Dog teaching dog

when I got my second lab I hunted him with my first, there are three years difference. Well my pup learned to just watch my older dog until he got birdy. So all of last year I had the best heeled dog in ks, he would not leave my side until my other dog got birdy and then sometimes he would just wait tell we shot one. It took all summer for a friend of mine to get him his own confidence. This year a totally different story, until he reinjured his hip second weekend. Now I dont know if he is ever going to be able to hunt again.
 
suppose so- way back we had Golden Retrievers- they were good on grouse, ducks, pheasants- we had a freind in Wisconsin that had two FT winning Goldens

still say- in the uplands- you take your pointing or retriever- put that dog down with a class NSTRA dog- see who gets the birds
 
Alot of interesting perspectives here. Here's my 2 cents worth. I think first and foremost the parents of any good hunting dog must have been or be good hunters. If one parent doesn't hunt then you have a 50/50 chance of the pup not hunting. If neither hunt , then good luck. Second I believe you CAN NOT teach a dog to hunt. They either do or they don't. You can teach them to quarter and find hidden things etc. but they are not hunting but following the commands of a learned game. A true "hunting dog" hunts naturally and hones their hunting skills thru experience and by learning from their mistakes both good and bad. They will quarter naturally if the conditions warrant it or run a line naturally if the conditions warrant that. The only thing that really needs to be taught is a little discipline in the field i.e. don't jump birds (pointing dogs) when you approach and remain steady at least until the bird is at wing. (Steady to shot is nice but takes a lot of time because you are going against a good dogs instincts.) As for honoring, I think that has alot to do with a dogs natural dominance instincts and effects who honors who and who creeps in etc. Also how much experience a dog has hunting with others as well them figuring out it is a hunting "pack" effort. With that said it can still be taught to some extent with a check cord. I have 2 GSP's and did teach them to heel, come, and whoa which I have rarely had to use when in the field. My female always naturally backed my male and would only move closer to a point but never take over, however my male would try to take over on her points. My female learned on her own that pheasant often run so when my male was on point she would make a wide arcing circle to get on the other side but never too close. My male will always remain on point until I flush a bird and will only move if nothing comes up, however my female will hold point until I arrive, then sometimes move off to the side a little waiting for a bird to flush as though she is ancipating the shot to mark the downed bird. These are things they learned on there own just from experience.
The only problem I had using a bird wing and fishing rod when they were pups is that when I take them fishing they want to go after the lure when I cast. They still do that to this day and they are now 12, so I only troll when they're on board. Next time I am going to try a broom stick.
I had to be much more careful when gun breaking my male. Loud noises or shots fired never phased the female, but my male was much more nervous about it at first so I had to go slow with him. Today he is terrified of thunderstorms and fireworks but you can shoot a gun right next to him and he is so instense on birds that it does not phase him in that situation. I never forced them to retrieve since I trained them together as they would become too competitive to who was going to bring me the bird. At first they would just try to bring it together but then later they would try to wrestle a bird from each other. My fault on that one. Now they just find the downed bird and just hold it until I come and get it. Sometimes a little hard mouthed but not so much as they got older.
 
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interesting post and coments- parents should be good hunters- gee ya think
little 16 month spent last season backing him- now he's finding he has to back her- not sure if he's suprised or what- she's starting to shine

he's a sure fired retriever- but when she pins one like this- she thinks she should get the retrieve- she gets there first he lets her pick it up and carry it to me- but he's ready to take over

I haven't trained or taught mine anything- well- behave in the house- maners-

If I thought it necessary, and I might , I'll teach them WHOA- why- because it gives a bit of control in the exciting situations of a bird field- such as one coming up on another on point- or on point when birds are getting up-

btw- no way do I want or allow mine to move arround once they've made point- not even a wiggle- think that comes from only shooting birds that the dog has pinned- you start the moving- taking a step- creeping- circling- all sorts of problems can creep up- nope- when mine lock up- I don't want them moving untill I release them- but I also don't want them standing there when there's no bird arround- like hot scent- stop/freeze/move on

sometimes I can tell when they spin and lock up- and there isn't a bird- release and move on- called reading your dog- they read you also

op was about dog teaching dog- and it's what I've been doing with pups real young for many years- did it with my two pups last year- always ran them with an adult- still do- to me it makes a big difference-

I have started to hunt them by themselves- I like what I see- but I still prefer to hunt a young dog with a good experienced dog- mine

to end up with a real good dog- and hunt with others- you have to establish what is good- and walk away from what isn't

some never figure that out- there aren't many that would hunt there real good dog with an average dog- and there aren't many with an average dog who would hunt with someone with a real good dog
 
I agree shadow I always run my young unseasoned dogs with well trained seasoned dogs it makes my job easier in some aspects
 
That's awsome that's exactly what what I was lookin for. That's an awsome picture. Beautiful dogs.
 
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tal-

why thank you- sometimes I carry my cheap digital camera

he was at a decent run she was not to far away- next thing I know there he is 80 yards out and her backing- as I get closer- looks like he's taking a crap- criminy sakes- GET GOING SHADOW- he's frozen- I'm 20 yards away- hey- looks like a picture Ultimate Pheasant Hunting would chuckle at-
so I set the gun down and dig out the camera-

circle around and come in facing him- she's still frozen also- about then feet from him- cackling nice rooster comes up- pretty in the sunlight- I swing as he gets some altitude and is moving pretty good- 7 shot drops him hard- she gets there first- growls and picks up- drops it 5 ' from me- he picks it up- circles arround like he's all proud- brings it and sits behind me- well- it was his
 
it does resemble a crappy situation but nice point and back just the way its supposed to happen :coolpics:
 
one more for you then GSP87- already had two roosters- wanted to get the other two out- coming up to the vehicle-

ALRIGHT GUYS- what are you doing- as I open the back end- HEY

so I walk arround the vehicle- and step into the road- oh oh- better get the gun- wait- another picture would be fitting- I take the picture- go back to the vehicle and get the gun

I walk in from the left on the other side of that corner grass- lots of noise- hen, hen, hen, hen, hen- ROOSTER- flip the gun and get him pretty quick-
ah crap- can only shoot one more- and the other two haven't been out yet-

you guessed it Shadow retrieved- Lizzi was off- think one flew right over her and she lost her cool and went for a run



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Gove County Britts said:
it does resemble a crappy situation but nice point and back just the way its supposed to happen :coolpics:
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thanks- hard to actually tell- he's 47.1 lbs she's 32.3lbs
she's been backing him since the first time he locked up- tall and still- like a statue- last Oct- think as soon as she saw him locked up standing tall she froze- first time was 70 some yards- I slowly walked up alongside her- speaking softly and running my hand down her back- she never moved as I circled and came in and flushed- watching her always- got a couple pictures of that- think it was that very first time that sunk in- I'll still speak to her as reasurance

I sometimes wonder about her backing of him- think maybe because she knows he's top dog- and being her father might have something to do with it- they make a nice brace of Britt's- they run seperate patterns- but very much the same- handle nicely- they do cover alot of ground
 
Nice dogs Shadow. Gee I think! I don't mind a dog repositioning as long as they don't muck things up. That was my point when explaining dogs either hunt or don't. You should not have to teach the dog anything about hunting or honoring or quartering etc. Thats what they do. My dogs too can get into some pretty awkward positions when going on a point. I hope that crappy position is not his usual stance when on point though-LOL.
 
Shadow, nice looking dogs. I also run 2 Brittanys. Both females, one is 7 and the other 2. The older female is liver/white and the young one is white/orange. They work very well together also and like you say, cover a lot of ground. My older dog doesn't honor and I really have to work on that this off season because she has now learned that when the young one locks up that there is a bird there and she runs in and busts it up. If I catch her in time I can whoa her with the e-collar but she won't naturally stop and honor.
 
Your dogs definetly know whats goin on that's for sure. Still need to get my gsp out in the field,but now he's favoring his right rear leg and I have know idea what's wrong with it. So I don't wannna take him out until I do, cause he'll be so excited he'll just ignore the pain and further hurt himself.
 
GSP87 said:
Your dogs definetly know whats goin on that's for sure. Still need to get my gsp out in the field,but now he's favoring his right rear leg and I have know idea what's wrong with it.
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Probably just a sprain, my shorhair gets them from time to time. Give it a few days and I bet he/she will bounce back.
 
Shadow very nice pictures, Like DZ, I run 2 Brits. Tony my 11 year old has honored from day one. That dog just does everything a good hunting dog should. I didn't have to teach him a anything but obedience and retrieving. That sure is nice when a dog has all the hunting goodies in their genes............Bob
 
2dogs- have no fear- he's got all the style you could ask for
pretty funny seeing him like that though- new computer background-

thanks for all the kind words guys-
 
I think it's a Brittany trait, for sure. I am on my first set of Brittanies, due to some health issues shortly after I got them, they didn't get any summer work but socialization, when fall came and I started feeling better, I decided to take them out with me alone, and just see what happened. Opening day one of two boys points and holds a rooster about as experienced as he is. I went ahead and shot it. About three days later the other boy points and holds. They taught themselves to retrieve, hunt dead, and back, by the end of the season, even taught themselves to stop and wait on running birds they see till I catch up and release them My heaven I must be a genius dog trainer! Ha Ha.
 
could be right oldandnew- like is said a lot- they learn a lot in the field-
my pups started in pheasants- when they pinned their first and instead of shooting I came in facing them to see the reaction- when the pheasant came up I was speaking- think that first find, point, hold till flush, is really what sets the stage on a youing dog- I haven't shot a wild flushing with the pups- they hold I'll shoot

when I took them up north, other hunters other dogs- one pup locked up- I get close- she looks at me- back on point- looks at me- creeps- locks- I step in- covey of quail- her first wild quail- she wasn't sure- two others shot and I swung on one- she retrieved- like to get her and her brother in more quail

sounds like you and your Britt's have a good time afield- and that's what it's all about
 
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