Switch planting?

G

GSP

New member
This will be my 3rd go around with planting switch.

The first time I did it, we put in 9 acres. I worked with my PF chapter and used the Conservation Office's drill to plant it. I had dismal results. Very poor catch.

The second time I did it, I used a broadcast spreader and did a different 7 acre parcel. The results were phenomenal. That was 2 years ago and the stuff is looking great.

Now, I understand that this is a VERY small body of evidence AND soil types and weather can make a HUGE difference, but I'm leaning toward broadcasting again this year.

This year will be my most agressive undertaking. We're putting in 24 acres.

Based on my past experience, I'm planning to broadcast it again. This weekend I'm going to hit it hard with Round Up. Wait a week to 10 days and then hit it with the disk. Wait another 10-15 days and see how my weed control is. If need be, I will hit it again with RU. After that, I'm going to broadcast and then go over it with the cullipacker. That should put me at late May for a planting date.

Thoughts?
 
Warm season grasses require a firm seedbed. I don't know why you are planning any disking at all. I would go with the drill and possibly 2 appllications of roundup, or better yet, Journey or Plateau. The culitpacker would be needed if you do plan to disk. Usually you will need at least 2 more pounds per acre with the broadcaster than with the drill. If I were telling you how to plan this project from the start, I would recommend that you plant forage sorghum or milo in the summer prior to the year of planting. The year of planting, I would spray roundup of Journey prior to planting and drill right into the cover crop.
 
Very interesting PD.

I was planning to disk bc the ground has been fallow for some time. Like I said, the time that I drilled it, I had poor results. Again, that could have just been a bad year in terms of rain and such. I figured I would broadcast again bc A. I had good results last time. and B. I have a broadcast spreader.

So you're saying I'm still better off with a good burn down from RU, and then drill it in?

Maybe what I should do is break it up. Do half this year with switch. Put the other half into sorghum and then drill the switch over it the following year.
 
I don't think I would let the fact it's been fallow for awhile bother me IF you use Journey. It is a residual herbicide and should take care of the weeks you are expecting. It has roundup in it, so that will take care of the existing weeds. Remember, soil/seed contact is very important in native grass planting as is depth of planting.
 
You have given me some good stuff to think about. I just always go to RU, bc of familiarity. I'm going to do some checking on Journey.

I shouldn't write off the drill after just one bad experience.

Thanks.:thumbsup:
 
I don't really think it is. It is a lot newer chemical formulation. You have to be careful with atrazine as it is a ground water contaminant, and I don't know if it will kill native grass seedlings or not. I have used it in the past to remove smooth brome from a native grass stand. I found out I can do the same thing with cattle.
 
Prairie Drifter said:
I would recommend that you plant forage sorghum or milo in the summer prior to the year of planting. The year of planting, I would spray roundup of Journey prior to planting and drill right into the cover crop.
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What month would you drill it over the cover crop? Still in May/early June?

I have read a fair amount about winter planting but never tried it. Are these guys broadcasting it in Feb/Mar? How do you get weed control with a winter planting?

Sorry for the 20-questions. I'm pretty new to this. Michigan is real lean in terms of birds, but my brother just bought another farm and there are a couple spots on it that really lends itself to habitat development. I feel kinda like a kid in a candy store. It would sure be nice to get a huntable population of phz again. Grouse/WC hunting is awesome, but I've always had a soft spot for the old farm pheasants.
 
Prairie Drifter-

Made a hurried trip to Wichita, so didn't have time to stop and say hello, but did notice your use of cattle. The area looks really good and I can see a lot of work has been done. Wish I could keep up with a young buck like you.
 
GSP, I would plant in April or early May, though you could plant in November or after just as well. The chemical ap would have to be done before sprout with Journey.
 
GSP, Switch has some aversion to Plateau but I would not go without it. Just be sure to read the label becuase it depends on what stage plant is in as to when you apply and what rate. I am doing 70 acres of a NWSG blend and am going with a 4 OZ/acre rate. You can add the glyphosate (RU) as need for immediate kill. Keep in mind that it is not uncommon for NWSG to take 1-3 years to establish.

Good luck!
 
Thanks guys!

I am now completely confused. Did a little reading on Plateau. From what I can tell the cool season grasses seem tollerant to it while SG is not. Am I missing something? By going with the light application (4 oz/acre) does the SG survive? Are you applying Plateau in Sept?

Journey seems to be a mixture of RU (small amount) and Plateau. If Plateau is supposed to be applied in the Fall (I'm thinking Sept), wouldn't it make more sense just to hit it heavy with RU now and then apply Plateau (if I'm getting a lot of weed competition) come Fall?

I am prepared to wait the 1-3 years for this to develop. Like I said, I have a couple other stands that are doing well. To be honest, I put little thought into them. I simply hit it hard with RU in late April, disced it in May, broadcast the seed around the 3rd wk of May, cultipacked it and didn't touch it again. The first year I probably had 4 inches of growth. By the second year, I was flushing birds out of it. Maybe I just got lucky?
 
GSP said:
Thanks guys!

I am now completely confused.
Click to expand...

That's what we are here for! Confucious say..."out of confusion comes clarity" (accent).

Seriously, here is my thinking on this (and what I am doing right now on 70 new CRP acres this spring.

I assume NWSG (natvie warm season grass) germinates at 70 degree soil temps so I want to plant as close to that magic mark as possible (May 31 in SD??). Soil district will drill it in when ready. I had to disk up corn stalks (and mow them first) in last 2 weeks to let it sit and settle so the seed bed firms up after some wind/rain/composting or litter.

The cool seasons will start to come ASAP and the warm season weeds will come right about when you plant so my plant is to not disturb the ground anymore and spray with roundup and plateau right at planting time or about +/- 1 week max.

In a fall plant the weeds should be less active and I would wait to apply any herbicides until spring.

I also pulled a cultipacker behind the disk and will go over with cultipacker right after the grass gets planted.

PD, gave me some good advice last year on how to knock back cool season competition so he knows his stuff.
 
GSP, we are coming at you a bit blind as we cannot see the site. We don't know what the existing litter is, how compact the soil is, etc. To make things simple and cheap, if the existing litter isn't seriously thick, the simple way to proceed is to wait until close to when you are going to drill, spray with roundup, and drill within days of the application. That would eliminate the cost of culitpacking and Plateau/Journey. If weeds are a problem at the end of the first year, you could spray with Plateau (not Journey due to the Roundup) and eliminate those competitors for a vigorous second year. As we discussed in an earlier thread, the biggest problem you are going to face with your planting is that it will get too thick too fast and you will be spending money and time trying to enhance forbs and reduce thatch. Another option is a burn after 1-2 years once the cool season grasses have exerted and before the switch is 2 inche tall. That would clean up the stand and favor the switch.
 
It is so hard to plant any seed by broadcasting and not get a lot of the seed too deep or not in the ground at all. The grass drills have bands that facilitate the seed being planted at the right depth, no waste.
 
I broadcast last year and wish I would have found a drill. PD and UGUIDE do you guys ever spray Plateau in the spring/summer? If so what is the timing.
 
Maynard, sorry to have missed you! We'll get-er-done. Thanks for the compliments. Been a good spring for the wildlife area. Busy this weekend. Have a field trial, traditional archery shoot, BSA campout, turkey season, and litter of pups to babysit this weekend. The patch burn/patch grazing system is going to be very interesting. Maybe we can tour it together a bit later. I'm really interested in the July/August burns. They'll be miserable for the help, but should make serious impacts on the level of succession on the area. Holler when you're blazing by again! Maybe I'll get out to breed a dog yet this year!
 
mmd, since I moved down here 18 years ago, I haven't had to plant much grass other than on disturbed sites. I have over 30 inches of rainfall here and have more problems with the grass getting too dense than not growing, so I don't worry about chemical other than the roundup at most. When I was planting 200-400 acres per year in my previous location, neither chemical had been made yet. Most of the "failures" were a lack of patience. Many could be fixed by a high intensity grazing properly timed or a good burn.
 
So if I am getting some weed competition, and decide that the stunting the switch is worth it, when is the best time to apply Plateau?

I'm going to look into a drill. I was thinking that I would have to get one from the conservation office. Maybe my brother's drill that he uses on the farm has some plates that will convert it to be able to handle the small switch grass seed.
 
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