Are Pheasants Toast?
- Thread starter BritChaser
- Start date
RK Special K
New member
Here's my take on hens with broods in HOT weather:
When it's 102 degrees, these wise old hens have their chicks tucked away in shady brushy habitat out of the scorching sun and hidden from predators. They won't be struting them along HOT gravel roads or generally in open areas. That's why they seem to have disappeared. After the sun nears the horizon, they may venture out for a bit.
If KS had 40-50% of their CRP/grass in ok condition this year thru the critical hatch period and a bit beyond, the birds should be able to cope with more deterioration later in the summer and survive to be hunted in the fall. BUT, longer term, if these grasses are continually pounded into dust, and made unacceptable for spring hen nesting, then we have a BIG problem. Rich, lush, waist high grass is THE most important component of pheasant habitat. There just HAS to be significant amounts of it in "pheasant land". A mix of 20-grass/80-crops and some good brushy cover sprinkled around is considered "absolutely ideal". Few areas actually have this "perfect" mix but some do. Chamberlain/Kimball area of SD? Some others I'm sure. 10/90 is probably acceptable but if it drops below 5% grass, to much of their vital home is gone! There will still be some "hanger-ons" but not in exciting numbers.
It probably doesn't hurt much to go to a 50/50 mix but it doesn't help much after about 25% grass. If grass becomes more than 50% of the landscape, there begins a slow decline in pheasants. We all need food and pheasants love all kinds of farmers crops.
When it's 102 degrees, these wise old hens have their chicks tucked away in shady brushy habitat out of the scorching sun and hidden from predators. They won't be struting them along HOT gravel roads or generally in open areas. That's why they seem to have disappeared. After the sun nears the horizon, they may venture out for a bit.
If KS had 40-50% of their CRP/grass in ok condition this year thru the critical hatch period and a bit beyond, the birds should be able to cope with more deterioration later in the summer and survive to be hunted in the fall. BUT, longer term, if these grasses are continually pounded into dust, and made unacceptable for spring hen nesting, then we have a BIG problem. Rich, lush, waist high grass is THE most important component of pheasant habitat. There just HAS to be significant amounts of it in "pheasant land". A mix of 20-grass/80-crops and some good brushy cover sprinkled around is considered "absolutely ideal". Few areas actually have this "perfect" mix but some do. Chamberlain/Kimball area of SD? Some others I'm sure. 10/90 is probably acceptable but if it drops below 5% grass, to much of their vital home is gone! There will still be some "hanger-ons" but not in exciting numbers.
It probably doesn't hurt much to go to a 50/50 mix but it doesn't help much after about 25% grass. If grass becomes more than 50% of the landscape, there begins a slow decline in pheasants. We all need food and pheasants love all kinds of farmers crops.
RK Special K
New member
Also, my understading is that adult pheasants have little risk of dying of extreme heat. They may not like it but they will survive it.
However, very tiny chicks are probably at some significant risk. At about quail size, Mama hen can probably steer them into the shade.
However, very tiny chicks are probably at some significant risk. At about quail size, Mama hen can probably steer them into the shade.
Correct me if I am wrong, however doesn't SD fish and game plant birds or supplement the wild population somehow (stock it like states do for fish?)....I know that KS does not do that. So maybe Kansas with all the $$$ they rake in from out of state hunters should start to supplement/restock the pheasant population to ensure that things do not get so bad that they will never recover. Just a thought. I would be willing to pay a little extra to help the birds out. I have been coming to KS since 1996 (was active duty and retired after over 20yrs of service in the Air Force) from Colorado and OK. The only year I did not hunt was when I was stationed over in South Korea and deployed to the desert....I really enjoy KS and the folks down there.
Greg
carptom1
Well-known member
Yes you are wrong. SD does not stock birds. This is an old tale told by people that have a hard on for SD for whatever reason. Most have never been there. I have hunted there for years and let me tell you the birds are wild as hell. I will re tell the conversation I had with one of these people last year. There is an old guy that raises birds that I purchase from time to time. He stated last year " everybody was out because SD wildlife office bought all the birds they could get their hands on". 6 m he said. That would be more than they took in in fees if they got the best deal ever on birds. They don't have money for this. Most of the money brought into the state goes in private hands. The birds released in SD are on preserves just like Kansas. The only difference is, there are about 100 times as many there. Most of those birds are quickly aquired by the hunters, coyotes,hawks,eagles or any number of other predators. They are way too stupid. Most don't make it 24hrs. The number that would last a week would be miniscule.
Toad
Active member
I've lived in SD almost all my life, and have seen the bird numbers fluctuate up and down. In the eastern 1/2 of the state, predators and farming practices ran the numbers down more than anything else, and the severe winters killed off the rest.
The Soil Bank acres (back when) and CRP are the two factors that raised populations of wild birds to record levels. Although predators (skunks/coons/fox/hawks) still take a large number of young and old birds, long winters will almost wipe them out if there is not enough GOOD winter cover to compensate for -20-40 temps and deep snow.
I know the drought is severe, but mowing the ditches too early and cutting CRP acres will have a negative effect on bird numbers.
The Soil Bank acres (back when) and CRP are the two factors that raised populations of wild birds to record levels. Although predators (skunks/coons/fox/hawks) still take a large number of young and old birds, long winters will almost wipe them out if there is not enough GOOD winter cover to compensate for -20-40 temps and deep snow.
I know the drought is severe, but mowing the ditches too early and cutting CRP acres will have a negative effect on bird numbers.
RK Special K
New member
Pen-reared released birds are not worth a damn except to the Preserve operators who do it for BIG $$$$. They contribute NO long-term benefit to the wild bird population, whatsoever!
Ok, if you happen to be hunting wild bird property next to a preserve, you might kill a pen-reared bird(released yesterday) that wondered over your way. That's the extent of any "benefit".
Controling Mother Nature or Predators is not worth the time or money. We can control habitat and it is worth the time and money. If predators "freeload" on our habitat efforts, I won't hold a grudge against them generally-welcome aboard, there's plenty birds for them AND us! But if they get within range of my #4's, you bet, I'll roll 'em!
Ok, if you happen to be hunting wild bird property next to a preserve, you might kill a pen-reared bird(released yesterday) that wondered over your way. That's the extent of any "benefit".
Controling Mother Nature or Predators is not worth the time or money. We can control habitat and it is worth the time and money. If predators "freeload" on our habitat efforts, I won't hold a grudge against them generally-welcome aboard, there's plenty birds for them AND us! But if they get within range of my #4's, you bet, I'll roll 'em!
CowboyBirdDogs
New member
The habitat last year in SW looked pretty bad last year. Crp was low and thin, and fields that had been great the year before were reduced to stubble and wheat or had been grazed to dirt. NW looked completely different, decent to good crp fields and their crops looked pretty good as well. Hoping the whole state gets rain soon, and a bunch of it.
Bilbo Baggins
Active member
BleuBijou, I noticed the same thing about the habitat in SW Kansas last year. My honey holes from previous years were all dried up and only sand. There wasn't a single pheasant on some sections, not even one.
Gents,
There is no need to get all ticked off at me. I was just asking the question. That's why I said "correct if I am wrong". Thank you for correcting me however you could be a little bit more polite.
Meanwhile back at the ranch.....lets hope that all the states in this region from CO, SD, KS, NB, etc get some moisture and help the wildlife.
Greg
There is no need to get all ticked off at me. I was just asking the question. That's why I said "correct if I am wrong". Thank you for correcting me however you could be a little bit more polite.
Meanwhile back at the ranch.....lets hope that all the states in this region from CO, SD, KS, NB, etc get some moisture and help the wildlife.
Greg
carptom1
Well-known member
I certainly didn't mean to offend you, I just have fought this battle many times on here. I have hunted SD for years and let me tell you the birds I shoot are wild. I have had buddies want to know why I go to SD to hunt pen raised birds and I just get tired of it. Sorry if I offended you it was not my intent.
BritChaser
Well-known member
Greg, glad you like us Kansans!
We try awfully hard to be friendly. Correct me if I am wrong . . . but some years ago wasn't the KDWP rasing pheasants and putting them out on the Glen Elder Reservoir/Waconda Lake public hunting areas?
RK Special K
New member
I'm sorry too. Carptom and I were only being strong about our answer. Not at all directed at you. In fact, it's a very common question. I've been to enough habitat/pheasant biology workshops and seminars to know right from wrong on this issue. Carptom apparently has also.
PF's biologists are adamant on this subject also. I will go so far as to say they are STRONLY against releasing pen-reared birds as any solution to wild bird populations.
Another spin-off off this myth: Hey, let's release adult pen-reared hens into the wild in late March. Wild roosters will get them all pregnant and the countryside will be filled with wild chicks.
Pen-reared hens can hardly feed themselves, don't have a clue what a predator is, and don't have a clue how to raise up a brood of their own chicks.
Studies show that probably 50% are dead before getting pregnant, another 40% are taken during nesting and hatch time leaving helpless chicks, and the balance shortly thereafter.
We don't give enough credit to the skill and determination of wild animals to protect themselves(and their young) from other wild animals. Damn, they are good at it!
PF's biologists are adamant on this subject also. I will go so far as to say they are STRONLY against releasing pen-reared birds as any solution to wild bird populations.
Another spin-off off this myth: Hey, let's release adult pen-reared hens into the wild in late March. Wild roosters will get them all pregnant and the countryside will be filled with wild chicks.
Pen-reared hens can hardly feed themselves, don't have a clue what a predator is, and don't have a clue how to raise up a brood of their own chicks.
Studies show that probably 50% are dead before getting pregnant, another 40% are taken during nesting and hatch time leaving helpless chicks, and the balance shortly thereafter.
We don't give enough credit to the skill and determination of wild animals to protect themselves(and their young) from other wild animals. Damn, they are good at it!
I appreciate the replies....I have never hunted in SD and I will be the first to admit that I was only passing on what I heard, so obviously what I heard was wrong.
I am hoping this season my 13yr old son and a good friend will get the chance to hunt SD roosters. We will still head out to SW Kansas near Dodge City, go to the Bad Habit and have some beer and food :cheers:
Funny, I know folks here in Colorado that won't drive to hunt pheasants. Instead they choose to spend $$ at local bird farms and hunt there. Whatever floats your boat I guess. I like the excitement of hunting, that's why it is called hunting right and not killing? Right?
Lets hope the August monsoons kick in and bring enough moisture to help kick start things....I know here in Colorado Springs it has been raining for 3 or 4 days straight like clock work starting about 1600hrs on.....
Greg
I am hoping this season my 13yr old son and a good friend will get the chance to hunt SD roosters. We will still head out to SW Kansas near Dodge City, go to the Bad Habit and have some beer and food :cheers:
Funny, I know folks here in Colorado that won't drive to hunt pheasants. Instead they choose to spend $$ at local bird farms and hunt there. Whatever floats your boat I guess. I like the excitement of hunting, that's why it is called hunting right and not killing? Right?
Lets hope the August monsoons kick in and bring enough moisture to help kick start things....I know here in Colorado Springs it has been raining for 3 or 4 days straight like clock work starting about 1600hrs on.....
Greg
i am not here to throw gasoline on the fire, but a farmer north of Mitchell, SD told me several years ago, that every spring he buys and turns loose about
100 adult hen pheasants to supplement his wildbird population. for what it's worth, he felt it helped his wild bird production on his pay to hunt ground.
100 adult hen pheasants to supplement his wildbird population. for what it's worth, he felt it helped his wild bird production on his pay to hunt ground.
RK Special K
New member
Also: If a wild animal has a fair amount of decent habitat that they are accustomed to, by instinct, they will work with it and usually find a way to protect themselves from some really gosh-awful conditions.
RK Special K
New member
I'm sure that Mitchell farmer feels they do some good, and I respect that.
My opinion: Those 100 hens are empty pills, placebo's. PF biologists have the same opinion. But I'm still open to the evidence. The people I've been listening to may be wrong and I certainly haven't done my own research.
My opinion: Those 100 hens are empty pills, placebo's. PF biologists have the same opinion. But I'm still open to the evidence. The people I've been listening to may be wrong and I certainly haven't done my own research.