Lost birds

benelli-banger said:
I‘m only referring to mine…seeing a dog appear with a bird, especially a tough recovery, at a great distance…it doesn’t get any better than that. For me. YMMV. 🍻🥳 Obviously there are dumbasses out there, some of whom have dogs….doesn’t change what gives me my greatest joy…they just don’t get invited back. Very few over the years….thankfully. 👍
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Can me and goose come hunting with you next year?
 
KEOutdoors said:
I agree with most of what you said, except for the guy taking a 45yd quartering shots. Thats how they are getting the cripples. You arent holding a good pattern at 45yds with lead shot unless you are shooting a Full choke, and not many do that. Desperation shots like that is the problem, and the result of a cripple, miss, or gimped bird is the direct result of your bad choice in shouldering the gun.. and it will happen more times than not. You seem to suggest this is the norm?
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No not the norm. Maybe I'll do a better job of explaining myself now. My point was that not every shot we have at a rooster is cut and dry. A bird near the edge of effective range is the toughest decision to make. If he's just a bit farther than you thought you just wounded a bird you might not recover. If he's a little bit closer than you thought there's one for the crock pot. Ballistic study and shell/ constriction are very important considerations. Time in the field and personal experience are the best teachers in my opinion. Your extreme example of a guy losing 10 birds in a week, is a good one. That hunter is doing something, or perhaps many things wrong. Have you ever shot at any game bird and then a second later thought you shouldn't have? (Rhetorical question).
 
Reading this thread got my mind thinking too. While I don't have the number of days in the field a year as some of the guys here, between waterfowl in Wisconsin marshes such as Horican, Eldorado, Sheboygan and Mullet as well as pheasants in those areas and pheasants in both Dakotas......I have been fortunate, I can recall 6, maybe 7 lost birds over my lab in his career thus far. He will be 8 this July, shot my 1st pheasants over him when he was 4 months old. He has made some spectacular recoveries, both on ducks and pheasants.
He's tough and strong, driven and determined....on land he's like a greyhound and in the water he's Iike an otter. I've had to call him off of 2 cripples in his time, for fear of losing him. Once this year out in SD into the endless expanse of a cattail marsh, that bird had a head start on him and ran track! And once on Lake Winnebago here a couple years back in whitecaps on a bird that just kept diving and pushing further offshore.

With that though, I also 100% agree with the sentiments on knowing what your ammo, choke and gun is capable of, as well as you're own abilities. I take shots I know my equipment can make, the misses or cripples are on me or the other shooter.
 
matto said:
I lost a quail last year that we actually saw and almost had hands on. The dogs found it, it took off running, the dogs and I chased, and it disappeared. After many minutes of additional searching we discovered a small animal burrow, probably no bigger in diameter than a softball. The dogs and I were both convinced that the quail had run down into the burrow. At the time it seemed very unusual. I reached in as far as I dared, but didn't really want to find whatever had made the burrow in the first place.

Then earlier this year I read something from Dale Rollins at Rolling Plains Quail Research Ranch that documented coveys using burrows to escape avian predators.

That made me remember an incident from 5-6 years ago when a blocker watched a covey of quail run 20-30 yards from a milo field to a clump of brush/weeds no bigger in diameter than a tractor tire. The space in between was basically open gravel. He waited for us, the walkers, to get there and then we tried to flush the quail from the clump. Nothing. The clump was completely surrounded by more open gravel and the blocker swore that he would have seen the birds leave it, if they had done so. In the middle of clump, a couple of critter burrows...

Maybe I should add a shovel to my kit...
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Dug this one out with a fence post… rat hole in a mesquite… seems to happen a couple times a year.
 
Working on uploading video of this cripple find, amen to dogs are the heros. I was digging to help locate the bird and saw the last 6" of his tail. Here is a Pic of what I saw.
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I like the phrase "You do you." I am unapologetic for my dogs or for my decisions. I am comfortable with how I hunt and how my dogs hunt. People and dogs can evolve quicker by failing faster. I used to golf a lot and no matter how many balls I hit on the range I just had to get out and play knowing I may not be perfect and that I am going to miss shots. My golf game improved at a much faster rate when I played more rounds and decreased the practice range time. The parallel here is that my dogs and I have learned far more by spending time in the field and learning from our mistakes than disproportionally spending too much time working on technical aspects with the goal of being perfect. I learned that I will miss 100% of the shots I don't take so I evolved through some trial and error.

I had my most successful season this year in both numbers of pheasants shot and cripples retrieved. Nearly 200 pheasants were shot over my two Viszlas. There were occasions where I hunted with friends who also had dogs but I would estimate that at least 140 pheasants were shot when it was just Ellie and Willow. I know the number of lost birds was less than 5 this year. Ellie is in her 7th season and has evolved into a Vizsla that can retrieve as well as most dogs I have observed in the field or through video. Willow has the potential but I let Ellie interrupt her retrieves and that is my fault. Both look significantly different than their rookie season or even second season. I would attribute their accomplishments this season to failing fast through experiential learning in the field and evolving from each of those experiences.

I apologize for the lengthy description of the most recent lost bird. This lost bird really grinded my gears. A rooster flushed at the end of a tree row commonly referred to as "Money Grove" and I put what I considered a kill shot at about 20 yards. The bird hit the ground and bounced up and headed back towards the tree row. Ellie was all over it and scooped it up. She must have taken a spur because she loosened up just enough for that rooster to escape into the tree row. They played ring around the rosie in the trees for a few seconds and the rooster zigged and zagged enough to get Ellie on the wrong side and the rooster darted up the tree row. Ellie lost site for a second and by the time she deciphered the trail the bird was gone down the tree row. We had the wind to our advantage and the dogs both got excited by a deadfall of trees twenty yards or so down the tree row. They tried to get under the deadfall from every angle but simply could not do it. Personally I would have needed a Stihl chainsaw to get through it to get at the bird. We gave it a 10-15 minute good old college try before throwing the towel in. I am comfortable with that decision. It also provides a scenario where common sense to move on with the day prevailed.

This thread has certainly provide some entertainment for me. I see all sides of this but in the end remember that opening phrase "you do you" and don't ever apologize for that.
 
I admire folks and dogs that yield low loss %s on game. We should all strive for that. I think that the reality is that wounding/loss rates in general are likely too high. This includes 'misses' where a bird flies off with a pellet or two to die later. Having lost some birds over the years has shaded my preference in dogs to recovery-oriented breeds to minimize this as much as possible. I also over-gun on pheasant - for me it's a 12 gauge deal unless a hunter is very disciplined. Most aren't IMHO but I'm sure there are exceptions. No offense to out-of-state hunters, but 90+% of guys are taking a crack a that 40 yard bird after investing in a week-long hunt. Resident guys *might* be more selective. Like many have said here, good dogs, appropriate loads, and reasonable ranges = lower losses.
 
Abbeyroad said:
I admire folks and dogs that yield low loss %s on game. We should all strive for that. I think that the reality is that wounding/loss rates in general are likely too high. This includes 'misses' where a bird flies off with a pellet or two to die later. Having lost some birds over the years has shaded my preference in dogs to recovery-oriented breeds to minimize this as much as possible. I also over-gun on pheasant - for me it's a 12 gauge deal unless a hunter is very disciplined. Most aren't IMHO but I'm sure there are exceptions. No offense to out-of-state hunters, but 90+% of guys are taking a crack a that 40 yard bird after investing in a week-long hunt. Resident guys *might* be more selective. Like many have said here, good dogs, appropriate loads, and reasonable ranges = lower losses.
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Great post. I’m a fan of shooting at hit birds a 2nd time if safely possible, no matter how “dead” they are! Lots of “dead” birds come back to life once they hit the ground! 🤬
 
Seeing a dog make a hard retrieve may be the pinnacle of any of my hunts and this year has been very hard with the mid season dry weather, As some have stated Ive seen at least four birds fly that 100yd + this year and suddenly fly straight up and then crumple dead. Usually a very easy retrieve if marked. That being said Im not sure how many birds were lost this year but Id guess close to 10. This would include my adult son and his two labs and my two DDs. (Labs both very good and one DD is only now 10 months). Its a;ways frusturating and we spend a lot of time looking but its part of the hunt These guys who never lose a bird must have some super exceptional dogs or maybe selective math or memory ;)
 
I’m sure I lost many more than 2, but I recall shooting 2 in about 5 seconds in early November in a food plot…both dogs ran to the first bird, didn’t mark the second, who was a runner, and there was lots of scent in there, and, it was very dry, and one of my dogs overheated...had been hunting for 20-25 minutes by then, shot 4. I finally chose to attend to her, should have a bit sooner. My last lost bird, about 9 days ago, flushed along with 100 others out of a cattail slough, and I shot it going away, as it crested a hill in the pasture…couldn’t see it for more than a second or two…one dog marked it and followed it, presumably into another slough about 100 yards away that had a100+ birds in it…looked for 30 minutes, til dark. If I recover 95% I’m ecstatic, and if it’s between 90-95% I can live with that based on my experiences over the past 30+ years. I’m gonna put a LM tube in my ultralight before going back out in 5 days. I helped hunting pals recover 10+ this fall, and one of my pals helped me recover 2. I‘ve hunted around 22-23 days thus far in SD, generally a day is pretty active with bird contacts and shots/kills. Probably lost between 5-8..absolutely hate it! Most of this season has been tough from a scenting perspective…very dry, fairly warm.
 
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benelli-banger said:
I’m sure I lost many more than 2, but I recall shooting 2 in about 5 seconds in early November in a food plot…both dogs ran to the first bird, didn’t mark the second, who was a runner, and there was lots of scent in there, and, it was very dry, and one of my dogs overheated...had been hunting for 20-25 minutes by then, shot 4. I finally chose to attend to her, should have a bit sooner. My last lost bird, about 9 days ago, flushed along with 100 others out of a cattail slough, and I shot it going away, as it crested a hill in the pasture…couldn’t see it for more than a second or two…one dog marked it and followed it, presumably into another slough about 100 yards away that had a100+ birds in it…looked for 30 minutes, til dark. If I recover 95% I’m ecstatic, and if it’s between 90-95% I can live with that based on my experiences over the past 30+ years. I’m gonna put a LM tube in my ultralight before going back out in 5 days. I helped hunting pals recover 10+ this fall, and one of my pals helped me recover 2. I‘ve hunted around 22-23 days thus far in SD, generally a day is pretty active with bird contacts and shots/kills. Probably lost between 5-8..absolutely hate it! Most of this season has been tough from a scenting perspective…very dry, fairly warm.
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BB, Two very real scenarios that make it very hard for even the very best dogs. You can rest comfortably on the effort you put in to track down those birds. We fail forward learning from each scenario and evolving. Both the hunter and dog(s) are better because of these situations. Sounds like you had a great season BB!
 
I’ve hunted the SD opener for the third year now. Cattails in mid October are way different than mid November. I remember entering a cattail patch the size of 5 football field. Excited to see the birds but wondering how many we would be able to find. Two of my best memories of the 2023 were from that weekend of retrieves in cattails the opening weekend. That being said I also lost one in cattails that were 5 to 6 ft tall and green that weekend. Dogs don’t see them flush and it’s hard to mark them yourself when you can’t move or run a straight line to where they land. It’s 60* and may not even be on the ground but hung up on top of cattails. Who ever posted the picture of the Dewalt weed eater is forever etched in my mind, that will put a smile on my face till the end of time.
 
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