havest your target species. This seems silly, is there really a problem with wild cats? If so, where (state) are you guys seeing them? I can't remember seeing a domestic type of cat in the habitat I hunt pheasants in. So all you guys that would shoot cats on sight or do shoot cats on sight....so how many do you shoot /see in a season that make this such a problem? Getting curious now.
 
remy3424 said:
I guess this should boil down to: If you own the ground, you make the rules and can do what you want within the law....If you don't own the ground (ie: public, IHAP or other equivalent programs) havest your target species. This seems silly, is there really a problem with wild cats? If so, where (state) are you guys seeing them? I can't remember seeing a domestic type of cat in the habitat I hunt pheasants in. So all you guys that would shoot cats on sight or do shoot cats on sight....so how many do you shoot /see in a season that make this such a problem? Getting curious now.
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I see them on occasion hunting but I see them frequently around the house. They seem to run straight to the water drains. Like I said I have trapped around 3 dozen the last 5 years. Many are trap shy.
 
I've seen one cat shot and it was in sight of a farm house. It was a good ways and on walkin land. I'm sure cats are out there but I don't ever recall seeing any other than the occasional one in the ditch next to someone's house. But I'm not really looking either.
There's a couple of places I hunt once or twice a year that have a policy of don't shoot the house covey which basically means don't shoot quail within a quarter mile of the house. Some years they have some cats some years they don't. Ive turned kittens loose on one myself Cats don't last very long loose around the farm., Except for the exceptions , you know the ones that somehow live forever. There are always some quail around, it doesn't matter if there are 10 cats or one. The quail numbers are the same as they are anywhere else on the farm.
 
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Cass said:
Of course not, I'm just using the fact that pheasants are also non-native to point out the weakness in the "non-native invasive species" argument. I don't doubt that cats kill birds, but the 2.4 billion survey has been argued for years too, and has been questioned by many as "fake news".
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If you have any evidence of a serious argument that substantially reduces the estimate, please post it because the only stuff I have seen is "My fluffy wouldn't do that".
 
dg57 said:
If you have any evidence of a serious argument that substantially reduces the estimate, please post it because the only stuff I have seen is "My fluffy wouldn't do that".
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Sure, I can post a few sources for comparison. Like I said above, its not that cats don't eat a lot of birds, there is no doubt that they do. Its just that the total impact is just not substantial in the big scheme of things. I'm sure they can have a localized impact, but big picture they aren't as big a threat as the headline makes it sound.

The criticism of the study that came up with the 2.4 billion estimate, was that it didn't do any new surveys or field research. It just reviewed prior studies and came up with new conclusions based on the prior work to support the theory they had put forward.

By far the biggest cause of bird deaths is weather and the related drought/food source loss, etc. I understand that is many times all other causes combined. I can't find a good link for that, but doubt many people would disagree.

The next biggest is collisions with windows and buildings. Here is a link to estimates that show some figures. This one has cats causing about 500 million:

Human-related Causes of Bird Mortality – Sibley Guides

www.sibleyguides.com www.sibleyguides.com

This one shows cats causing about 100 million:


Here is an article that questions the data in the 2.4 billion study. I don't normally go to NPR for facts, but if they question it, it must really be bad:

www.npr.org

Do We Really Know That Cats Kill By The Billions? Not So Fast

Murderous cats are in the headlines this week. Commentator and cat-rescuer Barbara J. King questions the reliability of the new, extreme cat-killer statistics, which appear in a "meta-study" that she says makes some questionable assumptions.
www.npr.org www.npr.org

Here is a link to the 2.4 billion study for reference, on the American Bird Conservancy page:


Enjoy reading.

Cass
 
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This quote from the Sibley link above states the overall impact well:

"First, it should be stated that the single most significant threat to bird populations is habitat destruction, in all of its forms and with all of its causes. The various causes of mortality outlined below kill individual birds directly, and can certainly have an adverse effect on population size, but can actually have a beneficial effect in some cases. Studies of hunting have documented that in certain cases killing small numbers of birds can improve the health and survival of the remaining birds. As long as the habitat is intact, the population has the potential to replace the lost birds.

In simplest terms, habitat destruction reduces the population by reducing the available resources, denying birds the chance to reproduce, and effectively putting a cap on the population size."
 
I was out today and stopped at one of my go too spots; an old grown up cemetery. I got out and saw "cat tracks" on the road in the mud. I thought of this thread. Then hunted the spot and missed a rooster three times but never saw a cat.
 
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