British Labs

TealDog has a British Lab from a person in Atwater MN
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I have absolutely no personal experience with this kennel. But I have had a great deal of experience with Labs both import and domestic. "British" lab has become a code word, used to intimate that a particular Lab has a laid back, trainable personality and superior conformation. The intentional message is that temperment is a goal, and that all "American" bred labs are headstrong, willful, machines, look like greyhounds, and act like one too, of course they require force training and professional assitance. As in all things nothing could be further from the truth. Labs having been the most popular of dogs for many years, the one true thing, is that it's a case where now there is little standardization of what a Lab is. Labs can be found on all spectrums from the greyhounds who are identified as Labs only by close examination of their papers, all the way to overstuffed couch potatoes which can hardly support their own weight, let alone hunt. The reality is as with all pups, pick the parents, for the traits you are interested in. You can find hardheaded poorly conformed british dogs, and beautifully mannered american dogs who are typey and yet are biddable companions. It the individual, now more than ever. Go get to know the kennel and the dogs. What suits you, may not be the same characteristics which please someone else.
 
Jeff,
I believe Dennis Anderson's British Lab Kennel is out near Stillwater. Same guy who is the outdoor writer for the star tribune newspaper. Anderson is one of the 4 or 5 founders of Pheasants Forever (for that we owe him a big thanks) Can't believe he would have anything but quality dogs. No personal experience with him or his kennel however.

I would actually think there is a greater chance a British Lab would have little chance of having the genetic problems that our american labs have had, with hips for example, and therefore would actually be able to hunt longer.
 
jsdriggs said:
British labs are the big, blockhead types. A lot of people love that look (not me). Definately NOT the ideal upland breed...IMO. They can't cover ground like American labs (not even close), most likely have their body wear out later on, and I'd expect their hunting longevity to be adversly affected by it. Ie: not hunt for as many years.

Great for a duck blind------------ but so is my 7yr. old, 52 pound,gray bearded puppy!
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Sorry but I have to dis agree with this, because it is completely false.:D I know plenty of good breeders and dogs that have nothing that fits this description. You simply need to do more home work in finding a nice animal when it comes to a Lab. There is freebies in every paper dang near at some time, and more back yard breeding done then all the proms combined acrosss the country. All but mostly creating a huge mess. Fortunately there is some intelligent breeders out there doing the right thing still. You will have to pay for it, but that is the one I would seek out. Otherwise go with the cheapy in the news paper and contribute to the problem.
 
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Actually the breed standard for British Labs is for a smaller dog than the AKC standards. All Blockhead labs are not British labs.
 
keroko said:
Jeff,
I believe Dennis Anderson's British Lab Kennel is out near Stillwater. Same guy who is the outdoor writer for the star tribune newspaper. Anderson is one of the 4 or 5 founders of Pheasants Forever (for that we owe him a big thanks) Can't believe he would have anything but quality dogs. No personal experience with him or his kennel however.

I would actually think there is a greater chance a British Lab would have little chance of having the genetic problems that our american labs have had, with hips for example, and therefore would actually be able to hunt longer.
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Actually the odds of a genetic inherited issue is more likely with british dogs, they have been slow to adopt testing for EIC, among other things. The identification of hereditary issues have largely been done in the U.S. probably because we caused them in the first place, but so much traffic back and forth across the Atlantic, and elsewhere, have spread the issues to other shores, who then send it back!
 
To really understand the differences between english and american labs you need to look at how they are used in their native lands. The British have a much different style of hunting and the dogs reflect what works best. In the US much of the breeding is done on what works at field trials hence the long legged high horsepower dogs (I do not fully like this). Please note that I am not talking about back yard breeders or irresponsible pet owners. I won't climb on my soap box right now. Irreponsible breeding wether it is labs, humans or house cats chaffes my ass.

Robert Milner of Duck Hill kennels has a reputation for his british labs, he is known as the founder of the British lab movement in America. He is not a breeder that is looking for a marketing niche in the lab breeding world (many are). I have been to Milner seminars and have seen his dogs. For me they do not look like very fun dogs, I love a dog with lots of animation and drive. I personnaly would chose a dog from strong US field breeding all day every day. The Mantra of the British movement is "Don't Be The Over Dogged Hunter". I love being over dogged. I don't need a big V8 3/4 ton either but I like it. I don't need a 800cc snowmobile but I like it.

Decide what dog fits you best and go with a quality breeder that has all the health certs, hips, elbows, eyes, and EIC. Than study pedigrees and choose the litter that fits. If you choose the right litter you don't need to worry to much about choosing the right pup as they are all good.

OOPS I really went off.....I do not know any breeders near stillwater. I have met the breeder in Atwater and she seemed nice enough but I really cannot speak to the quality or her responsibilty.
 
From what I have seen, the British labs tend to run a little smaller in size on the average with variances going both ways.

Last season I found myself getting more into waterfowl hunting than I ever thought I would. The problem is that not a single person I hunt with has retriever that is worth a pinch of monkey snot.

I have yet to be impressed by someone's lab in the duck blind. Most that I have seen have been spazzes(got knocked over when I stood up to shoot once by an overeager golden jumping out of the boat) and for the most part uncontrollable. No doubt, this is due to poor training as well as genetics. This got me looking at the imports because I have heard they are less erratic.

My springers just get too cold after about the second week of the season. I have never been a huge lab guy, but it is starting to look like I am in need of a dog that can handle the colder water. It would be a 90% waterfowl dog and probably rarely see upland action as I have plenty of dogs for that.

If anyone could recommend some reputable breeders of American labs, I would be appreciated of that as well. I am not interested in a pointing lab. I would greatly prefer a dog on the smaller side.

I went an looked at Dennis Anderson's dogs on Saturday. They were very nice dogs and extremely well trained. I was impressed.

I will look into KT, thanks for the tip FC.
 
jsdriggs said:
British labs are the big, blockhead types. A lot of people love that look (not me). Definately NOT the ideal upland breed...IMO. They can't cover ground like American labs (not even close), most likely have their body wear out later on, and I'd expect their hunting longevity to be adversly affected by it. Ie: not hunt for as many years.

Great for a duck blind------------ but so is my 7yr. old, 52 pound,gray bearded puppy!
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British labs are typically smaller. Females in the 50's and males in the 60's. Don't confuse British labs with the english show ring type. There is a big difference. And the british style labs make excellent upland dogs. More so than the high strung american style. Someone needs to do some research before posting.
 
jsdriggs said:
There is a difference between research, as you say, and hands on experience with American labs. You may know some about British labs, but I hunt with American labs. And mine, and none of my friends, are high strung. You know nothing about our American Labs. Please dont bunch them in with your assesment of the breed.

I only expressed my opinion about British Labs. I did not insult anyone.
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I have been hunting, training, and running a few tests with American Labs since 1984. My first lab, a male, came from Candlewoods Nifty Nick. You might know of him. He came from up north. And yes the lines stemming from American Field Trial lines tend to be a little high strung. Thus the popularity of British Lines has caught on in the U.S. Not saying one is better than the other, just stating common knowledge.
 
jsdriggs said:
There is a difference between research, as you say, and hands on experience with American labs. You may know some about British labs, but I hunt with American labs. And mine, and none of my friends, are high strung. You know nothing about our American Labs. Please dont bunch them in with your assesment of the breed.

I only expressed my opinion about British Labs. I did not insult anyone.
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Also, most every trainer in the U.S. trains with the e-collar. Not so in the U.K. Wonder why? My current male comes from a Master Hunter sired by GMPR MH Rik's Risky Raider. The dam of my dog is a titled dog out of NFC Ebonstar Lean Mac. I might know a little.
 
I am not particularly a fan of the british dogs. Although Holzingers incorporate some of the british lines into their dogs. I have had a couple of Trieven bred dogs and all have been awesome. Always wanted a pup out of Twist just never happened for me.
 
Brittish and American labs come in all shapes, sizes and colors. It is your job to do the research and figure out what YOU desire in the particular dog. Most of the dogs breed today (bred by responsible breeders) have a combination of the classic old style (brittish look) and the athletism of the (american) dog. To me the lab should have a muscular build and an outgoing personality that is eager to please.
 
This past summer our PF chapter had our youth hunt out at Labs Unlimited by fairbult, Jerry Seether is the owner and a great guy. He doesn't breed for color only breeds for bloodlines and desire. He knows what he is talking about and puts out some great dogs and is a great trainer. He did say that one of the things when it comes to labs is you pay for what you get, hence going to a kennel with a good reputation or breeder. He did say that when he has litters they usually run around the $1000 dollar mark for a pup depending on the parents and what there titles are. If anyone is interested in a pup from a great kennel and breeder look him up. Also his facility for training is top notch, look him up. I am thinking my next pup might be from him.
 
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