gsp4life
Member
can anyone tell me about these blood lines? www.outbackgundogs.com kirby rust has got some puppies and i'm thinking about buying one from him. my next stud dog. any info would be appreciated. thanks
tonellis rising sun and ohi shameless
- Thread starter gsp4life
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BleuBijou
Active member
These are high run dogs!! Do not get me wrong, they are good dogs, but what are you looking for???? Companion/Foot Hunting Dog or Field trial dog? Those are pricey pups as well!!! I will P.M. you!!!!
Maggie&Max-GSP
New member
i have two dogs from ohi shameless they are great pups he ohio shamless was grand national champion dog like 10 years ago
Can you explain what you mean when you say these are high run dogs? Are you saying this is a genetic disposition or that this trainer trains his dogs to be big runners. Isn't how far a dog runs (ranges) while hunting a matter of training? I think most good hunting dogs will range out as far as the hunter allows them to. I'm not trying to casue argument just looking for education / information.
victordlt43
New member
HI, I bought a Beautiful English Pointer from Kirby and he will range from 1 yard to 100 yards but its all up to you how far you want him out, so i'm gonna say its in their breeding not training but i'm no dog trainer just my 2cents.
Gove County Britts
New member
i deal with kirby almost daily in the dog world and if he tells you they are something great then they are something great never seen him lead anyone wrong yet and the high runn is in the breeding not the training
victordlt43
New member
I agree Kirby has been a pleasure to work with and what I've seen is great trained dogs, might be adding another in the near future when the time is right around here.
Dog Gun Time
Member
I will jump on this bandwagon as well. In my limited experience it is much easier to bring a big running dog in than it is to push a close working dog out. One of those "you can't put in what God left out" deals.
I think maybe my original post/question was misinterpreted. I tend to agree with what you all have said. You can take a bird crazy dog and keep him at whatever range you are comfortable with while hunting, as long as you focus on control and obedience when training. You aren't going to train the dog to find birds. The dog always knows more about the birds than you do it's in the genes. The dogs response to the hunter and the way the dog works in the field is the trainers job. In my opinion (I do not claim to be an expert) teach a dog with GREAT GENES to heel, come, and whoa and you have a chance to have a pretty darn good bird dog. Get the dog on plenty of birds and he will show you a thing or two, then work with the dog who has a solid foundation of obedience to refine how he handles birds once he finds them and you have a great dog. An earlier post made a big running bird dog sound like a bad thing, but as others have mentioned a dog that isn't interested interested in birds won't be interested in birds at any distance. I think a big running dog is only a liability when he hasn't been given a solid foundation in obedience and can't be controlled in the field. But a dog who doesn't have the drive to find birds might as well stay home and lay by the fire while I go hunting.
BleuBijou
Active member
Tallgrass, I think you are refering to my post!!!! I will explain myself when I say high run dogs. The FC dogs are good dogs, I am not trying to discredit any of them. What I was trying to say is that those dogs are bred for one purpose and that is to range out 1000 to 1500 yds to find birds and to hold that bird till you bust your hump or horses hump to get there. For the average pheasant hunter who wants a dog that works for foot hunters there is other options that are much easier to train, because they do not range as far and were bred for that purpose. I would much rather try and range in a dog that is bred for foot hunters then the one for field trials. I hate to hack a dog all day for ranging to far. It is just a heck of a lot easier to find that trait or breeding in a dog for the average hunter. Most of us do not have the time to train a dog that is bred on that level. I prefer to make it easier for myself in the field and at home by choosing the right traits and breeding for me. Most dogs are going to hunt, we know that, we have to mold them in to want we want and I find it easier to pick traits within the breed that work for foot hunters like myself. No question you can reel them in, I just choose another option because it works best for what I do with less time. My dogs are family companions that think they are lap dogs and are all business in the field. No troubles of digging under or jumping fences when they hear my truck start up. I have had a couple high run dogs and they were great in the field after I got them broke of ranging to far, but they were a nightmare at home because all they wanted was to hunt and they knew when my truck started is was time to hunt even though it wasn't. Life is easier knowing your dog is going to be home when you get there!!!! Hope this explains it!!! Thanks, Bleu:cheers::cheers:
I agree with 90 percent of what you are saying. I don't have any desire to hunt behind a dog that hunts in the next county. The dog you describe as a nightmare at home is not my idea of an ideal dog either. Nor is constant hacking on a dog to het him to hunt the way you want. My original question was is "big running" genetic or training. I guess defining big running is the key here. I would say there are dogs that are high strung and always have their motor stuck on full throttle, which is genetic. And there are dogs who are
allowed or trained to hunt and range out at different distances. To me the term big running means the dog has been trained to hunt at a greater distance. A high strung, hard headed, or stubborn dog is not what I would necessarily call a big running dog, because his owner has a hard time controlling him the dog is likely to range much further than the owner is comfortable with and is more likely to become a "big running" dog.
Anyway I thing training determines range and genetics determines personality, trainability, and obviously bird finding ability.
Another question about these dogs that may hunt a half a mile away how many birds do they run over in the half mile between me and the dog?
BleuBijou
Active member
TallGrass, without a doubt there are traits that are bred upon for high run dogs. Just like horses, some are bred for distance and some for speed.:cheers:
I'll take those big running dogs every time.
For me, the enjoyment of hunting is seeing my dogs work and if that means working out really far, then so be it. I don't want to hack and bring dogs in and take that natural run and style out of them.
What I did like though, was the OP knows what sort of animal he wants and if this style doesn't suit him, that he doesn't buy that animal. I've seen too many people buy animals that aren't suited to their style.
And, my trial bred dogs are great in the house. Even when I'm getting ready to hunt, they just sit by the door.
To me, "big running" is genetic that is nurtured by training.
You can stretch a dog out a little bit, but you can't do much more then what God put in them.
Just my opinion. (And I know it's probably different then most of the opinions on here..)
For me, the enjoyment of hunting is seeing my dogs work and if that means working out really far, then so be it. I don't want to hack and bring dogs in and take that natural run and style out of them.
What I did like though, was the OP knows what sort of animal he wants and if this style doesn't suit him, that he doesn't buy that animal. I've seen too many people buy animals that aren't suited to their style.
And, my trial bred dogs are great in the house. Even when I'm getting ready to hunt, they just sit by the door.
To me, "big running" is genetic that is nurtured by training.
You can stretch a dog out a little bit, but you can't do much more then what God put in them.
Just my opinion. (And I know it's probably different then most of the opinions on here..)