Kansas Trespassing Fee for Private Land

[Thatguy]

My email was on the waterfowl aspect. I know Mr. Rider usually responds but he hasnt this time. Sill responded to me and invited me to join in on the zoom meeting on the 14th. Unfortunately I will be at work.

My dealings with Lauber are not great. He is an arrogant ahole. I sent numerous emails for the last 5 years about our perilously low turkey numbers. He was only concerned about loss of the fall season. I personally know 2 of the NWTF biologists and I talk to Mr. Fricke a couple times a year. They wanted to follow the conservation plan they had made years prior. Lauber wanted to change the plan to fit his agenda.

 

[Kansascutter]

Mid-day update, only attempted a call to Mr. Lauber (chair, hence key) as I'd heard back from none of the Commissioners IRT previous emails. No dice so far, call neither answered nor returned.

So far, I'm not getting the impression that the Commission is much interested in improving wildlife management or access for Kansans. Perhaps they are essentially honorary positions with no real authority to act. The alternative - no, or even contrary motivation - would be even more disheartening. Not particularly encouraging to learn that a Commissioner who own land feels compelled to leave the state just to hunt the deer that were once abundant, pre-mass marketing of non-resident licenses. If Commissioners don't bother to hunt what remains of the resource available in Kansas, God help us little people.

Does the Governor know what is happening to her state and its people?

I feel the same. We’re going to have to inundate them to the point they can’t turn there heads anymore

 

[Kansascutter]

My email was on the waterfowl aspect. I know Mr. Rider usually responds but he hasnt this time. Sill responded to me and invited me to join in on the zoom meeting on the 14th. Unfortunately I will be at work.

My dealings with Lauber are not great. He is an arrogant ahole. I sent numerous emails for the last 5 years about our perilously low turkey numbers. He was only concerned about loss of the fall season. I personally know 2 of the NWTF biologists and I talk to Mr. Fricke a couple times a year. They wanted to follow the conservation plan they had made years prior. Lauber wanted to change the plan to fit his agenda.

This here is 100% correct. He is in it for his own, personal agenda. If you can view past meetings, you guys should watch this last one on the turkey seasons. You’ll get a feel for what Lauber is all about

 

[KSnative]

Native. If you can't get responses from these board members, go to the next step. Talk to your state representatives, and or Senators. Tell them what you are trying to do for Kansas. Ask them to contact the board members. Put some heat on them. Surely out of all the guys here someone knows a rep or Senator personally. You may even have to contact your Governor's office about the lack of response from those board members. Keep up the good work !!

Since the Commissioners all report directly to the Governor, that would be the next rung if no action results (and that's the feeling I'm getting here). As I currently do not reside (hence, do not vote) in Kansas - I'm sure the palace guard won't be interested in patching me through to the governor.

I'm off to do some actual business, so will be butting out for a while. I will check back on my return to see if any sparks "took". I remain interested, and believe it should be a no-brainer to pursue a fair share of Pittman-Robertson funds for Kansas (which would allow fewer cash cow non-resident licenses, hence markedly better opportunities for Kansans, and future generations of Kansans) - but frankly I'm not seeing any indication of a groundswell of interest beyond about 3 or 4 people here (and that includes me). If that is the case, the status quo will - and should - prevail. Fair enough.

 

[KsHusker]

Since the Commissioners all report directly to the Governor, that would be the next rung if no action results (and that's the feeling I'm getting here). As I currently do not reside (hence, do not vote) in Kansas - I'm sure the palace guard won't be interested in patching me through to the governor.

I'm off to do some actual business, so will be butting out for a while. I will check back on my return to see if any sparks "took". I remain interested, and believe it should be a no-brainer to pursue a fair share of Pittman-Robertson funds for Kansas (which would allow fewer cash cow non-resident licenses, hence markedly better opportunities for Kansans), and future generations of Kansans - but frankly I'm not seeing any indication of a groundswell of interest beyond about 3 or 4 people here (and that includes me). If that is the case, the status quo will - and should - prevail. Fair enough.

There are a few people who are interested - but as pointed out - it's mainly the Kansas Bowhunters Association, and the KS Outfitters association.

I've tried to call the Governors office (not related to wildlife save for once concerning appointment on the wildlife commission) and fat chance of being able to talk to anyone. Our business is in Topeka city limits and I live just outside of town. They dont care if you're a KS resident or not. Means nothing to them - only way to get facetime or attention is to have a cause the media cares about and makes them look bad or good or to donate money.

Gov Kelly is one step away from worthless. She plays just as dirty as the rest of them.

I've got some of my own business issues I need to address over the next month or so then some personal things - but will have the will to tackle outing selfish people such as Lauber -- what I have in mind should be a good vehicle to do so.

 

[Kansascutter]

Since the Commissioners all report directly to the Governor, that would be the next rung if no action results (and that's the feeling I'm getting here). As I currently do not reside (hence, do not vote) in Kansas - I'm sure the palace guard won't be interested in patching me through to the governor.

I'm off to do some actual business, so will be butting out for a while. I will check back on my return to see if any sparks "took". I remain interested, and believe it should be a no-brainer to pursue a fair share of Pittman-Robertson funds for Kansas (which would allow fewer cash cow non-resident licenses, hence markedly better opportunities for Kansans), and future generations of Kansans - but frankly I'm not seeing any indication of a groundswell of interest beyond about 3 or 4 people here (and that includes me). If that is the case, the status quo will - and should - prevail. Fair enough.

There are a lot of waterfowlers getting involved over on the Refuge Forum.

 

[Thatguy]

I got a response from Rider this morning about the waterfowl pressure. He says it will be discussed and I was not alone with my thoughts.

Did run the NR deer tags issue by a rancher buddy. He thinks they should be otc. He is also a voter so it puts the commissioners and governor in a hard spot.

 

[Kansascutter]

I got a response from Rider this morning about the waterfowl pressure. He says it will be discussed and I was not alone with my thoughts.

Did run the NR deer tags issue by a rancher buddy. He thinks they should be otc. He is also a voter so it puts the commissioners and governor in a hard spot.

I got the same. Rider did mention that the legislature has impeded the KDWPT in the past when it came to licensing guides

 

[Thatguy]

I got the same. Rider did mention that the legislature has impeded the KDWPT in the past when it came to licensing guides

If I remember correctly the no guide license was a compromise when transferable tags went away since there was a big segment of landowners that were also acting as outfitters.

 

[JSMITH]

Any one besides Chestle (and me, but I don't really count) attempting to communicate with the Commissioners - and if so, any replies, constructive or otherwise? Planning to Zoom in on the meeting this week, or better yet -attend?

Planning on zoom. Would you consider starting a new thread with a link for the meeting and a few key talking points? I think some guys are probably skipping over this thread now with 200 some replies.

 

[KSnative]

Planning on zoom. Would you consider starting a new thread with a link for the meeting and a few key talking points? I think some guys are probably skipping over this thread now with 200 some replies.

I just looked at the last input or two, myself - and would do the same on a new thread. Am I missing something?

Anyway - here, verbatim, is the response I got from Aaron Rider: "Thanks for your email... Deer biologists make recommendations of season dates to the commission. The department and the Secretary allot the amount of non-resident deer tags for each unit." So blame KDWPT/Secretary for non-resident deer tag apportionment and season dates (presumably including possible resident only early block) -that falls on the biologists.

So, my takeaway is that the sole purpose of the Commission is to provide bureaucratic top cover for whatever KDWPT wishes to do. You don't need a Commission to do that - KDWPT can ignore the wishes of the Kansas voters all by themselves. Does anyone read that differently?

 

[Chestle]

This is what I received from Rider:

"I really appreciate your email. You make lots of great suggestions. I'll take note of them and also forward those on as well. We have been getting lots of feedback about these issues."

Rider and Sill were the only two acknowledgements I received.

I suspect KDPWT is another one of those established government entities that are insulated from outside interference. I doubt the Governor cares much about bird seasons or anything else. As long as there are no problems, she'll leave them alone. Looks like the Commissioners don't make much input and in any case they come and go. The KDPWT goes on.

One thing I found interesting is that Rider, on the surface, doesn't appear to be a political appointment. So maybe the answer is for people like us to apply to serve on the commission. More research required but I found this from 2014:

"Columbus teacher appointed to commission – At 34, Aaron Rider is one of the youngest to serve on the KDWPT commission. The high school teacher from Columbus was recently appointed to the seven-member panel by Gov. Sam Brownback. He fills the seat vacated by Robert Wilson, of Pittsburg, who served eight years.

“Hopefully that will bring a different demographic and different point of view to the commission,” Rider said of his age. “This is very important to me. Obviously since I’m in the education business, the future is a passion of mine.”

Rider, registered to vote as an independent, said he applied for the position and has attended past meetings and watched them online.

Married with two small children, Rider was born and raised in southeast Kansas, largely on a farm in his family since 1867. He’s spent a lot of time in the Mined Lands Wildlife Area." Link: Wildlife officials heading to western Kansas to dicuss pheasant population | The Wichita Eagle

 

[KSnative]

This is what I received from Rider:

"I really appreciate your email. You make lots of great suggestions. I'll take note of them and also forward those on as well. We have been getting lots of feedback about these issues."

Rider and Sill were the only two acknowledgements I received.

I suspect KDPWT is another one of those established government entities that are insulated from outside interference. I doubt the Governor cares much about bird seasons or anything else. As long as there are no problems, she'll leave them alone. Looks like the Commissioners don't make much input and in any case they come and go. The KDPWT goes on.

One thing I found interesting is that Rider, on the surface, doesn't appear to be a political appointment. So maybe the answer is for people like us to apply to serve on the commission. More research required but I found this from 2014:

"Columbus teacher appointed to commission – At 34, Aaron Rider is one of the youngest to serve on the KDWPT commission. The high school teacher from Columbus was recently appointed to the seven-member panel by Gov. Sam Brownback. He fills the seat vacated by Robert Wilson, of Pittsburg, who served eight years.

“Hopefully that will bring a different demographic and different point of view to the commission,” Rider said of his age. “This is very important to me. Obviously since I’m in the education business, the future is a passion of mine.”

Rider, registered to vote as an independent, said he applied for the position and has attended past meetings and watched them online.

Married with two small children, Rider was born and raised in southeast Kansas, largely on a farm in his family since 1867. He’s spent a lot of time in the Mined Lands Wildlife Area." Link: Wildlife officials heading to western Kansas to dicuss pheasant population | The Wichita Eagle

Mr. Rider is new, he may soon figure out that it is OK, and easier, to just ignore the huge, but passive, block of hunting voters in Kansas. I certainly hope not.

Ms Sill sent a very nice response - and I believe she is sincere. And frustrated. One of seven. I am contemplating inviting her to deer hunt my place next year (after my niece and nephew bag theirs, which usually takes a single day for both). Otherwise I may just give it up and join the
herd (lease my place out) with a view to contributing all proceeds to the campaign of the next pol who seems interested in the task of serving active outdoors- type Kansans.

Great idea for all here who are eligible to apply for all future vacancies on the Commission. Web site for submitting applications provided in one of my earlier posts in this string. I am not eligible, wish I was. Appointments last 4 years, and we have one solid Commissioner and one "we hope so" of seven - so all here will most likely have moved on to other things long before a majority can be attained. The ONLY way to make progress in anything like the short or mid term is to hold the sole accountable, electable official responsible. That would be your current Governor. Who doesn't know we exist (and has not reason to, now).

 

[KSnative]

Mr. Rider is new, he may soon figure out that it is OK, and easier, to just ignore the huge, but passive, block of hunting voters in Kansas. I certainly hope not.

Ms Sill sent a very nice response - and I believe she is sincere. And frustrated. One of seven. I am contemplating inviting her to deer hunt my place next year (after my niece and nephew bag theirs, which usually takes a single day for both). Otherwise I may just give it up and join the
herd (lease my place out) with a view to contributing all proceeds to the campaign of the next pol who seems interested in the task of serving active outdoors- type Kansans.

Great idea for all here who are eligible to apply for all future vacancies on the Commission. Web site for submitting applications provided in one of my earlier posts in this string. I am not eligible, wish I was. Appointments last 4 years, and we have one solid Commissioner and one "we hope so" of seven - so all here will most likely have moved on to other things long before a majority can be attained. The ONLY way to make progress in anything like the short or mid term is to hold the sole accountable, electable official responsible. That would be your current Governor. Who doesn't know we exist (and has not reason to, now).

• Today at 8:49 AM
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KsHusker said:
Thank you for the extra details "ThatGuy"- I see none other than my present elected state official Ken Corbett presented some of the heinous legislation years ago just like he presented it in 2018 to bring back landowner transfer tags.


Yes - I've heard and read many times over the years that the biologists of the KDWP oppose the legislation. There'd be digging to be done to find these articles/minutes - but they are there somewhere I'm sure on the web.

Problem is the legislators and partially the wildlife commission.

No sir. The problem is not that some people did something over two decades ago, nor is it a FAILED legislative initiative submitted by your boogey man 3 years ago. But thanks for (FINALLY) acknowledging "partial" culpability on the part of the Commission while conveniently overlooking which each of the seven have in common - their boss. Your Governor - today, in 2021.

If you are suggesting that the good scientists/biologists are eternally at loggerheads with their leader at the top of the KDWPT (who reports to the Governor, not the legislature) - you might just have rooted up an acorn. Who approves the deer sales formula that the biologists, by law, produce?

 

[KSnative]

• Today at 8:49 AM
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No sir. The problem is not that some people did something over two decades ago, nor is it a FAILED legislative initiative submitted by your boogey man 3 years ago. But thanks for (FINALLY) acknowledging "partial" culpability on the part of the Commission while conveniently overlooking which each of the seven have in common - their boss. Your Governor - today, in 2021.

If you are suggesting that the good scientists/biologists are eternally at loggerheads with their leader at the top of the KDWPT (who reports to the Governor, not the legislature) - you might just have rooted up an acorn. Who approves the deer sales formula that the biologists, by law, produce?

s.davis said:
Kansas could ban all out of state hunting next season and the number of resident hunters would still continue to fall. Everybody loves a scapegoat, but there's a level of delusion at play here that is remarkable.

And your solution is?

I am presuming (dangerous!) that the question is still "how can we reduce the leasing mania, so as to increase opportunities for Kansas residents".
Hard to see how increased opportunities for resident hunters could be anything BUT a good thing. What am I missing?

 

[KSnative]

KSnative said:
And your solution is?

I am presuming (dangerous!) that the question is still "how can we reduce the leasing mania, so as to increase opportunities for Kansas residents".
Hard to see how increased opportunities for resident hunters could be anything BUT a good thing. What am I missing?

Native,
It’s obvious you’re a NR but actually get what is going on here. You’ve weeded thru the BS that has been going on in this state for way to long. You’re passionate and educated and I don’t detect too much self serving interests in your posts. That being said, S. Davis is what we residents term a border jumper. He claims to be Kansas born but is obviously a MO resident. He wants his cake and the ability to eat it too. He howls and name calls any KS resident who thinks there is a problem here. I’d be more than happy to copy and paste his multiple posts disparaging KS residents on other forums who think it’s way past time for NR lotteries and addressing the leasing/outfitter problems. In short, you aren’t missing anything. S. Davis and thousands like him, love the KDWPT/Legislative status quo. They get to reap what KS sows and want zero change in that.

Appreciate the kind comments, Cutter. FWIW - my only self interest here is for my wonderful cousins, nieces and nephews who still reside in Kansas. They are the salt of the earth, and I'm just happy that I can offer them some decent hunting opportunities - and wonder if they'd be as avid, if I could not.

 

[BrownDogsCan2]

You took someone else’s thread and turned it into 12 pages of listening to yourself talk. At least keep it to one thread . Wow

 

[Kansascutter]

And your solution is?

I am presuming (dangerous!) that the question is still "how can we reduce the leasing mania, so as to increase opportunities for Kansas residents".
Hard to see how increased opportunities for resident hunters could be anything BUT a good thing. What am I missing?

Native,
It’s obvious you’re a NR but actually get what is going on here. You’ve weeded thru the BS that has been going on in this state for way to long. You’re passionate and educated and I don’t detect too much self serving interests in your posts. That being said, S. Davis is what we residents term a border jumper. He claims to be Kansas born but is obviously a MO resident. He wants his cake and the ability to eat it too. He howls and name calls any KS resident who thinks there is a problem here. I’d be more than happy to copy and paste his multiple posts disparaging KS residents on other forums who think it’s way past time for NR lotteries and addressing the leasing/outfitter problems. In short, you aren’t missing anything. S. Davis and thousands like him, love the KDWPT/Legislative status quo. They get to reap what KS sows and want zero change in that.

Appreciate the kind comments, Cutter. FWIW - my only self interest here is for my wonderful cousins, nieces and nephews who still reside in Kansas. They are the salt of the earth, and I'm just happy that I can offer them some decent hunting opportunities - and wonder if they'd be as avid, if I could not.

Keep fighting the fight. If for nothing else, at least you tried for your family. There is a bit of groundswell among the waterfowlers which gives me hope. I’m not laying down, I owe it my 14 yo KS born son.

 

[BrownDogsCan2]

You took someone else’s thread and turned it into 12 pages of listening to yourself talk. At least keep it to one thread . Wow

 

[KSnative]

Thank you! And exposed several poseurs and charlatans while I was at it.
Plus over 9000 views, and you just helped.