New GSP

F

FairOaksRod

Member
We just added a new addition to our family. "Chloe" is a 2 yr old GSP. Her previous owner wasn't a hunter and I doubt Chloe has run off leash much in her life. The only useful command she knew was sit. Got her last Sunday, 3/3. She now understands "stay" and "heel". She has incredible prey drive which is the main reason I took her. I've run her everyday since, yesterday was the first day off leash. At 2 yrs old, for field purposes, I'm going about things as if she was a puppy. Anything that moves catches her eye, she will give chase to all birds at this time. She even chases flying insects. I've put an ecollar on her the first day she was here to condition. Had to use it when she was off leash yesterday, but know this was wrong. Here was the situation: she started chasing a jackrabbit, and I saw no end in sight. The collar she had on is a dogtra 302 which on the website says for small, mild mannered dogs. I hit her at stimulation 40, no responce, 60, no response, 80, few head shakes, didn't slow a bit, 100, constant, headshakes, for 3-5 seconds before finally turning away, then slowly heading back. This blew me away. For all our other shorthairs 40 with this collar
creates a quick yelp, and things get back to normal.

So here are a couple of questions I have:

1. At her age, is my above action(treating as puppy in field) a good idea?


2. Please give input on ecollar situation.


3. What is a good method to break her from being a runner?


4. Does tighting the ecollar have any effect of the stimulation?

Thanks, in advance for your responses.

Note: Our 3 yr old male is very well trained. He pretty much does everything we tell him to do and responds very well to hand signals.
 
I would start with an ecollar suitable to the dog. I have a single dog Dogtra that works fine.

Shocking your dog on the rabbit was probably useless and likely did no harm. Ancient history. First things first: Teaching commands only then using the ecollar to punish disobedience - but only after you know the dog knows the command. The command in question was "whoa" which the dog does not yet know I assume. I taught my dog to whoa on our daily leash walks. It carried over to the field for the most part, but he did start on a rabbit the first season and a disobeyed "whoa" followed by a good jolt from the ecollar fixed the problem permanently. The "whoa" command can also be taught using a check lead. I started with a spike collar that tightens. Just before the dog reached the end I said "whoa." The check lead is also good for hand signals because when the dog reaches the end you can turn the dog in the direction you choose, get the dog's attention by a vibration or a whistle (preferably by lips), and when the dog looks at you you are giving it a hand signal. There's nothing better than the quiet hunting that comes with a dog that responds to vibrations, soft lip whistles, and hand signals.
 
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Agree Brit. The collar is not a trainer only a reinforcer. The stimulus is only applied until the dog responds to the command. They learn to turn the stimulus on and off. Different dogs respond to the stimulus differently. If the dog has a good drive, it will take more to grab their attention. I have golden retrievers, known to be soft, but they have a strong prey drive and at times I am at the max output on the collar to command a response. But never start with the collar or assume that they will be trained by the collar. Train in close where you can reinforce the command when it is learned in the yard then move to bigger area's.
 
Things are going pretty good with Chloe. We've trained almost every day. Missed one or two in the two weeks I've had her. She knows heel, and does it good, she knows stay and does that pretty good, she understands come and I'm doubleing the command with the vibration mode on the ecollar so in time I'll just page her. She kennels pretty good and is getting her bearings on riding free style in the back of the truck. She's 99% off rabbits after that one incident I wrote about earlier, which I felt good about. She's run fully off leash these past 3 days. Before that, when I had her on a 100 ft check cord, she jumped a rabbit and just watched, didn't give chase. At the time I thought maybe it was because she knew she was on leash. Then yesterday she jumped one off leash. She watched it for quite a while, turned and went another direction, but in the end curiosity caught up, she began to follow, hit her with 25 stim, a loud NO, and she was off it right now. Also working on "Get in the truck" She hasn't jumped in yet. Its over 80 degrees in Fair Oaks today, I took a 6 gallon water bottle with us and went thru most of it. Cant wait to start her on birds. Maybe Saturday.
 
i wont muddy the water with extra advice
just thought id comment"why do non hunting people buy one of the dedicated pointing breeds as pets?
a lady that has 2 gsp's (both gyps or bitches,whatever your preference)that i ran across at my exercising ground,which is unfortunately becoming a "dog park" was telling me how she couldnt wait to have her favorite gyp bred so they could have pups.
'do you dog train",i asked, no was the reply
"are you in a club or do you know what navhda is?" no again, just thought it odd, especially the breeding part
i understand the hunting breeds are handsome,its just that they're better pets when given of job of work
good luck with your new dog,it is possible to teach an older dogs new tricks,it just takes a little longer
 
im not a trainer but there is some bonding must that takes place. i dont know how long you've had her but ill guess that the dog never bonded with any body.
when she was a puppy she was cute when she got bigger she was" hyper"the old owner thought(guessing)
im scared of e- collars, id wait for awhile.its true ,they have to know the command before they can be shocked into obeying it,thats done with yard work . you keep 'em some where you can catch'em easy.we hope to keep than close to us because they love us
i know there's a training protocol(collars) that many experienced handlers make good progress with.
some of this stuff you have to see first hand,in other words maybe find a trainer or a club to help.trainers cost money,clubs like your navhda chapter may be a cheaper route to get access to experienced people,not saying your not
a rescue is kinda different than a puppy,you have to "un write the bad habits than rewrite good ones"cool you took on a rescue my opinion
i say rescue just becuase you didnt get her at 8 weeks old or so,most folks would advise patience
 
I kinda did rescue her when you really think about it. The whole process of obtaining her was very bizarre. Right away I thought it was some sort of scam. Thought maybe they were going to come back and steal her or something. I asked her why she bought a shorthair, and her reply was" she was so cute". Honestly, I think the poor dog was kenneled all day while the lady was at work, I know she had never seen the outside world. I know she has been at least mildly abused. Basically I have a 2 yr old puppy. I believe she was around a handful of people in her 2 yrs. and the lady did have another small dog. My brother and I spend a good 2 hours with the lady and dog on a Sunday, my brother orginally was intrested, but deceided against it. So I told him I'd take her(after getting the OK from the wife). When my brother picked her up, the lady told him "Do not give her to your brother". I told my wife and 12 yr old son to prepare for a couple sleepless nights, figured she howl-cry, be homesick for a couple nights. Dogs just must know stuff. Right off it was as if we were her family for the two years she's been alive. No crying, no homesickness, just happiness. Her prey drive is crazy. I thought my 3 yr old male had great prey drive, Shes more instinctive than he is. I'm having a blast with both of them, taking things slow with her. Just today I was thinking about the bonding process, I don't think it is 100% yet, but we are getting there. She's come farther in the two weeks we've had her than I expected. Oh yea, she loved to play tug of war, gets pretty aggresive at it. I'm using this game to teach No/Stop, and to give up the rope when I say to. No/Stop is going good, giving up the rope, thats another story.
 
back when me and some of my hunting friends , started getting bird dogs,late teens ,early 20's,inthe 1970's ,i remember one kid's grandfather who was an avid duck hunter and had a pretty good labrador said "the dog belong to whoever feeds her/him EVERYDAY.i think that was his way of saying
dont slough off our duties on parents, siblings, etc.
the bonding process to me is just the dog has to realize that its funner to work with the owner than by themselves.some dogs do have more "self hunt"
than others. the dog must have some,too much is hard to work with.sounds like your doing right
 
FairOaksRod said:
Things are going pretty good with Chloe. We've trained almost every day. Missed one or two in the two weeks I've had her. She knows heel, and does it good, she knows stay and does that pretty good, she understands come and I'm doubleing the command with the vibration mode on the ecollar so in time I'll just page her. She kennels pretty good and is getting her bearings on riding free style in the back of the truck. She's 99% off rabbits after that one incident I wrote about earlier, which I felt good about. She's run fully off leash these past 3 days. Before that, when I had her on a 100 ft check cord, she jumped a rabbit and just watched, didn't give chase. At the time I thought maybe it was because she knew she was on leash. Then yesterday she jumped one off leash. She watched it for quite a while, turned and went another direction, but in the end curiosity caught up, she began to follow, hit her with 25 stim, a loud NO, and she was off it right now. Also working on "Get in the truck" She hasn't jumped in yet. Its over 80 degrees in Fair Oaks today, I took a 6 gallon water bottle with us and went thru most of it. Cant wait to start her on birds. Maybe Saturday.
Click to expand...

In the field I use my raised arm for "come." If he isn't looking at me I give a short, one note whistle or a vibration of the ecollar. Then when he looks at me I raise my arm straight up and he comes.
 
Need some insight. Feeding time is becoming aggresive and showing inconsistant behavior. Aside from these times, everything else is pretty cool. Yesterday I kenneled Chloe in her kennel with her breakfast, then gave Manny his at the other end of the garage. He ignored his bowl and was trying to get to Chloes. They were going at it although they were seperated by the kennel. (Hers is a 100% see through metal cage, wood floor added, pillow on top) I say hers because this came with her. Both dogs sleep in there from time to time. I put Manny in his and left for work, had my wife let them out when she got home from taking Wayne to school. So tonite I put Chloe in the other kennel. Its an airline approved XL and has 80% less visibility, if not more. Left her in there for about 1/2 hour, when I returned all her food was gone. Manny was left free in the garage, and didn't eat his. During this time I heard a few barks from Chloe, peeked threw the garage windows, nothing serious. When I let Chloe out Manny went ovewr and ate all his food. Sometimes Chloe eats hers first, sometimes Manny first, sometimes together. Manny has established dominance, but Chloe sure looks formidible when she shows her fangs. What do you guys think?
 
sounds normal to me
theyre protective of food and their boxes,this proves how important their boxes can be to them,i mentioned it in another post the old dog will be jealous of the new dog,they'll still hunt together.they might compete in the field ,this may be good or bad
 
Bare with me guys, but here's another one... Chloe loves and I mean LOVES to play tug-of-war. It gets pretty heated. At first my thinking was a good way to teach her a few comm ands. I incorperate "no" "let go" "Stop" and "easy" however stop and let go are the main ones. She has a soft mouth when carrying a tennis ball around, but when it comes to that rope, she hates to let it go. So the question is, is it a bad thing to encourage/ praise/go along with an overly aggresive attitude? Could it transform into aggression towards people? Haven't seen anything like this yet, she is 2, but I have had her less than a month. Thanks in advance.
 
I supposed it could, but not likely, however, it could cause bad habits with regards to retrieving and giving up birds. Force fetch is a good way to make the dog a non-slip retriever.

Regarding collar use:

Used for trash breaking ala chasing deer, rabbits or any other fur game that you don't want your dog chasing, then using the correct collar on it's highest setting is actually favored. Different story when steadying a dog around birds. There you need the dog to first be Whoa trained. The dog should know the command well before the collar can be used for correction around birds. The whole idea is that the dog will make the association that if he moves after given the whoa command, he will be corrected for doing so and not make a negative association to the bird itself. Trash breaking on the other hand, is to stop the dog at all cost right then and there. You WANT the negative association to be "just that" for chasing unwanted animals.
 
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