Solar Farms = Habitat Destruction ?

We'll have solar popping up in my county very soon sadly. There's plans of putting in around 3k of solar within the next 5 years or so. All in current ag land and mostly from large operations. Financially, I'm sure the solar comes out to a win for the farmer who now doesn't need to farm those acres and can sit back and collect rental checks.

I'd agree, I'd rather have solar on roofs or in parking lots, etc. They will plant a pollinator mix on the solar farms between the panels which is nice and better for the environment than farming. But, it's taking prime ag land out of operation and reducing the supply of farm acres for 40+ years. From a hunter's perspective, you can't hunt solar farms like you can ag and wildlife are fenced off from those acres.
 
Anyone every put panels on their house or cabin? Is there a real economic impact to your electricity costs or is it just an adrenaline rush tied to doing your part on climate change.

Walz's 2040 MN energy plan will accelerate sun and wind generated power in MN. Rumor (maybe real) is that if MN stays with this and neighbor states do not - that the overall energy grid (exchange of power) becomes seriously flawed with Minnesotans the most likely to be impacted ... we can be like our big Sister Cali with rolling brownouts leaving your EV without power to go to work the next day ...
 
The Minneapolis-based utility ceased operations at one of three generating units at the 1,700-megawatt Sherco last year and has plans to shutter the remaining two units in 2026 and 2030, respectively. In its place, Xcel is investing $1.1 billion in three solar farms with a combined 710 MW of capacity.
 
BRITTMAN said:
Anyone every put panels on their house or cabin? Is there a real economic impact to your electricity costs or is it just an adrenaline rush tied to doing your part on climate change.
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I had our place bid just out of curiosity. It would have taken me 12 years before I started realizing any savings and they could not guarantee me they would be in business at that point still or who would service them if I had issues. The solar project our county shut down was French owned installing Chinese equipment and would be serviced by out of town contractors. Oh and it was going to go on land that out of town investors had weaseled into years ago on inside information. But just listen to their propaganda....it's good for your area. Almost forgot that their ultimate goal was to decommision the local coal power plant that gives a ton to our community and schools while employing a bunch of people at high paying jobs for our area. Kick rocks
 
BRITTMAN said:
Anyone every put panels on their house or cabin? Is there a real economic impact to your electricity costs or is it just an adrenaline rush tied to doing your part on climate change.

Walz's 2040 MN energy plan will accelerate sun and wind generated power in MN. Rumor (maybe real) is that if MN stays with this and neighbor states do not - that the overall energy grid (exchange of power) becomes seriously flawed with Minnesotans the most likely to be impacted ... we can be like our big Sister Cali with rolling brownouts leaving your EV without power to go to work the next day ...
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Solar panels on your roof greatly reduce your electricity costs. However, there is a caveat. They cost a lot up front. And it takes time to recoup that investment back. Some people (not me) plan to live in their home for years and they feel its worth that investment (also, not me). Any extra power not used goes back to the grid and the electric company pays you for it.

The MN energy plan specifically states that natural gas, nuclear, and hydropower will continue to be used. Its not 100% wind and solar. It phases out coal completely (which is an outdated, dirty, environment polluting form of energy). I'm not against energy technology or advancement but it can't be done over night. Just completely relying on an unreliable form of energy is stupid.

People sure do like bitching about EVs but yet virtually every ice angler here has switched to a battery powered auger. Oh, the irony.
 
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gimruis said:
People sure do like bitching about EVs but yet virtually every ice angler here has switched to a battery powered auger. Oh, the irony.
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Same with battery tools. I know a corded tool compared to a gas auger isn't an apples to apples comparison, but the point is technology has advanced and you never find a corded tool now.

The point that alot of anti solar folks make is that "it'll take me 15 years before I see any gains". My question is always, "and?". The point of solar on your home is that it's a clean source of energy, not that it's necessarily cheaper up front. The big picture is in the long term. It isn't about "what can this do for me" it's about what it does for the future, which unfortunately might not affect everyone that complains about it.

If all of a sudden everyone installed solar panels on their homes, the positive impact that would have for future generations would be astounding. Imagine if the technology was there 20 years ago and the person who owned your house before you had installed solar panels. Now you're realizing those gains today and enjoying the benefits. I see solar as a community gain, not necessarily a personal one. But unfortunately most people only do things for themselves and not always for future generations.

As for windmills being an eyesore on the prairie, I've always said I'd rather look at a windmill over an oil derrick.
 
Munster927 said:
Same with battery tools. I know a corded tool compared to a gas auger isn't an apples to apples comparison, but the point is technology has advanced and you never find a corded tool now.

The point that alot of anti solar folks make is that "it'll take me 15 years before I see any gains". My question is always, "and?". The point of solar on your home is that it's a clean source of energy, not that it's necessarily cheaper up front. The big picture is in the long term. It isn't about "what can this do for me" it's about what it does for the future, which unfortunately might not affect everyone that complains about it.

If all of a sudden everyone installed solar panels on their homes, the positive impact that would have for future generations would be astounding. Imagine if the technology was there 20 years ago and the person who owned your house before you had installed solar panels. Now you're realizing those gains today and enjoying the benefits. I see solar as a community gain, not necessarily a personal one. But unfortunately most people only do things for themselves and not always for future generations.

As for windmills being an eyesore on the prairie, I've always said I'd rather look at a windmill over an oil derrick.
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Who's to say these companies will even be around by the time the investment would be realized on a home. If people want one on their home great, go for it. But if you look at commercial solar and the introduction of tons of plastics, polymers, lithium....into the prairies and farmland I find it hard to be convinced it's "green" anything. Go ask that kid in the lithium mines how much diesel that equipment he's running is burning to make those batteries. These solar companies will sit right in town halls and tell you solar is not capable of covering our grid even in our rural area. It will still need to be supplemented either by coal or natural gas.
 
GetTothePoint said:
Who's to say these companies will even be around by the time the investment would be realized on a home. If people want one on their home great, go for it. But if you look at commercial solar and the introduction of tons of plastics, polymers, lithium....into the prairies and farmland I find it hard to be convinced it's "green" anything. Go ask that kid in the lithium mines how much diesel that equipment he's running is burning to make those batteries. These solar companies will sit right in town halls and tell you solar is not capable of covering our grid even in our rural area. It will still need to be supplemented either by coal or natural gas.
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There was a time that if you told someone we'd be flying 50-100 people across the world in giant metal birds they would have put you in an insane asylum. Never say never. Is the technology perfect right now? No. But it'll continue to advance.

And there's a reason in my area, the largest energy company is working with folks on adding solar. They know it's coming and they know people want it so they are trying to find ways to make a profit off of it. Solar is fully capable of running the lights in your home and small draw items. Is it ready to replace the entire grid? Not yet. But see my first statement. Oil companies aren't bashing renewable energy left and right because they aren't afraid of it eating into their profit. They see that eventually it will overtake them, maybe not today or next year or even within 10 years. But it's coming. So of course the richest entities on the planet don't want it.
 
Part of the thing that irks me with solar panels and wind mills is that the material they use is not all renewable or recycleable. Using wind turbines for a few years and then piling them up in a landfill doesn't do anyone any good. Part of the idea about being more "green" at least in my mind is using something we can re-use again in the future.
 
gimruis said:
Part of the thing that irks me with solar panels and wind mills is that the material they use is not all renewable or recycleable. Using wind turbines for a few years and then piling them up in a landfill doesn't do anyone any good. Part of the idea about being more "green" at least in my mind is using something we can re-use again in the future.
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I agree. The windmills break down constantly and are just abandoned. And in KS, I don't know about other states, we have clouds and these little ice pellets called hail. Once they figure those pesky things out maybe solar will be viable.
 
I think an unbiased comparison of all the pluses and minuses of each energy source is what's needed. So called "green" energy might not have emissions, but they are a visual pollution on the landscape. What to do with the stuff after it's used up in another huge issue. Stories all over the news of the problems caused by windmills. Off Martha's Vineyard a huge turbine blade broke and shattered polluting the ocean with fiberglass chunks, and another just failed in the UK causing the same issue. In MN there's a legal battle brewing over a huge stack of used blades that are sitting in a vacant lot outside Rochester, a huge eye-sore. Solar panels, I have no idea what they do with them once their useful life is over. Wind turbines kill a lot of birds. There may be prairie chickens living within sight of turbines, but I don't think they are in any way beneficial. I've heard state wildlife biologists specifically state that wind turbines have negative effects on prairie grouse. They have been found to have negative effects on numbers of male birds attending a lek in the vicinity and another study found that females don't like to be around them during the breeding/nesting season. Fossil fuels will always have emissions, but modern power plants have mitigated much of it through technology.
 
The US Department of Energy estimates 1.3 million gallons of oil is spilled into waterways alone each year just in normal operations from pipeline breaks, tankers leaking, oil wells leaking, etc. Fossil fuels are a lot more than just the pollutants into the air from burning them. That figure doesn't even count the significant oil spills that actually make the news. 14 years ago, an estimated 210 million gallons alone were dumped into the gulf of Mexico. But thankfully that's all cleaned up now.

So you bet your ass I'd rather deal with eyesores in the form of windmills and solar panels and dealing with the "waste" of producing them.
 
Munster927 said:
There was a time that if you told someone we'd be flying 50-100 people across the world in giant metal birds they would have put you in an insane asylum. Never say never. Is the technology perfect right now? No. But it'll continue to advance.

And there's a reason in my area, the largest energy company is working with folks on adding solar. They know it's coming and they know people want it so they are trying to find ways to make a profit off of it. Solar is fully capable of running the lights in your home and small draw items. Is it ready to replace the entire grid? Not yet. But see my first statement. Oil companies aren't bashing renewable energy left and right because they aren't afraid of it eating into their profit. They see that eventually it will overtake them, maybe not today or next year or even within 10 years. But it's coming. So of course the richest entities on the planet don't want it.
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The richest entities in the world will own that market when it is viable.
 
Haretrigger said:
So to sum it up.....it seems the human species is not very earth planet friendly.
Now for the crickets.....
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Yeah maybe not. All this "green and renewable " stuff just gets humorous. These EVs sum it all up. They're saving the planet lol. They just forget that that cord they plug in to to be able to operate goes back to good ole coal or natural gas. Nothings perfect, just don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining.
 
I love my battery driven tools and ice auger. In each case the value proposition of the cord free, battery-operated power tool is quite high. Regarding ice augers, most people never utilize the few advantages they may offer.

My next lawn mower will be electric because the technology is there at the right value proposition.

I have no issues against the EV except mandates. If you mandate EV then the charging “centers” must be readily available and dispersed. Charger (public or private locations) not subject to rolling brownouts.
 
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