Grew up with the commom knowledge that damascus steel barrels were unsafe. I have come across testimony that there are shooters who shoot them regularly with low pressure loads. Furthermore the British reproof damascus for nitro loads. I don't think I can gather the courage to shoot even low pressure nitro/smokeless loads in damascus, can't get over the feeling that just because I fire it and it doesn't blowup or come apart in my hands, doesn't mean it won't the next time! I am toying with the idea of black powder loads of 3 drams powder, 1 ounce of lead or nice shot. Any body with some experience? Please, no links to articles extolling safety or threatening certain death, I've already read them. I'm only interested in actual first hand knowledge or informed opinion. Assume the barrel diameter is within tolerance and the bores and chambers are flouroscoped safe. Alternative is to resleeve the barrels with fluid steel, and sacrifice the character of the gun, but assure the safety with a virtually new gun.
Damascus Steel
- Thread starter oldandnew
- Start date
onpoint
Active member
I know that some of the quality Damascus barrel's in their day were held in higher reguard then many of the nitro proof guns of the day. A course I'm sure those Damascus guns were of higher end quality. I know you know most of this, as you have very goods knowledge of quality scatter guns.
Onpoint
On a side note. I have a Spencer pump gun(first pump action shotgun made) with a Damascus barrel. No I haven't had the courage to shoot it and most likely never will.
Onpoint
On a side note. I have a Spencer pump gun(first pump action shotgun made) with a Damascus barrel. No I haven't had the courage to shoot it and most likely never will.
Bob M
New member
Given a properly checked set of damascus barrels, I would have no problem or qualms in shooting loads of 7 to 7.5k pressure with smokeless powder, all else being equal.
A few years ago I spent an entire season hunting with a vintage 11ga. percussion double with fine damascus barrels and black powder. Killed everything I centered. There were a few times the fall was not marked well through the smoke cloud
If memory serves me well I used 70-75grs. FFg, fibre and OS wads, and 1oz shot.
From your post I am sure you have read all the pros and deadly cons. My opinion is check it out well, and enjoy! Your call, of course.
BobM
A few years ago I spent an entire season hunting with a vintage 11ga. percussion double with fine damascus barrels and black powder. Killed everything I centered. There were a few times the fall was not marked well through the smoke cloud
If memory serves me well I used 70-75grs. FFg, fibre and OS wads, and 1oz shot.
From your post I am sure you have read all the pros and deadly cons. My opinion is check it out well, and enjoy! Your call, of course.
BobM
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If I found a two-row scattergun of proven provenance with pattern-welded barrels that appeared to meet safety specs enough for purchase:
I would ask for opinions on www.doublegunshop.com....both to a gunsmith well versed in this steel for a true $$$ vetting and to tap the wide experience there re potential potholes.
I would consider using RST low pressure loads, for the time and experience they have in developing loads for just such a use as you need rather than fool with black powder and rolling your own.
I would be content with little steps on this journey.
I would ask for opinions on www.doublegunshop.com....both to a gunsmith well versed in this steel for a true $$$ vetting and to tap the wide experience there re potential potholes.
I would consider using RST low pressure loads, for the time and experience they have in developing loads for just such a use as you need rather than fool with black powder and rolling your own.
I would be content with little steps on this journey.
I have made the decision, a fine 1887 Lefever H with damascus is on it's way. Just like as when I was a kid, no FFL, antique sent UPS to my front door. I am ordering brass shells, and will load with black powder 3 drams-3.25 drams to 1 oz., maybe 1.25 oz., lead, ITX, or "nice shot" to be legal in no lead zones. Can't get my courage to using smokeless, I really like my fingers where they are! I like black powder anyway, that's what these guns were made for. Hard not to convince me that barrels made over a 100 years ago are as strong as they were new. Black burns differently that smokeless. It is true that Holland and Holland are making custom damascus steel guns now. Around $160,000, and you have live 5 years to receive it! They are using damascus, which they say is safe, they claim it was poor grade damascus and a lot of "laminated" steel barrels that eroded on long the weld, with disasterous results. Damascus is subject pin holes that works it's way through from black powder. Most experts assume damascus and laminated steel are the same, a lot of mistakes were made. I keep you posted, I like the smell of sulphur in the morning and dove season is nearly with us!
Damasscuss steel guns
I have a "Knickerbocker" 12 ga. SxS with "laminated" steel barrels made by the American Gun Company of New York choked cyl. and Imp. cyl. that belonged to my grandfather and then my father. I would love to be able to use it once in a while but am afraid to. I am thinking of trying some of the low pressure loads from RST, but I don't know if that would be advisable or not. The gun is in great shape for it's age, all original except for the stock which was replaced sometime in the 1940's as a christmas present by my mother. Barrels are rust-free, no pitting in the bores, but I just don't know if I should persue this or not.
I have a "Knickerbocker" 12 ga. SxS with "laminated" steel barrels made by the American Gun Company of New York choked cyl. and Imp. cyl. that belonged to my grandfather and then my father. I would love to be able to use it once in a while but am afraid to. I am thinking of trying some of the low pressure loads from RST, but I don't know if that would be advisable or not. The gun is in great shape for it's age, all original except for the stock which was replaced sometime in the 1940's as a christmas present by my mother. Barrels are rust-free, no pitting in the bores, but I just don't know if I should persue this or not.
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jnormanh
New member
When they were new, Damascus barrels were just fine, and still are with all but really heavy loads. That is, IF they are still good as new.
The problem and danger with Damascus is that they are made of wire, usually square, which was wound around a mandrel, then heated and hammer welded.
That method leaves some small, almost microscopic, voids here and there between the wires. Corrosion can start in those voids and progress unseen until the barrel is dangerously weakened. It has to be really bad before you can see any sign of it, so a Damascus barrel can look great, but be unsafe.
A good gunsmith can tell.
The problem and danger with Damascus is that they are made of wire, usually square, which was wound around a mandrel, then heated and hammer welded.
That method leaves some small, almost microscopic, voids here and there between the wires. Corrosion can start in those voids and progress unseen until the barrel is dangerously weakened. It has to be really bad before you can see any sign of it, so a Damascus barrel can look great, but be unsafe.
A good gunsmith can tell.