Dog Not Scenting - Any Experience With This?

G

gjw

Well-known member
Hi all, hope that someone can give me some advise/direction with a problem I have with my 2 1/2 yr old GSP. Here's some background. I was not able to hunt her much the first year for various reasons and last year I did hunt a lot more with my old GSP. Her problem last year is she would bust birds and chase them, toward the end of the season she would point now and again, but would pass by birds often. She did have a couple of very nice points however. I decided to take her to a professional trainer and he had her for 2 weeks. He told me that she just won't scent, she'd run over birds and not show any reaction while in the scent cone, nothing he said. She'd go crazy when seeing the bird, so she has the desire. He did say to just hunt the crap out of her this fall and not give up on her. I do plan on doing this.

So....have any of you had a dog like this? And if so what advise can you give me.

Thanks so much!

Greg
 
Scent is a tough thing to figure

I would try running her with another dog and see if the other dog reacts to the scent cone.


I've seen very good dogs of mine not scent a dead bird within a few feet of them, and seen the same dogs then point at 50 yards
 
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If you think about it, there are three parts to the scenting process. 1. Nose: air particles entering the olfactory system. 2. Association: the brain recognizes the smell. 3. Behavior: the reaction to that association.

It sounds like you're referring to n?mero uno. Have you taken her to the vet to get looked at for any blockage? Is she hydrated enough? A dry nose is not good.

I would think its most likely 2 or 3, which is fixed with training and experience.

As for going by birds... That's not surprising. Yesterday I watched an experienced GSP sweep the field after a hunt test. The scenting conditions were ok, but I've seen her point from 30 yards off. So she has a good nose and knows the game well. Two minutes later a guy walked through with his spaniel and flushed a left over chukar. It happens. A lot of scenting is about timing and location.
 
..."professional trainer had her for two weeks."

Could you tell us the program the trainer followed? And the results, if any, the dog demonstrated?
 
Hi all and many thanks. The trainer would scent the ground with the bird and placed feathers around also. He'd bring her thru with no reaction, she'd run over the bird without even knowing it was there. As he told me, no reaction at all.

Thanks!

Greg
 
I had a similar problem with Tinker when she first arrived here at one year old.

This worked for me. You decide if it might work for you. :)

I knew she scented things, but she was visually oriented, and had made no association with a pheasant wing as a desirable thing to seek. So, I made a couple of pheasant wings the most wonderful things in the world for her to find in the house...kitchen, living room, heck, even on the stairs going upstairs.

I'd put the wings there and tell her--in another room-- to fetch. When she came close I'd reinforce her search and when she grabbed one, I treated her like it was the most marvelous thing a dog had ever done in the history of the planet. Praise, praise, praise, petting, scratching, happy-toned voice with great excitement in it. Over and over, with the rare, but occasional treat to reward her.

I did it on no particular schedule, and for no particular length of time, but every time I took out the wings, it was HAPPY time!

She, like all dogs, wanted to please, and it got to be fun. Then it got to be desirable, then it got to be a favorite thing, THEN...it got to be a reward for other trained behaviors--much like police dogs are often rewarded with a play time with a tennis ball.

I took it outside, and hid the wings in high grasses on the hill up to the house, and sent her to "fetch." She bounced out and rambled and then...caught the scent cone from this (poor, bedraggled) pheasant wings and began the search. It took a while, but she found a wing and brought it back. I treated her like she had found the lost treasure of the Sierra Madre!!! :D

It has been simple since then with pigeons--dead and alive, all sorts of bumpers and other wings, and the dog KNOWS that scent is a goal.

I doubt that her indifference was as profound as you describe with your pup, and I have high regard for GWPs' prey drive, but basically, I gave her a target to especially focus on.

Should help a bit, or maybe work well for you. The dog wants to please. Some just don't have a high prey drive.

Best wishes.
 
Kismet: your process is similar to what I've used - hide the bird routine in the house. The dog loves the game...

The past three dogs have been to "school" as their first phase of training. This phase is all about birds - pigeons and some chuckers. No obedience. for two weeks - it's birds. And the get introduced to the gun.

When the dogs are finished with this phase, they have a very strong prey drive - for birds. It can be an expensive two weeks, but I felt it was worth it.

Seems like there's nothing like a live bird flopping about to stimulate a dog's interest and enthusiasm.

Good luck with your friend...
 
david0311

Sure like Kismets idea's--never had this issue-- but if I did would sure try his ideas along with live birds as well;)
 
I had a springer that absolutely loved birds and had tons of drive. He would occasionally stumble into some birds, but he would overrun them all the time with no reaction to the scent cone. I worked with him as much as I could, but no improvement. I ended up finding a nice home for him and bought a pup. It turned out to be a great decision.
 
Hi all, well, here's an update on what's going. I was able to connect with a local trainer (who doesn't advertise, so I didn't know he was here, but that's another story). Anyway, he took myself and Raina out, planted some birds and the short story is, she reacted to the birds scent, was able to locate the bird, but the pointing was not there. He was able to steady her, and get a "soft" point a few times. He said the dogs nose is fine, just that she needs to have confidence in her nose and what she's finding. In short, because of her late start, she's inexperienced and needs more exposure (just as many of you have said here) to birds. He gave me some good pointers (no pun intended) and some tips that will help her out.

So I guess I was overthinking what the first trainer told me and started to worry about her nose. But with the advise this trainer gave me and what you folks have said, I'm much more at ease. I'll just continue to march and try and make Raina into a good bird dog.

Thanks so much everyone!!!!

Greg
 
Good news, GJW! A second opinion is nice to have. Good decision on your part.

Now...take it easy, have fun, and remember...you got time.

:)
 
Regarding pointing...the last two Golden's learned to point birds that sit - typically more hens than roosters.

We used chuckers, at a preserve and red flags. Had the dog down- wind and as he came closer to the hidden bird - I told him to "stay." Probably not the way to train a pointer, but Max will now freeze on a bird. Kind of fun to watch, but he is also an aggressive flusher.

You can play this game in the garage, with a dummy attached to a rope; I use "easy" command and pull back on the rope. When he's close to the dummy, tell him stay. This seems to reinforce the pointing instinct and helps curtail the urge to chase.

Works for me and the dog seems to enjoy the process...
 
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I will respectfully disagree with JonnyB.

Pointing dogs are not "trained" to point birds. Their instincts tell them to point when they get a nose full of scent.

What you do to nurture that instinct is get a pigeon launcher or two, load them with good flying pigeons, then plant them. Then take your dog across the scent cone about 20 feet downwind. As soon as she picks up the scent (turns her head, picks up her nose, does an about face, etc.) pop the bird. The idea is when the dog is in the scent cone you pop the bird before she points. Pretty soon she'll learn to freeze up on first scent and beat you to it. When she does that, take a picture and smile!
 
wind and positioning

High and low pressure in the atmosphere has alot to do with the scent. Some days it seems like your dog is always on point. Go back to the same spot later and not a point. And if birds land dead on their backs it seems like dogs have trouble smelling them then too. My biggest thing is hunting them into the wind or teaching them to gate correctly in crosswinds. Most dogs do it on their own but I've had a few stubborn gsp's and pointers that go one way and hard one way!
 
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