A Story of Slob Hunters
- Thread starter BritChaser
- Start date
RK Special K
New member
I understand and respect these views, but in a FREE society, lines need to be drawn and balances between extremes maintained.
In my opinion, those who prefer higher compliance should "voice" a demand for more and better law enforcement. The cost of freedom is, very often, high.
In my opinion, those who prefer higher compliance should "voice" a demand for more and better law enforcement. The cost of freedom is, very often, high.
Calisdad
New member
This months Petersens Hunting mag has a story about a family that was busted on a tip for killing 90 deer, an elk and 4 antelope in the Cedar mountains west of Salt Lake City. Not clear on the details but witness tampering and racketeering charges were also filed so the anonymous tipster might have been harassed.
Seems these guys were doing it for over 10 years and only wanted trophys. They would only save the heads or antlers, sometimes hiding them and coming back weeks later for their prize. No photos were allowed. The destruction to that herd has yet to be ascertained but it is thought to be severe.
I would be interested in a warden's perspective on this issue. When I've called stuff in I've been less than well received: "Did you see the guys with shotguns hanging out their windows shoot?" and "We've already got our quota on bear poaching for the year." WTF?.
However when I've met wardens in the field I get an entirely different perspective.
Any wardens reading this?
Seems these guys were doing it for over 10 years and only wanted trophys. They would only save the heads or antlers, sometimes hiding them and coming back weeks later for their prize. No photos were allowed. The destruction to that herd has yet to be ascertained but it is thought to be severe.
I would be interested in a warden's perspective on this issue. When I've called stuff in I've been less than well received: "Did you see the guys with shotguns hanging out their windows shoot?" and "We've already got our quota on bear poaching for the year." WTF?.
However when I've met wardens in the field I get an entirely different perspective.
Any wardens reading this?
captaincoot
Banned
Lets think before you type. You will turn someone in for breaking the law all day really. How do you get anything done in a day? I just went on a 30 mile trip and I counted 38 people breaking the law. These law breakers range from not stoping at a stop sign to passing in a no passing zone, speeding,parked illegally,jay walkings, littering, pet not on leach,no blinkers, tail lights, reckless driving. Wow you guys are good:thumbsup: I'm not wasting my time. Or do you only care about hunting laws? Are some laws more important then others? For what the guy has been through do you really blame him for not wanting to do it again? I turned two guys in for hunting the refuge you know what they did nothing
You could look out the main office window and see them. I will alway do what I think is the right thing when the time comes. Lets not judge until you been in there shoes.
You could look out the main office window and see them. I will alway do what I think is the right thing when the time comes. Lets not judge until you been in there shoes.
henhenROOSTER!!!
New member
Coot, you do make a valid point! But do or would you ever turn anybody in for anything??? How about a drunk driver weaving all over the road, an obvious danger to everyone including the innocent? How about as just happened to me in international travels, asking security to please check on a locked multi-stall public bathroom in an airport filled to the brim with jihadi people at the height of the Haaj festival (in which there was even a glory-shrine to the twin-towers & 911)? How about when your own corrupt lawyer, banker & builder all in devious cahoots have raped you financially (which btw did happen to me & the real fun was barely even getting started from there)? Should we really all just turn a blind eye & deaf ear to EVERYTHING...
Two can play devil's advocate: By the line of reasoning being purported by some on here, maybe we should all just let folks enter unannounced into houses when nobody's home and help theirself to the fridge, booze & TV or worse, perhaps even sample the wife if she happens to be home (the 1st half of which I ashamedly did more than once as an out-of-control teenager & you are right nobody ever turned me in - the latter half Thank God I have never been a party to or aider & abettor of, but it does happen & neighborhood "witnesses" very often turn into shaking-in-their-boots clams)...
Yeah, guess we all have to make our own decisions as to what exactly warrants intervention or "snitching" (a term which I have heard most often from the lips of perpetrators in the jails, prisons & juvenile delinquent centers I have worked with for decades)...I'm not wasting my time on the kind of mickey-mouse stuff you speak of either - but whenever in doubt or question, I personally will err on the side of caution!
If folks really do want less government control/intervention in our lives, to me it stands to reason for honest folks to help them out a little with a tip-off on bad apples sometimes so they can adequately do their job instead of blind-fishin in the dark! How on earth does everybody else's keeping a tight-lip & HIRING MORE government enforcers to try to take care of business all on their own as someone on here has suggested possibly help out with less government interference/intervention in our lives???
Yeah, I have encountered the no-help or less-than-desirable-help problem from law enforcement agencies as well. In the case of the obstinate moron who repeatedly poached on my & everyone else's property that we eventually had to hold at gunpoint, or several others who we (friends/family) sometimes worked together as a crew of 3-4 with walkie-talkies to give one hell of an unpleasant experience (one even came back 3 times on the same day & still wanted to fight/argue on the last one) - yeah the game wardens & cops may not have helped out all that much & pretty much let them go scot-free or with a laughable wrist-slap, but I can promise you the very distasteful experience they had overall & the fact that their names & faces were on public record at least sent them packing on down the road for a much easier pushover!
BTW, I'm not bashing onpoint - he does have a rough situation! I wouldn't or couldn't handle it the way he does though - that guy needs to be stopped!!!
Two can play devil's advocate: By the line of reasoning being purported by some on here, maybe we should all just let folks enter unannounced into houses when nobody's home and help theirself to the fridge, booze & TV or worse, perhaps even sample the wife if she happens to be home (the 1st half of which I ashamedly did more than once as an out-of-control teenager & you are right nobody ever turned me in - the latter half Thank God I have never been a party to or aider & abettor of, but it does happen & neighborhood "witnesses" very often turn into shaking-in-their-boots clams)...
Yeah, guess we all have to make our own decisions as to what exactly warrants intervention or "snitching" (a term which I have heard most often from the lips of perpetrators in the jails, prisons & juvenile delinquent centers I have worked with for decades)...I'm not wasting my time on the kind of mickey-mouse stuff you speak of either - but whenever in doubt or question, I personally will err on the side of caution!
If folks really do want less government control/intervention in our lives, to me it stands to reason for honest folks to help them out a little with a tip-off on bad apples sometimes so they can adequately do their job instead of blind-fishin in the dark! How on earth does everybody else's keeping a tight-lip & HIRING MORE government enforcers to try to take care of business all on their own as someone on here has suggested possibly help out with less government interference/intervention in our lives???
Yeah, I have encountered the no-help or less-than-desirable-help problem from law enforcement agencies as well. In the case of the obstinate moron who repeatedly poached on my & everyone else's property that we eventually had to hold at gunpoint, or several others who we (friends/family) sometimes worked together as a crew of 3-4 with walkie-talkies to give one hell of an unpleasant experience (one even came back 3 times on the same day & still wanted to fight/argue on the last one) - yeah the game wardens & cops may not have helped out all that much & pretty much let them go scot-free or with a laughable wrist-slap, but I can promise you the very distasteful experience they had overall & the fact that their names & faces were on public record at least sent them packing on down the road for a much easier pushover!
BTW, I'm not bashing onpoint - he does have a rough situation! I wouldn't or couldn't handle it the way he does though - that guy needs to be stopped!!!
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captaincoot
Banned
Mr. Rooster you made some very good points:thumbsup: Trust me I protect the innocent and I do not let people break the law. I'm sure onpoint would do the same. Just not for an wild animal anymore. I would hope we would all care more for family then a wild animal. Do not all of us have something in life that we had a bad experience with and won't do it again. Onpoint is more of a man then i'll ever be because someone would pay for being that stupid in my way of thinking. I guess what i'm trying to say is I weight the risk reward factor before doing so. The game wardens/police we have now make the call it will be taken care of. 20 years ago they could care less around here. It's a tough call whats worth calling in and whats not.
Mr. Rooster you've gone through some wild situations, I applaud you for learning from mistakes and doing right when it needed to be done and making the world a little better:thumbsup:
Mr. Rooster you've gone through some wild situations, I applaud you for learning from mistakes and doing right when it needed to be done and making the world a little better:thumbsup:
missourihunter85
New member
My father always told me to never discuss politics with friends because more then likely you'll lose a few. Not everyone sees everything in the same light, and has the same opinions. I think I can add another thing to the list of things not to talk about to keep the peace.
After saying that I can also say that at the beginning of this thread I was strictly opposed to onpoint, and then several valid points were made. Now my opinion is there has to be balance to this issue. And thankfully there are people like onpoint, and also thankfully there are people like dakotazeb (not trying to single anyone out just using examples). If everyone was like onpoint, the world would be a pretty scary place to live, no one would care about the consequences of their actions, and same way on the other side of the argument, if everyone said everything that they saw that was illegal it would be again be a pretty scary place to live. There needs to be balance to this, and judging by what I've read here, there definitely is a balance.
Everyone should be thankful that we can and do have the right to have this argument, and that we can live the way that we want to. God Bless the United States of America
:cheers:
After saying that I can also say that at the beginning of this thread I was strictly opposed to onpoint, and then several valid points were made. Now my opinion is there has to be balance to this issue. And thankfully there are people like onpoint, and also thankfully there are people like dakotazeb (not trying to single anyone out just using examples). If everyone was like onpoint, the world would be a pretty scary place to live, no one would care about the consequences of their actions, and same way on the other side of the argument, if everyone said everything that they saw that was illegal it would be again be a pretty scary place to live. There needs to be balance to this, and judging by what I've read here, there definitely is a balance.
Everyone should be thankful that we can and do have the right to have this argument, and that we can live the way that we want to. God Bless the United States of America
:cheers:
kansasbrittany
Banned
Good post!
captaincoot
Banned
:10sign: Well said:thumbsup:
henhenROOSTER!!!
New member
I'm not ever gonna tell it, it is his story to tell - but there is A LOT more to onpoint's story far beyond mere hunting! In my opinion, a man like he is dealing with needs to be stopped once & for all, even for the sake of others if not for oneself!!! The first place I would go is to the feds (on several levels) above any local-yocals heads and tell the story in full, inform them if anything ever happens to me or my wife or children you know exactly who to look for and why, & then let them know kindly if someone doesn't respond to help me immediately in a full-blown crisis under the known circumstances they can just send out an ambulance to pick up a corpse (and it won't be mine if I can help it)!!!
In my own personal worst-case lawbreaking story which had nothing at all to do with hunting - my own lawyer, the banker, & my builder all turned out after the fact to be alumni ex-lawman buddies/cronies...In the end after all of the late nite threats & harassment & terrifying intimidation/encounters of my wife - the main perpetrator (the builder) turned up back behind a badge, sneering & mocking as the officer specifically assigned to handle my "complaint"/case. If I had not been able to go way over his head, sorry but enough is enough & I don't take that kind of S#*! from anybody!!! Believe me, deaf ears & blind eyes would not & did not help me one iota...
My personal dealings with people who are shady in their hunting practices is that they are usually equally so in other areas as well. The idiot who poached all over several counties (killing multiple trophy bucks annually where only one was legal, in hot pursuit until he had the one to win almost every local big-buck contest) - had also been collecting total-"disability" checks for 10 yrs, but somehow had no problem whatsoever climbing any treestand in the woods for every single one of the 90 days of the season & dragging his prize a mile or two out of the woods, usually across multiple posted properties!!! Let a man like him run wild if you want, but these kind of jerks deserve being turned in in my books...
I confess I am somewhat of a two-faced hypocrite on the issue being discussed here...On the one hand, maybe the fellas ripping thru the cornfield shooting out of the truck really were the farmer & a friend or his sons doing whatever they want on their own property - if so, whether I agree or not I really don't have that much of a problem with it. But I haven't met very many farmers like that (only one I can think of - a very wealthy part-time farmer & big-business owner, who was drunker than Cooter Brown & driving an out-of-control firetruck across all of the surrounding neighbors property including mine with a bunch of drunks hanging on the sides & top, whooping & hollering and reaching up trying to grab the electrical lines as they passed underneath - and yeah, I turned him in too be4 somebody got seriously hurt - he later caused an accident anyway that killed a young man, by pulling out of his driveway snockered three-sheets-to-the-wind again)...
If you think these are extremely rare & odd stories, I have plenty more (some that hit awful close to home for a pheasant or bird hunter)...I had a bad experience last year where hardly one farmer in a particular area would even speak to me much less give permission to hunt after a couple Yea-Hoos had driven thru the area shooting roosters out of several of the farmers front yards!!! Should no one snitch on these guys either???...How about the Monster/Maniac OLD-GEEZER that pulled up on our public TX coastal-island goose/duck blind after we were already set-up one morning & proceeded to throw his decoys right in the middle of ours, cussing us like a dog about how this was his island and by God nobody was gonna take it as he wildly swung his shotgun barrel right at all of our faces and guts, including my children!!! We left & let him have it because of the kids - but I shudder to think what might have happened if they weren't there - I don't think I have ever been so angry at a grown man acting like a bizarre temper-tantrum-throwing tyrant in my life - and yeah, we snitched on him to the game warden too (we didn't even have to bother telling him the name - he already knew instantly). Should everybody turn their head & go on letting this psyco continue running loose till he winds up killing somebody???
Unfortunately, there are plenty more stories over the course of my lifetime...But it sounds like most of our minds are pretty made up about what we're gonna do already. Yeah, it is a free world & each to his own - but there are consequences to either course of action. We hunters continue losing both public & private access more & more each year due to way too much of this kind of behavior going unchecked!
I bet I sound like a monster myself by now, but I'm really not. I am a peacemaker at heart who has mitigated many a serious conflict. I get along with pretty much everybody I meet & don't have many enemies at all except for a few of the really bad cases such as described above. But when it comes to these type of cases I am a 100% unapologetic "tattletale", mainly because of all the people (both landowner & fellow hunters) behind me who have to suffer the unchecked consequences if I don't do or say anything. I would certainly hope that some of you would do the same for me & the honor of our hunting brotherhood/fraternity!
Cap'nCoot - you are right , it is difficult knowing where to draw the line sometimes! But it sure would be nice if we could all find a healthy middle ground somewhere between "all or nothing"!!! :cheers:
In my own personal worst-case lawbreaking story which had nothing at all to do with hunting - my own lawyer, the banker, & my builder all turned out after the fact to be alumni ex-lawman buddies/cronies...In the end after all of the late nite threats & harassment & terrifying intimidation/encounters of my wife - the main perpetrator (the builder) turned up back behind a badge, sneering & mocking as the officer specifically assigned to handle my "complaint"/case. If I had not been able to go way over his head, sorry but enough is enough & I don't take that kind of S#*! from anybody!!! Believe me, deaf ears & blind eyes would not & did not help me one iota...
My personal dealings with people who are shady in their hunting practices is that they are usually equally so in other areas as well. The idiot who poached all over several counties (killing multiple trophy bucks annually where only one was legal, in hot pursuit until he had the one to win almost every local big-buck contest) - had also been collecting total-"disability" checks for 10 yrs, but somehow had no problem whatsoever climbing any treestand in the woods for every single one of the 90 days of the season & dragging his prize a mile or two out of the woods, usually across multiple posted properties!!! Let a man like him run wild if you want, but these kind of jerks deserve being turned in in my books...
I confess I am somewhat of a two-faced hypocrite on the issue being discussed here...On the one hand, maybe the fellas ripping thru the cornfield shooting out of the truck really were the farmer & a friend or his sons doing whatever they want on their own property - if so, whether I agree or not I really don't have that much of a problem with it. But I haven't met very many farmers like that (only one I can think of - a very wealthy part-time farmer & big-business owner, who was drunker than Cooter Brown & driving an out-of-control firetruck across all of the surrounding neighbors property including mine with a bunch of drunks hanging on the sides & top, whooping & hollering and reaching up trying to grab the electrical lines as they passed underneath - and yeah, I turned him in too be4 somebody got seriously hurt - he later caused an accident anyway that killed a young man, by pulling out of his driveway snockered three-sheets-to-the-wind again)...
If you think these are extremely rare & odd stories, I have plenty more (some that hit awful close to home for a pheasant or bird hunter)...I had a bad experience last year where hardly one farmer in a particular area would even speak to me much less give permission to hunt after a couple Yea-Hoos had driven thru the area shooting roosters out of several of the farmers front yards!!! Should no one snitch on these guys either???...How about the Monster/Maniac OLD-GEEZER that pulled up on our public TX coastal-island goose/duck blind after we were already set-up one morning & proceeded to throw his decoys right in the middle of ours, cussing us like a dog about how this was his island and by God nobody was gonna take it as he wildly swung his shotgun barrel right at all of our faces and guts, including my children!!! We left & let him have it because of the kids - but I shudder to think what might have happened if they weren't there - I don't think I have ever been so angry at a grown man acting like a bizarre temper-tantrum-throwing tyrant in my life - and yeah, we snitched on him to the game warden too (we didn't even have to bother telling him the name - he already knew instantly). Should everybody turn their head & go on letting this psyco continue running loose till he winds up killing somebody???
Unfortunately, there are plenty more stories over the course of my lifetime...But it sounds like most of our minds are pretty made up about what we're gonna do already. Yeah, it is a free world & each to his own - but there are consequences to either course of action. We hunters continue losing both public & private access more & more each year due to way too much of this kind of behavior going unchecked!
I bet I sound like a monster myself by now, but I'm really not. I am a peacemaker at heart who has mitigated many a serious conflict. I get along with pretty much everybody I meet & don't have many enemies at all except for a few of the really bad cases such as described above. But when it comes to these type of cases I am a 100% unapologetic "tattletale", mainly because of all the people (both landowner & fellow hunters) behind me who have to suffer the unchecked consequences if I don't do or say anything. I would certainly hope that some of you would do the same for me & the honor of our hunting brotherhood/fraternity!
Cap'nCoot - you are right , it is difficult knowing where to draw the line sometimes! But it sure would be nice if we could all find a healthy middle ground somewhere between "all or nothing"!!! :cheers:
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