Numbers not near what we expected

Kansashunting, I am not bashing Anyone ,except the perps. I know it is big country. There are two wardens in the county I hunt. One north of the highway and one south. Hunted Kansas since 1983, have never been checked. Sometimes it might be nice to see them. Maybe it is just coincedence. Maybe ,I will see them this weekend??? I should probably log their numbers into my phone , so I can call from the field... Thanks:)
 
vaturkey said:
Two of the WIHA's we hunted had been removed. Both of those held birds two years ago. Also, one area we hunted with great CRP etc. was covered in tire tracks through it in various places. Looks almost like someone tried to drive the pheasants out of the thick stuff by driving either trucks or 4-wheeler's through it. All the above was near Kinsley.
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In '08 we were walking one of those patches of CRP, possibly the same one you are talking about, when a truck cut across the field in front of us. The CRP was thick and tall, and I believe they had no idea we were in the field until we were almost back to our truck. They exited out the other side of the field just as we got into our truck. We tried to follow/chase them for several miles down gravel roads to get their tag#, but they figured out what we were doing and sped away.

To describe them as "hunting" anything would be an insult to anybody on this board. They were out, from what we could tell, to poach whatever came along. Probably deer mostly, but we could see that they also had shotguns hanging out the windows. I don't believe that incident shows a problem with the WIHA program. I think they would have driven through any CRP field that was unfenced and unpoliced. I still regret not getting their tag number to report them, but I do feel good that we gave chase and obviously scared them off.
 
Had not seen the coyote hunting comments previously. but when in Kansas last week, someone brought up like comments re the coyote hunters driving all over the fields. Cannot say I witnessed it, but did see tracks in a few fields.
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Mental health advice
 
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Most of these guys who are driving through fields are locals. Probably kids. And unfortunately the blame usually falls on us, the law abiding, law respecting hunters.

KS is a big state during hunting season and there are not enough conservation officers as it is with the budget like it is. And I would expect they will get even fewer as time goes on. The best way is get the phone numbers for each county that are in the KDWP hunting regulations. Keep that in your truck handy at all times and report these guys. Even if you don't have a tag number at least give a description of the vehicle because chances are the CO knows exactly who it is because they have most likely delt with them previously. Tag numbers are good but a description of the vehicle is sometimes just as good. And if your lucky enough a description of the occupants, hats, clothing ect.
 
There are less than 60 conservation officers for 105 counties in Kansas. Their density is higher in the eastern part of the state due to population. Some CO's in the western part of the state have 5 counties, do the math. Most are going to check folks close to the road instead of wasting an hour waiting for someone hunting in the middle of a section to make it to the road. If you don't have the 800 number or the officer's number afield and see a violation, call 911. The dispatcher will dispatch the closest officer and they will atttend to the violators. Most of the tracks in CRP are deer hunters, if you can call them that. For some reason they believe that a permit to hunt deer gives them carte blanche to take a deer by whatever means. Those tracks let the roosters escape the dogs by running willy nilly away, not having to fight the grass. It's a problem that is ingrained in the local culture. You are the eyes for the CO's. If we are not willing to police our own, then our future will most certainly dwindle. Be a good witness, don't put yourself in harm's way by chasing or confronting. Get a vehicle description, tag number, and direction of travel. If you can give the number in the vehicle, that can help. VA, call the area biologist, wildlife manager, or CO before your next trip. The Kinsley area has become a parking lot over the past 8 years or so and has really slipped in bird numbers. The epicenter for pheasant and quail numbers this year was further north and west of there and you could have easily increased your bird contacts by 50-250 per day by making a few phone calls to the LOCAL agency employees. The locals are far less concerned about license sales and will give you a straight speal so you don't waste your time and money chasing what isn't there.
 
Actually I did call

Spoke to the area biologist for that area. He told me bird numbers were decent everywhere. He said if I wanted quail to concentrate south of the Arkansas River and SE of Great Bend. He said west of Great Bend the pheasant numbers were quite good. I did some home work in advance of driving 1,300 miles. Just didnt' work out the way we had hoped. That said, I still love Kansas and will return. Hopefully in the spring I'll be back for Turkey's, good lord willing of course.
 
vaturkey said:
Two of the WIHA's we hunted had been removed. Both of those held birds two years ago. Also, one area we hunted with great CRP etc. was covered in tire tracks through it in various places. Looks almost like someone tried to drive the pheasants out of the thick stuff by driving either trucks or 4-wheeler's through it. All the above was near Kinsley.
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Im late to the party on this topic but found something worth quoting.


You are right the locals are the ones driving the fields for coyotes. Personally I dont care that they do that, they are not hurting anything. They very likely know the landowners and the landowners very likely do not have a problem with them shooting coyotes.

Hunting them is not really my thing but the coyote hunter I spoke to this weekend who lets us hunt his primo pheasant ground told us (in a joking way) he thinks we're crazy for walking around in the cold chasing birds. So to each his own :)

He said him and a bunch of guys were gonna go out Feb 1 and hunt coyotes on the WIHA's as they are not allowed by KS regs to drive on the fields during the time they are enrolled. Hes lived there his whole life and farms himself so I know he knows what land he can and cannot drive on.

I also think a lot of tire tracks you were seeing on WIHA's were from people driving CRP for deer. I doubt very many of them were from coyote hunters.


As far as you having bad luck around Kinsley, that area has been one of my favorites the past 7 or so years, I hunted there a bit this year and did not have much luck. The cover was very thick in most places...maybe that wasnt conducive to pheasant brood rearing????? Much less quail brood rearing??? I got into some pheasants but not the numbers I had in the past.

And if I recall correctly, the dates you stated you were in KS - it was BITTER cold - I never have luck when its that cold and dont hunt...the birds sit still and dont move and are jumpy as all get out. If you have a dog they will probably have a hard time scenting the birds since they are not moving around at all. They are simply gonna fly to feed, eat and fly back to the roost. No wasted energy on anything else. Maybe that had something to do with not seeing much??? I think the weather was definitely a factor in your hunt.


And as far as the WIHA program, I have the maps from its inception since 1996 when I was in High School. I think it was a good idea in principle when it started but with all good things they must come to an end. Around 2000 or 2001 I noticed it start to go downhill.

I havent actually kept a database, but kept a mental note in my head and a lot of good productive WIHA's with excellent habitat are not enrolled very long. They typically will have a leased sign on them the following year or whenever their state contract is up. Leasing was not typically a way of life here and I think that as people from other states have come here and hunted they have brought that way of life with them. Its starting to spread. Luckily KS has not turned into TX yet but the day is likely coming in my lifetime.

Another thing I have been hearing from the many landowners I have visited with this year is they get sick of the amount of pressure that are put on them during the season and would just prefer to keep them out of the program. I think you will begin to see that more and more. Exhibit A would be going back to look at the WIHA maps at the programs inception, there was a ton of it close to KC, close to Wichita and in SE KS. Now a WIHA in SE KS is nearly non existent, and any within an hour drive of Wichita or KC are non exisitent. Im finding I need to drive about 2 hours or better to even find some.

This year I noticed the largest amount of out of state bird hunters and deer hunters Ive ever seen.

I had purposely been driving about 1.5-2.5 hours away from Wichita to avoid the crowds but that has completely backfired on me the past couple years. Places that have been good in years past this year were crawling with out of state plates. I think the internet hotspotting definitely has something to do with it. I typically will never say where i hunt or dont ever talk about my hunts online. Now meeting someone face to face or talking to them on the phone is different.

I also believe the state had some economic incentives in mind when they put forth this bird forecast. This is definitely not the best year in years at all. I think its pretty telling when you have driven as many miles as I have this year (granted i was limited to NC and SW KS) and hardly seen any pheasants in the ditches, flying across the roads or running across the roads. Years past when that was a common site, the hunting was much better.

Quail I definitely are a little better than they have been but no where near where they used to be.
 
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KsHusker,
I'm also from Wichita and I also drive 1-2 hours to get into birds every weekend. I'd tried sending you a PM, but not sure how the heck to do it. Anyways, would love to chat about bird hunting. Noticed you also hunt in SW Kansas and I do as well.
 
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