Thinking of hanging it up

Shot my 33 rooster of the year back in December between hunting Colorado, Kansas and Nebraska. Hunted probably 13 days for pheasants this year with six of them in Kansas. In Kansas we had three great days seeing over 100 birds and three tough ones averaging maybe 1.5 birds per day.
 
I have hunted 8 days so far and have killed 29 roosters and about the same number of quail. A friend and I shot a limit of roosters Saturday by early afternoon and would have been done earlier if he could shoot. I am going back out next Friday for a week. I have been seeing plenty of birds, both in the field and on the roads when traveling. I don't know what to tell you guys having bad luck other than try a different area. I would guess last weekend we saw an average of 8 roosters a day from the road. I have killed birds on WIHA as well as private. I haven't been able to hunt as much as normal do to work, but will get my days up there a little the last week.
 
I have seen a good number of birds. The number of birds I have shot is one. First year with a new pup and have waited to pull the trigger till it all came together. Point, flush, bang, retrieve. If this is all I get this year it will be worth it. He is figuring out the smells and that they move and to slow down once scent is there. I have had many good dogs and want this new guy to be a good one to so he needs to understand how it works. In the past an average year was 50 birds but I grew up in prime pheasant country with a lot of contacts.
 
I have probably read this thread 3 times over the last couple of days. This is really disturbing to me. I had a conversation with my buddy in the truck on the way home from North Dakota this year. I long for those days of shooting limits because the habitat was there and the birds were plentiful I get it that farmers need to make a living, and the weather has not been good to the birds over the last few years but I still see our sport dying and that alarms me! RedLab, please don't quit hunting. Your son needs it as much as you. I would give anything to have my kids back at 16 years old and ready to go hunting with dad again! Those times fly by. Point! I get it, it is not the same hunting over somebody else's dog when you have hunted over your own for so many years. But don't give up. I believe that if hunters band together we can have an impact on the sport. What can I do alone? Probably not much, I am not a rich man but I have passion. Passionate people will get more accomplished in this world than people who just want to throw money at a problem.
So what can we do? Well I am going to pheasant fest in February with this in my mind. I plan to talk to those that will listen. What can we do to help the farmer, help the ground, help the wildlife, and help the hunter? I think it is going to take hunters like us involved in PF and working with local chapters. I think some of us need to get involved in politics. Let's run for an elected seat where you can make some decisions and voice your opinions. Try to talk to the people who put outdoor shows on. Find them at events and share your frustrations with them. Find them on social media and ask for some of their time to discuss the issues. Finally I think we need to look to the future. CRP was awesome when it was at it's height. Maybe that is not the wave of the future. Maybe there is a better way and if we put our heads together I bet we could come up with a solution! Sorry for the long rant, I just hate to see guys quit on this sport that I love so much.
 
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I pretty much limit myself to a bird per spot. I’ve passed on the only cockbird at magazine cover range, because it was small field, but a second rooster would of been in trouble. I’m hitting private 15 to 30 acre fields. A couple bigger ones over 50 acres. Gotta say I have zero competition. Anyone who notices me at a gas station or Wendy’s says they used to go back when there were birds. There here, but not everywhere. Saw lots of hens. I’ve had days of over 20 birds seen. And zero birds too. We all get frustrated.
 
I’ve had days of over 20 birds seen. And zero birds too. We all get frustrated.


This was an extremely SHxTTY day here in KS if you were to tell me that in 2010 or prior. Even 2011 at the start of the drought we'd see plenty as there was enough carryover in places.

Now this can be the norm in many places if not seeing zero birds.

Frustration is not it - I think we are all appalled at how quick things went from great to complete and utter bull manure in about .02 seconds.


I haven't given up - in fact this decline has made me want to move from KS. I haven't yet but the thought crosses my mind a lot! I dont know what the future holds but New Mexico, AZ and a couple other western states have been creating stronger magnetic pulls on me.
 
Hunting

I can certainly understand what a lot of guys are saying. Kansas 20 years ago had lots of birds. Every time I go to KS to hunt I wonder why half way thru the trip. There are a lot of reasons birds are few. One reason I believe is large group hunting. Ok you get 15-20 guys in a field a push the birds. How many survive with this method. Years ago I tried to get Wildlife to stop this practice. Deaf Ears. They were worried about License Sales. REVENUE. Now what is happening to their REVENUE? We are a group of hunters that are getting older and older. I was hoping to Upland Hunt for another 10 years, not sure I will do that now. In years past I would make 3 trips to KS. I am down to one trip per year.

Bman
 
I can certainly understand what a lot of guys are saying. Kansas 20 years ago had lots of birds. Every time I go to KS to hunt I wonder why half way thru the trip. There are a lot of reasons birds are few. One reason I believe is large group hunting. Ok you get 15-20 guys in a field a push the birds. How many survive with this method. Years ago I tried to get Wildlife to stop this practice. Deaf Ears. They were worried about License Sales. REVENUE. Now what is happening to their REVENUE? We are a group of hunters that are getting older and older. I was hoping to Upland Hunt for another 10 years, not sure I will do that now. In years past I would make 3 trips to KS. I am down to one trip per year.

Bman

Party hunting has nothing to do with it - this was done years ago with no effect.

It's probably 80 to 90% habitat and the other 20 or 10% is Mother nature -- (I feel that regardless of how good or bad ma nature is - if you have the habitat the birds will be fine relatively speaking - now mother nature has cooperated the past few years and birds are in the toilet in the majority of the state. )
 
This discussion isn't about just Kansas, the whole pheasant/quail/hun/sharptail belt has problems. I hunted Kansas for the first time this year and I was pleased with what I saw. That is comparing it with what I have been seeing the last few years up north. But it was no where like what it could be. Many of us can remember what it was like back in the 90's and 00's. To not shoot a limit in any state back than was embarrassing, people shot limits without dogs. You didn't run into a lot of hunters because you could go anywhere and find birds, there was no need to crowd each other. The new "normal" is longer days and fewer birds and face it when you walk a prime looking area and your trusted old timer dog can't find any scent it is pretty discouraging. What's the cause of the decline? We could fill a whole page with probable causes, but that doesn't improve the situation. I sure wish there was a silver bullet, but maybe some of us can find some small ways to help turn this around. I throw money at pheasant's forever, just wish we could do more. I would have no problem paying a higher license fee or habitat stamp if it meant more birds. Do we band together to fight ethanol or roundup or do these things not even matter.
 
Ive all but given up the upland scene. My father quit it a few years ago as did my uncles. Last trip out to Western KS I couldve had the same result if I left my gun at home. We have family that farms near Wakefield and its sad to see what the population there did. I shot my first rooster up there. I know maybe 3 guys that hunt upland religiously anymore.

Growing up all I did was quail and pheasant hunt. Small towns had pancake breakfasts for the hunters. Dad, myself, and later my brother hunted every weekend. Then the leasing monster arrived around 2000. The first place to go was the place both my brother and I shot our first quail. The rest followed soon after. My GSP died in 2010 and I didnt replace him with another pointer. Ive got a pair of labs. I duck hunt mostly with some bow hunting as well. Turkeys in the spring although the are becoming rare as well. Ive got a covey on my place I work the dogs on but havent shot this year. Ive hit walkin around the house, and the neighbor has 500 acres he lets me hunt, but we havent seen a bird on any of it. My columbia vest has shells in it that predate my children.
 
Growing up the party hunt of 20+ guys was the norm. You just didn't hunt unless you had a big group to go with hence better results. Most groups were huge all of November with the families that owned the ground hosting the hunts over several weekends. 150 birds over a weekend was normal and it still didn't make a dent. Predators, weather and habitat. I have some of the best ground a guy could hope for. End of summer nothing to see 40+ birds on the wheat stubble by the end of January you might have 10 birds left and it has been this way for years. Predators seem to pick most of the birds off this place as we do not hunt it that much.
 
Growing up the party hunt of 20+ guys was the norm. You just didn't hunt unless you had a big group to go with hence better results. Most groups were huge all of November with the families that owned the ground hosting the hunts over several weekends. 150 birds over a weekend was normal and it still didn't make a dent. Predators, weather and habitat. I have some of the best ground a guy could hope for. End of summer nothing to see 40+ birds on the wheat stubble by the end of January you might have 10 birds left and it has been this way for years. Predators seem to pick most of the birds off this place as we do not hunt it that much.

party hunting sucks, just my opinion, but it has been done for years.....predators, weather and habitat all are variables. i still enjoy getting the dog out and watching him work, even though he is making fewer bird contacts. going next week for one last trip, all i know it is a long time until Sept.1 and i am not getting any younger....no regrets.
 
Several have mentioned party hunting as the cause of declines. If you would just sit and watch a large group of hunters go across a field you would see a better comedy show than actual bird killing. Most walk a straight line in formation. Never zigzag, no half moon line. The birds just step to the side and let you walk by. I am not an expert by any means but my son and I can go in to the same field right behind the party, take our time, zigzagging and letting the old dogs move with us and kill more birds than the group saw. There are some groups that know how to hunt and yes we can be devistating on the birds that flush but for every 1 that you flush I feel 3 snuck out the back door. Just my opinion. I may be wrong but 40 years of hunting with the old guys and their knowledge handed down to me my styles work for me.
 
I dont think party hunting has as much of an impact. I do think the onslaught for 3 months birds get on public and WIHA hurt. You can only run 6 dogs through a field 3 times a day before the birds either are dead or they move on. There used to be 160 acres of walkin from my house by an 80 acre patch. It wasnt unusual to see it get walked a couple times a day during the week, 3 to 4 on the weekend, and maybe an extra on a holiday weekend. Its now leased to a guy from TX for deer hunting.
 
Party hunting has nothing to do with the number of birds. A couple of guys with good dogs can shoot more birds than a dozen guys in the same patch. Last year I was driving by a patch of WIHA. I saw a rooster fly out and land in it. It was a half section. I dumped out the dogs and proceeded to limit out in less than an hour. The dogs pointed all 4 birds. As I was walking up the road back to the truck, two pickups pulled up with 7 guys total in them. They had hunted that same place a few hours earlier and saw one rooster. Big groups make too much noise, and more birds cut back through them or split the blockers then they see.
 
You've years left in your legs. You had bad luck in this below average season. With this one behind you, come next November take the field with your loyal dog. Better things are bound to happen.
 
We found quite a few birds this year, but I didn't kill many. It wasn't as good of a year this year as years past, but I was able to get a puppy started and a dog from Utah started on quail so I consider it a pretty good year. I have way more pictures of dogs on point then birds killed and to me, that's more important. I know guys who all they do is take pictures of dead birds and consider it a great hunt, but for me, that's not the priority. Id much rather take a picture and work the dog then empty my gun on wild covey rise. (I saw a guy empty a semi on a covey rise. Holy cow :) ) Was it a great year? No, but hey, it got me and the dogs out in the field and as my dogs get older, that's whats important. They only have a handful of days afield in their life times so I tried to make the most of it.
 
I sure hope next season is better. This was a rough one.

you were not alone.....i have been coming up to Kansas for the past 30 some years, last season and this year have been my worst ever. changed territory last year and again this year and just struggled along.....what bothered me the most was a lack of hens, that makes next season (in those areas)iffy at best. scratching off plenty of nice looking ground, never had to do that before.
 
you were not alone.....i have been coming up to Kansas for the past 30 some years, last season and this year have been my worst ever. changed territory last year and again this year and just struggled along.....what bothered me the most was a lack of hens, that makes next season (in those areas)iffy at best. scratching off plenty of nice looking ground, never had to do that before.

I was doing a lot of exploring this season too, hoping to find some new hidden gem WIHA or public area closer to home. Kinda like looking for a sasquatch riding a unicorn. :rolleyes: Anyway, it didn't happen... I really hope that people stop advertising KS as quail heaven, because I was not seeing huntable (in good conscience) populations in any of my old or new spots. I have not fired a shot at quail in January this year. That's probably 7 consecutive outings without a shot fired... The coveys I found have been small, few, and far between, so I have left them for seed.

There was some encouraging stuff though. My old dog showed she still has wheels, and the young dog I got last season showed a lot of improvement and started displaying some really nice traits I like to see. I think they're going to be a bang-up team as long as the old girl stays healthy. Here's to next year.
 
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