Got my first g.s.p. pup for Christmas from the wife, So I've been trying to train him and I've been using a dead quail in a old sock to teach him to fetch and find dead birds, but now he thinks that's his only job I've put him on live birds and if he can see them he points and holds but if he smells them but can't see them he runs through them and chases them how do I get him to point on first scent? He's a very smart pup and he actually did a better job hunting before I thought him to find dead How do I undo the damage I've caused???????
Help!!!
- Thread starter Ynot92
- Start date
westksbowhunter
Well-known member
You have taught him to point by sight versus using his nose. Please buy a copy of this book. C.A. was my neighbor and taught everything I know about bird dogs.https://www.abebooks.com/C-A-Johnson-Whoa-Dead-Bird/20493313512/bd
Crossing shot
New member
I would not worry about it. Just continue what you are doing. Make sure he can't see the bird or the dead bird. He'll learn.
Ynot,
I wouldn't worry too much about it. If you got the pup for Christmas, I'm guessing he's roughly 5 - 6 months old. You can't expect much out of a pup at that age. My suggestion for training is to get him out and "happy time" him.
Happy timing is getting the pup out so that he can experience all the things that might catch his attention when you start his training. These are things like grasshoppers, trash birds, water, grass taller than the lawn, being away from you in the field, noises he doesn't hear in the yard, etc. He needs to be comfortable just being "out there". We make the assumption that dogs just adapt to this stuff. While that is true, we don't want to have to do that during formal training. Just get the pup out in the field and and let the pup be a pup.
This should be done until pup is comfortable with nearly anything he encounters.
You haven't done any damage, happy timing the pup will get him to start "looking" for things with his nose.
Point!
I wouldn't worry too much about it. If you got the pup for Christmas, I'm guessing he's roughly 5 - 6 months old. You can't expect much out of a pup at that age. My suggestion for training is to get him out and "happy time" him.
Happy timing is getting the pup out so that he can experience all the things that might catch his attention when you start his training. These are things like grasshoppers, trash birds, water, grass taller than the lawn, being away from you in the field, noises he doesn't hear in the yard, etc. He needs to be comfortable just being "out there". We make the assumption that dogs just adapt to this stuff. While that is true, we don't want to have to do that during formal training. Just get the pup out in the field and and let the pup be a pup.
This should be done until pup is comfortable with nearly anything he encounters.
You haven't done any damage, happy timing the pup will get him to start "looking" for things with his nose.
Point!
Crossing shot
New member
Are you using a training pistol on dead bird? This might help the dog learn when to go in for a retrieve and when to stop for a point.
PheasantWhisperer
Member
When it comes time to teach the pups to hunt dead. I do it at night. Some people on here will frown on this. But it teaches them to use their nose instead of eyeballs. They hear the dummy hit the ground so they know the general vicinity, but once they look up and realize they are not going to see it they put their nose on the ground and circle till they find it. Now when I say hunt dead in the field while hunting the nose goes down and they don't even look up. When dove hunting in September, most of the retrieves are sight retrieves because we are hunting over bare ground some. But if there are multiple birds down and they aren't finding them all, I yell hunt dead and the nose drops down and they smell their way to it. The old dog does this automatically, when she cant see it the nose goes down immediately. With the pups sometimes I have to give the command.
Interesting approach! I might try this on my next dog...if there is a next.
BrownDogsCan2
Well-known member
I've done that too. I'll run out to a bridge on a creek or small river and throw a dummy over the edge of the bridge. The dog will have to run down to the edge of the guardrail and come back to the fall and use its nose. The other thing you can do
in daylight is walk or float a stream and use high steep cut banks were the dog has to go downstream and find a way up the bank and come back to the fall.
Great idea, Although the dog can see much better than us at night.
westksbowhunter
Well-known member
Always started my puppies with the "dead" command around 8 weeks. Just tossed a couple of pieces of hot dogs in the grass and commanded "dead" over and over. Works like a charm. Much like teaching all the obedience commands. Nothing better than a treat for learning.
PheasantWhisperer
Member
They can see better than us, but they don't see as well as they do in the daylight. They cant see a brown dummy in 4-6 inch grass 30 yards away when its pitch black.
I used to do treat like westks said but you cant do it for very long, when they find a dead bird they will chew on it just like it's a treat. Definitely an introduction thing only.
westksbowhunter
Well-known member
I have never had a dog chew a bird do to training like this. C.A. never did either and mentions this in his book. He only trained the greatest English Setter in the history of the breed.
Chestle
Well-known member
+1
I've done this as standard procedure. Short grass (belly high lawn grass) first, taller grass as they progress.
I have also heated the hot dog in the microwave to get it greasy and drug it through the grass at the end of a fishing pole so the trail was 6' away from my foot trail. At the end of the trail, tear off a chunk of meat and toss it where I stopped dragging. Put the fishing rod away, got the pup and put them down where the trail began. Told them "Dead-dead-dead". They get into nose down trailing pretty quick. As they age and progress, add zig zags and double backs. Amazing what a young pup will learn to do in just a very short time.
Like westksbowhunter, I've never had a problem with any dog eating the bird after using this technique either. That may be because the retriever training with dummies conditions them to pick the object up and bring it right back to hand.