How many birds would you lose/find without a dog?

I rarely shoot a bird that is not under point of one of my Brittanys especially when hunting by myself and when the MN limit is two.

Everyone is in a different stage of being a hunter. To each their own. No one should ever feel bad or inadequate for killing a rooster when all the laws are followed ... dog or no dog ... corn, cattails, prairie, or ditch.
 
gimruis said:
Those guys didn't get invited back to hunt with me. Its difficult to tell someone you know that their dog isn't welcome. They often take it very personally. Its like telling someone that their kid is a failure. I imagine its very tough to hear.

But sometimes you gotta shoot a hostage.
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So if I invite them I ask about their dog(s). Most are honest and if they realize there is a issue I ask them to just behind mine. Then it is their choice. If they ask me to join and it's a shitshow I leave.

Last week buddy and I were out with our 5 dogs when a 3rd guy pulls up and joins us in the field with his 2. I didn't know my buddy invited him so I was a little perplexed. A couple minutes later a 30 pound lab runs up to me and yips before running off. My dominant bitch takes off after him. I stopped her and we resumed hunting. Got to the end of the field and the little lab , a pup , is barking at me and the dogs. Called my dogs in and told the guy this could be a problem.
 
LittleBigHorn22 said:
I think that feeling is because of just getting lucky and having the birds by the road. You didn't "earn" the birds and that wouldn't have changed if you had taken the dogs out to find them or not.
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I grew up road hunting. I don't actively do it these days, meaning I'm not driving around, looking for birds to shoot. I do, however, actually HUNT ditches that I think have potential. But true road hunting (as well as ditch hunting) in SD is more restricted than it was years ago, what with safety zones around houses, livestock, etc., the fact that a bird has to be either in the right-of-way, flushed from the ROW, or flying over it, & the fact that years ago, nobody cared too much, in many cases, if you hopped the fence a little bit.

That said, in the odd chance I happen to see a rooster in the ditch & conditions are legal, I'll try him. I still get excited by the flush & enjoy shooting & eating them. If I didn't have time to release the dog beforehand, he does get to go make the recovery. I maybe average about 1.5 road hunted roosters a season. I never shoot them on the ground, but they're still nowhere near as satisfying as a rooster harvested in a more conventional hunting manner. But I don't feel the least bit bad or dirty about it. Roosters have made a fool of me so many times, I feel like if one makes a mistake & pays the ultimate price for it, he deserved it. Much of the time, they still aren't easy in terms of flushing/seeing them at all, getting them in range, & making the shot. Now, there ARE people who road hunt near preserves, hoping to catch a flare nare in the ditch. (Many of them could actually be caught, if not ground pounded.) Those people should feel maximum shame.

😉 Kidding. Do what you want within the law. Ground pounding a flare nare in the ditch won't affect me.
 
A5 Sweet 16 said:
Now, there ARE people who road hunt near preserves, hoping to catch a flare nare in the ditch. (Many of them could actually be caught, if not ground pounded.) Those people should feel maximum shame.
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Don't kid yourself. That's bush league.

Those pseudo birds are like domesticated chickens.
 
birddude said:
My experience was that 50% is pretty close. My 1st pheasant hunt was in 1982. Centerville Iowa, at that time it was supposedly the pheasant capital of the world. I'm not hot spotting because now you would be lucky to see one there. We were 4 young guys, strong and fit. 1 novice, the rest of us could shoot. A buddy and I had dogs, but everyone I knew who had hunted them told us that they would ruin your dog. Granted I was under gunned for long shots with a 16 and none of us exactly picked our shots. There were a lot of birds. we saw a lot on the roads but only shot a couple of them. We were hardly ever turned down to hunt and saw birds everywhere we hunted. We knocked down 32 roosters and brought home 14. We never went back without dogs. I hunted the next 21 years straight in Iowa. Hunted and area until bird #s dwindled, moved west until we found them. Repeat until it was no longer feasible.
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My first pheasant hunt also was 1982. I was 25 years old and hunted solo. Rose Lake Wildlife Management area in Michigan.
I was in good pheasant habitat and would walk and stop wait, repeat.
A rooster flushed at about 30 yards after silently waiting.
I shot and the only reason I found him was a death flapping on the ground.
Hunting without a dog was like hunting blind and not much fun.
 
A5 Sweet 16 said:
I grew up road hunting. I don't actively do it these days, meaning I'm not driving around, looking for birds to shoot. I do, however, actually HUNT ditches that I think have potential. But true road hunting (as well as ditch hunting) in SD is more restricted than it was years ago, what with safety zones around houses, livestock, etc., the fact that a bird has to be either in the right-of-way, flushed from the ROW, or flying over it, & the fact that years ago, nobody cared too much, in many cases, if you hopped the fence a little bit.

That said, in the odd chance I happen to see a rooster in the ditch & conditions are legal, I'll try him. I still get excited by the flush & enjoy shooting & eating them. If I didn't have time to release the dog beforehand, he does get to go make the recovery. I maybe average about 1.5 road hunted roosters a season. I never shoot them on the ground, but they're still nowhere near as satisfying as a rooster harvested in a more conventional hunting manner. But I don't feel the least bit bad or dirty about it. Roosters have made a fool of me so many times, I feel like if one makes a mistake & pays the ultimate price for it, he deserved it. Much of the time, they still aren't easy in terms of flushing/seeing them at all, getting them in range, & making the shot. Now, there ARE people who road hunt near preserves, hoping to catch a flare nare in the ditch. (Many of them could actually be caught, if not ground pounded.) Those people should feel maximum shame.

😉 Kidding. Do what you want within the law. Ground pounding a flare nare in the ditch won't affect me.
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Yeah I would never say people shouldn't hunt the birds they see. And as you said, it's actually often times way harder to pull off, because the birds were already on high alert and know you are coming if you get out of the car. Just for me when it turns out really easy, it doesn't feel as good. And maybe since I'm in low population areas, that's why it feels a bit more dirty killing one since there's a higher chance it does effect the population. Or at least feels like that.
 
A5 Sweet 16 said:
Now, there ARE people who road hunt near preserves, hoping to catch a flare nare in the ditch. (Many of them could actually be caught, if not ground pounded.) Those people should feel maximum shame.

😉 Kidding. Do what you want within the law. Ground pounding a flare nare in the ditch won't affect me.
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OK, I gotta confess, I did this once, though not with intention. We were driving to find a spot, and spotted a rooster on the shoulder! My buddy rolled up, I got out and he kept rolling. To my amazement Mr rooster was standing there looking right at me. I ran up to him and he didn't move. Ground pound #1. Then I look on the other side of the road and there's two more birds standing! What luck! I ran at them in an attempt to get a flush but they stood as though statues. Ground pound #2. The third bird took flight and I missed🤪. As we drove away and surveyed the surroundings it became evident these birds were from a hunting outfit. Me and my buddy agreed, let's not hunt around the game farm from now on😂. Still something we laugh about today.
 
You shouldn't be losing many birds without a dog and with a dog that number ideally should be around 0. It does inevitably happen to even the best shooters and dog combos.
 
I'm putting a thumbs down on people who hunt without a dog. Also on these so called,hunting operations.Also on this so called, group hunting.
 
gimruis said:
You stated more than once this season you've already lost 15 birds WITH a dog.

When I hunted without one, I lost way less than that. So who's kidding who here? Either hunting without a dog isn't as unethical as you make it sound, or your dog is useless.
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Days hunted - 8 (1 to 4 hours in length, all in central MN, between Nov 17 - Jan 1)
Roosters bagged - 16
Cripples - 0
Rough estimate of birds seen: at least a dozen each time, several times between 20-30, and one time about 40.

He lost as many birds as you shot!😂
 
gimruis said:
You stated more than once this season you've already lost 15 birds WITH a dog.

When I hunted without one, I lost way less than that. So who's kidding who here? Either hunting without a dog isn't as unethical as you make it sound, or your dog is useless.
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You had to know that won't go un-touched. Bro its a unwritten rule you don't trash another guys dog. 🤡 pretty brave behind the keyboard.
 
A5 Sweet 16 said:
Dog will find it the vast, vast, VAST majority of the time. I believe a human should have as little impact on the drop area as possible, so pheasant scent isn't disturbed & human scent isn't introduced. Stay away, preferably downwind. $0.02
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Absolutely 100%. Stay back and let your dog use its nose... You trained it to find the bird, believe in it and stay back 20 yards gun in hand just in case it somehow gets up again.

Walking in there and kicking the grass or pointing the dog in there at your feet is the worst thing you could ever do.. training wise and bird recovery wise.

If your dog cant find that bird, its not there.
 
hyresmack said:
You had to know that won't go un-touched. Bro its a unwritten rule you don't trash another guys dog. 🤡 pretty brave behind the keyboard.
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Actually I have a great yellow lab.She did find many wounded birds this year.She is turning 11 in September. I did loose several with this little pea shooter 28 beretta over under. It was very dry this year.I think we are both getting a little long in the tooth, but still hunting hard.
 
Goosemaster said:
Actually I have a great yellow lab.She did find many wounded birds this year.She is turning 11 in September. I did loose several with this little pea shooter 28 beretta over under. It was very dry this year.I think we are both getting a little long in the tooth, but still hunting hard.
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I was hoping in south Dakota you would have hunted with Sage or Ace. They know the lay of the land really well. Only rule is no gauge smaller than 16 and no grab ass.
 
birddude said:
My experience was that 50% is pretty close. My 1st pheasant hunt was in 1982. Centerville Iowa, at that time it was supposedly the pheasant capital of the world. I'm not hot spotting because now you would be lucky to see one there. We were 4 young guys, strong and fit. 1 novice, the rest of us could shoot. A buddy and I had dogs, but everyone I knew who had hunted them told us that they would ruin your dog. Granted I was under gunned for long shots with a 16 and none of us exactly picked our shots. There were a lot of birds. we saw a lot on the roads but only shot a couple of them. We were hardly ever turned down to hunt and saw birds everywhere we hunted. We knocked down 32 roosters and brought home 14. We never went back without dogs. I hunted the next 21 years straight in Iowa. Hunted and area until bird #s dwindled, moved west until we found them. Repeat until it was no longer feasible.
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I spent a year in Centerville playing ball in early 2000’s. No birds then that I remember seeing, but man is that a cool area. I spose everything is wrecked because of paid deer hunting. Farmers were friendly at that time letting a kid try callin yotes. Rathbun is awesome.
 
Bob Peters said:
I was hoping in south Dakota you would have hunted with Sage or Ace. They know the lay of the land really well. Only rule is no gauge smaller than 16 and no grab ass.
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🤣🤣 You can tell we're that simple just from our videos?? I gotta learn how to be less transparent.
 
I started really working on “ dead bird” at the end of the season and have been few times a week since. Doing good, hopefully it translates. I lost a few this year from wild flushes dog didm’t see. If dog flushes and marks very confident. I also have to get better at marking.
 
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