Gun auction feed back

onpoint

onpoint

Active member
What would you do?

As some of you know, I bought a 97 Winchester on a gun auction back on the 2nd of this month.

Here's my issues

The seller has a A+ Rating with over 160 things sold on the site.

My issue is, the seller had no fax machine to fax the FFL to. He wanted a U.S. postal money order(I'm fine with that). I investigated the seller a little. I came up with three different phone numbers for this business and person. Two address's(1) street)(1)P.O box). I e-mailed him a couple times. It took him several days to get back to me. It took 9 days for him to get the money order, be it took that long in the mail or it took him that long to go to the post office to pick it up, as he requested I send in to a P.O box instead of the business's address. He said it was shipped yesterday. He has supplied no tracking number. Also, he's only open for business from 4-6PM on certain days or by appointment only.

How would you give this seller a rating? Myself..I'm not pleased:( Time will tell if the gun ever shows up.
 
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A-, if the scattergun is ok.

I have a physical address and receive my mail at a PO Box...prior to that I had a General Delivery address. No issue there.
Neither would be the lack of a Fax machine....good for him.
Maybe he was busy re the 9 days with the money order, his money to let sit....but, one would expect that if selling then a no return of an e-mail would be less easy to explain and a bit impolite to a purchaser.
However, it seems a small point as the gun was shipped....until it is inspected.
You could have requested a tracking number....it's a considerate idea and, perhaps, a wise one but hardly a deal-breaker.

All given, it appears a tad early to be displeased.
Again, A- at this juncture.
Personally, I would hate to deal with the general public.
 
What I have found, it's much better to deal with a person who has a gun shop/store front. These back yard guys tend to drag their feet and are only it to dabble. I won't give him his feed back until I see the gun and inspect it.
 
Well, sure.....if a legitimate storefront but that is the nature of Internet sales...one engages knowing the risks inherent in the dark.
Sometimes tho good deals come from the backyards of regular guys.
 
I have had quite a number of gun auction transactions. Some were expiditious, some a little long. I have had one gun I bought which was misrepresented. I rate mine on the condition of the gun. I have had buyers take three weeks to send me an FFL after, they made payment. A lot of these guys both buyers and sellers are old school, and old fashioned, another words a lot like us! I would rate the guy an A if the gun arrives in a few days and all is as described. By the way, I found shipping to be better through the post office, insured to be much more satisfactory than UPS.UPS likes to throw things, I had a broken stock to deal with on a double with a $500.00 at todays prices, piece of wood. By and large, I have found the buyers to be a bigger pain then the sellers. By the way, by strict interpretation of the law, a faxed FFL is not considered absolutely legal. It must have an original signature, and there have been guys in trouble for excepting them, mostly an add on charge after the ATF has an agenda, but there it is. I tire of all the C&R, FFL crap, so now I buy guns built before Dec.31, 1898. Ship direct, domestic or import, no FFL, gun control act of 1968, or government stooges of any kind. I have sleeved some barrels, but the determining factor is the date of manufacture of the reciever, so improvements don't impact the exemption. I did read recently that the ATF has enterpreted the rebarreling and sporterizing of here to for pre 1900 Mauser 98 rifles, specifically GEHA models to be "new" manufacture and subject to ALL FFL rules. This despite 45 years of written opinions to the contrary. Better to avoid these idiots entirely. A good number of dealers will try to insist they ship exempt guns to an FFL, due to fear or ignorance. You '97 should have been eligible for C&R, maybe even exempt depending on serial number, and you can get a C&R yourself, and ship direct, both ways, for guns manufactured 50 years ago or older.
 
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Sent him a e-mail requesting a tracking number. I have got No response
 
Chuck, I can understand your frustration with this transaction but I think you need to be patient. If the guy has sold 160+ items on the site and has an okay rating chances are everything will turn out alright. It's unfortunate that some internet sellers have such poor communication but I've run into them also. When you do receive the gun and it checks out okay I'd give the guy an average rating and indicate that the communication was poor. I wouldn't rate him real negatively nor would I rate him very positively either. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.
 
In the few cases I've bought on line, the feedback would be: "Product as described. Good value. Communication was only OK."


Good luck with the knucklebuster. Great gun.
 
Kismet said:
In the few cases I've bought on line, the feedback would be: "Product as described. Good value. Communication was only OK."


Good luck with the knucklebuster. Great gun.
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That's what I would do, or even say 'communication was severly lacking'
 
oldandnew said:
By the way, by strict interpretation of the law, a faxed FFL is not considered absolutely legal. It must have an original signature
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Not wanting to start a fight or step on toes, but I don't think that is true. I've read and reread the regs and the FAQ's posted on the BATF website numerous times regarding shipping of firearms and have never seen that.

The only thing absolute I have found is the shipper must ship to an FFL holder. The BATF even has an insta-check page on their website where you can enter the first few and the last few numbers of an FFL to verify it is an active license and the valid shipping address associated with that license.

If I am in fact wrong, please post the statute and a link. My wife says I never admit when I am wrong, but that is not true. :)
 
cheesy said:
Not wanting to start a fight or step on toes, but I don't think that is true. I've read and reread the regs and the FAQ's posted on the BATF website numerous times regarding shipping of firearms and have never seen that.

The only thing absolute I have found is the shipper must ship to an FFL holder. The BATF even has an insta-check page on their website where you can enter the first few and the last few numbers of an FFL to verify it is an active license and the valid shipping address associated with that license.

If I am in fact wrong, please post the statute and a link. My wife says I never admit when I am wrong, but that is not true. :)
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I am just stating what is being interpretted by ATF and a whole lot of dealers are qouting. Go on doing what your doing, as long as it works. I am not going to dig through the ass numbingly dull ATF and gun control act to verify, and I doubt there will be any either way. I believe that is vague by design to allow for field interpretation, and selective prosecution. If it were me, I would just send a signed FFL with payment. A casual search of Gunbroker will reveal countless dealers who will only except original signatures on FFL's. They do that just to make it difficult to do business with them;). No offense taken, there are quite a few who do faxed copies as well. Most are so terrified they try to make you do an FFL transfer on excempt firearms!:cheers:
 
oldandnew-

Understood. There are laws and then there are laws and it doesn't matter what the laws actually are, just depends on who holds the badge that particular day. :)

The last transfer I tried doing down here in SWMO, a local shop had previously told me they'd do transfers for $30, accept from individuals with no issues. A month later I won an auction (custom Mauser, .250 Savage, sweet little rifle), walked into the shop and asked about the transfer. He forgot me from the previous month, stated he could only take shipment if it came from an FFL. I told him that wasn't law. He said he knew that, but the local ATF chick had came in and audited him the previous week, basically threatened him that he couldn't take shipment from individuals anymore. He said he knew it wasn't law, but he wasn't going to push it. I told him he was fine doing what he wanted and I'd go elsewhere.

I had my rifle shipped 30 miles further away to a shop that did the transfer for $10. That shop stated they operated within the law and refused to go any further. I've since bought 2 new guns from the shop that did the transfer. Voting with my checkbook if you will.

Sorry for the off-topic ramblings.
 
Cheesy, I totally agree with voting with your checkbook. I have done the same thing in similar situations many times.

@ the OP, I would reserve judgement until you get the gun. I know plenty of guys who are honest and trustworthy, but suck at returning phone calls. It's almost like you have to catch them at the right moment to get their undivided attention. Just my .02. Hope you enjoy the new (old) gun.
 
He has never answered my request for a tracking number. I have never had a issue with a gun auction purchase in the past. This is a first for me. Nearly every if not every seller has sent a confirming e-mail that the gun was shipped and provided a tracking number. Lets hope the shape of the gun makes up for the lack of service. I would hate to deal with this guy if there's a problem with the gun.
 
According to your post, you sent a tracking request at some point on the 14th...today is the early morning of the 15th.
Previously, your e- mail took "several days" to be returned....I would expect the same now.
Not a correct delay in my book but....patience will get one thru many struggles.

Again, I hope your gun arrives in a satisfactory condition and I would hope to never sell to Joe Anyone any thing in an Internet transaction.
 
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cheesy said:
oldandnew-

Understood. There are laws and then there are laws and it doesn't matter what the laws actually are, just depends on who holds the badge that particular day. :)

The last transfer I tried doing down here in SWMO, a local shop had previously told me they'd do transfers for $30, accept from individuals with no issues. A month later I won an auction (custom Mauser, .250 Savage, sweet little rifle), walked into the shop and asked about the transfer. He forgot me from the previous month, stated he could only take shipment if it came from an FFL. I told him that wasn't law. He said he knew that, but the local ATF chick had came in and audited him the previous week, basically threatened him that he couldn't take shipment from individuals anymore. He said he knew it wasn't law, but he wasn't going to push it. I told him he was fine doing what he wanted and I'd go elsewhere.

I had my rifle shipped 30 miles further away to a shop that did the transfer for $10. That shop stated they operated within the law and refused to go any further. I've since bought 2 new guns from the shop that did the transfer. Voting with my checkbook if you will.

Sorry for the off-topic ramblings.
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I think it's on topic and valuable info. Thanks for posting. The 2nd amendment is under siege directly and by guerilla tactics as you witnessed. Anyone buying guns across state lines needs to be aware, today they fine and go after the dealer, tomorrow it might be the buyer.
 
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He said he knew that, but the local ATF chick had came in and audited him the previous week, basically threatened him that he couldn't take shipment from individuals anymore. He said he knew it wasn't law, but he wasn't going to push it.

I can't blame the guy. I understand completely about his reluctance to take on a federal agent and all the attendant bureaucratic nightmare, unless his very business is at stake.

The agent doesn't have to be right to be a nightmare for him, and, if proven wrong, can go on with her career with no repercussions. The dealer, on the other hand, has much more in jeopardy.

Not fair, but mostly true.

sorry about extending thread veer.
 
OldDublin said:
According to your post, you sent a tracking request at some point on the 14th...today is the early morning of the 15th.
Previously, your e- mail took "several days" to be returned....I would expect the same now.
Not a correct delay in my book but....patience will get one thru many struggles.

Again, I hope your gun arrives in a satisfactory condition and I would hope to never sell to Joe Anyone any thing in an Internet transaction.
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I sent it on Tuesday and it's now Thursday, I don't need a tracking number when the gun has arrived(which it hasn't) but will before he gets off his back side and responds. My FFL holder has things to do in a day and would like to know when it was expected to be delivered. They don't like just waiting around day in and day out also. They have to be there to sign for it. UPS won't just leave it.
 
Kismet said:
He said he knew that, but the local ATF chick had came in and audited him the previous week, basically threatened him that he couldn't take shipment from individuals anymore. He said he knew it wasn't law, but he wasn't going to push it.

I can't blame the guy. I understand completely about his reluctance to take on a federal agent and all the attendant bureaucratic nightmare, unless his very business is at stake.

The agent doesn't have to be right to be a nightmare for him, and, if proven wrong, can go on with her career with no repercussions. The dealer, on the other hand, has much more in jeopardy.

Not fair, but mostly true.

sorry about extending thread veer.
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Trust me, a individual with a badge can be a real jerk and make ones life a living hell, even if you have done nothing illegal. At the officers discretion....those are the worst words I have ever heard. Make it up as you go BS...I agree, can't blame the owner at all.
 
Nearly two days is still not three...maybe by Monday.
Fingers crossed for you.

Bet the scattergun will be worth the small wait and I'd wager that the wait for the FFL holder will pan out as well.
Few enjoy waiting....even fewer suffer harm in the wait.
 
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