Still burning state property

reddog

reddog

Well-known member
Its May 7th. You cannot train a dog from March 15th thru July something, why in the hell are they still burning state ground right in the middle of nesting season?

Its not just pheasants, the ducks have been nesting for several weeks in the grasslands..

By their own propaganda..

Nesting can begin as early as March in southern
Iowa, but egg laying usually begins in mid to late
April, peak incubation occurs in May, and peak
hatch is usually early to mid June.
 
They do it every year:mad: I walk the fields after they burn nest everywhere:( Their would be a lot more birds if these wildlife management experts would let mother nature alone.
 
here in runnells at the niel smith wildlife refuge public land they burn at the 1st two weeks of april and they burn in sections. the folks of care for this area know how to do it,,, lots of birds in this area. but i have seen in alot of different area they burn in nesting season and it baffles me:confused:
 
It doesn't make a whole lot of sense to be burning nesting cover in May. They may not have enough man power to burn the areas before then.
 
There are a number of reasons to burn late in the season. If you are trying to increase you NWSG and reduce your CSG, burning late will help in that arena. Also, if you are fighting woody invasion, you need to burn after those plants have expended the energy to leaf out for the year to get the greatest effect. The higher rainfall belt you live in, the more frequent you need to burn in order to set back succession. In some areas, if you miss a year or two burning you have to resort to chemical or mechanical means. That is extremely more costly and, if they have budgets like we do, they cannot afford to get in that situation. Add to that the fact that several recent years have either been drought or flood, playing catchup can look like bad management when in reality it is necessary to maintain those acres with the manpower and budgets available. The loss of a few nests is of negligible importance compared to the total loss of a productive habitat.
 
Undisturbed grasslands are by far the most productive pheasant producing areas. Woody cover within a grassland makes for even better pheasant habitat.
Sure glad they aren't burning out in pheasant country. :)
 
Prairie Drifter said:
There are a number of reasons to burn late in the season. If you are trying to increase you NWSG and reduce your CSG, burning late will help in that arena. Also, if you are fighting woody invasion, you need to burn after those plants have expended the energy to leaf out for the year to get the greatest effect. The higher rainfall belt you live in, the more frequent you need to burn in order to set back succession. In some areas, if you miss a year or two burning you have to resort to chemical or mechanical means. That is extremely more costly and, if they have budgets like we do, they cannot afford to get in that situation. Add to that the fact that several recent years have either been drought or flood, playing catchup can look like bad management when in reality it is necessary to maintain those acres with the manpower and budgets available. The loss of a few nests is of negligible importance compared to the total loss of a productive habitat.
Click to expand...


Troy, I understand all of that. and in a perfect world, where there were enormous amounts of alternative cover for nesting, a few negligible losses are acceptable. But, this is Iowa, and we dont have an unlimited amount of nesting cover available.

The weather this year has been atrocious for any type of burning this year. I just finished burning my own priarie this afternoon actually. But, It was mowed down three weeks ago, to prevent anybody setting up shop. I think momma mallard may have taken up residence, and I felt terrible about this, but at least I tried to thwart anybody nesting in my WSG.

This is too late, in my opinion.
 
Red dog, the fact that this type of nesting cover is so limited makes it even more relevant to maintain. Unfortunately, you cannot always reach your habitat goals and ensure that first nests are to survive. Getting the impacts necessary requires intrusion into the goings on of the current year. The higher the rainfall belt your habitat is in, the more frequent your impacts must be to keep woody invasion in check. MNMT lives in probably a <20 inch rainfall belt so woody intrusion is extremely slow. In eastern Kansas, a 30+ inch rainfall area, woody cover has expanded 30+% since the 1980's. In Florida and Georgia they have a 90+ rainfall total and the plantation I toured burned 95% of their area each year and roller chopped 45%. That left only 5% undisturbed nesting cover which was enough evidently to keep their population at the levels they were managing for. A lot depends on how long it has been since the last burn and when those burns were initiated. Once the woody stock has a foothold, the harder it is to keep it in check. As hunters we often complain about what's happening in front of us without realizing the bigger picture of how it fits in the maintenance or development for things in the long haul. I know on my area my management plan is for a 4 year burn rotation, but with current drought conditions in their 4th year and limited time and conditions for burning, the true rotation is reaching 8 years with some areas not having been burned in over a decade. Cedar, rough-leafed dogwood, fragrant sumac, and sand plum are getting too big a bite. Getting ahead of it will take a more vigorous effort than staying ahead of it would have!
 
Prairie Drifter said:
Red dog, the fact that this type of nesting cover is so limited makes it even more relevant to maintain. Unfortunately, you cannot always reach your habitat goals and ensure that first nests are to survive. Getting the impacts necessary requires intrusion into the goings on of the current year. The higher the rainfall belt your habitat is in, the more frequent your impacts must be to keep woody invasion in check. MNMT lives in probably a <20 inch rainfall belt so woody intrusion is extremely slow. In eastern Kansas, a 30+ inch rainfall area, woody cover has expanded 30+% since the 1980's. In Florida and Georgia they have a 90+ rainfall total and the plantation I toured burned 95% of their area each year and roller chopped 45%. That left only 5% undisturbed nesting cover which was enough evidently to keep their population at the levels they were managing for. A lot depends on how long it has been since the last burn and when those burns were initiated. Once the woody stock has a foothold, the harder it is to keep it in check. As hunters we often complain about what's happening in front of us without realizing the bigger picture of how it fits in the maintenance or development for things in the long haul. I know on my area my management plan is for a 4 year burn rotation, but with current drought conditions in their 4th year and limited time and conditions for burning, the true rotation is reaching 8 years with some areas not having been burned in over a decade. Cedar, rough-leafed dogwood, fragrant sumac, and sand plum are getting too big a bite. Getting ahead of it will take a more vigorous effort than staying ahead of it would have!
Click to expand...

PD, is there a point where burning is no longer necessary where warm seasons have been re-introduced? I guess what I'm getting at is, once the warm-seasons have a solid take over will they keep woody growth from reappearing? Or is this something that's always be an issue due to the "infected" seed bed?
 
1pheas4 said:
PD, is there a point where burning is no longer necessary where warm seasons have been re-introduced? I guess what I'm getting at is, once the warm-seasons have a solid take over will they keep woody growth from reappearing? Or is this something that's always be an issue due to the "infected" seed bed?
Click to expand...

Our Native Warm-Season Grasses (NWSG) evolved under the pressures of grazing and fire. Their growth points are located at or below ground, an adaptation developed by these two forces. Unfortunately, in some ways, we have disrupted those adaptive forces. We promoted trees and discouraged fire. We changed grazing from a wild, herding animal system to a partitioned, tame, non-migratory system.

As you indicate, the new (relatively) seed bed dynamic of a higher proportion of tree seed and root stock pressure available does push the system toward getting out-of-hand more quickly than what would have been naturally occuring without us. CRP is missing the grazing component for sure. As such, a generous thatch develops over most areas where NWSG occur in 1 or more years of being ungrazed. From a game bird standpoint, that is a big negative. Consider a chick freshly hatched. They are the size of a quarter to a golf ball depending on species. In order for them to stay in contact with their parent and be able to sight feed their first 8-12 weeks of life, they need a significant % of bare ground. An extended lack of fire and/or grazing factors into this in a hurry. Most experts on NWSG management will quote the NWSG axiom of "you cannot manage NWSG in the absence of fire"! It is necessary! The drier the climate, the longer the burning /non-burning sequence can be. The wetter, the shorter. Just because the grass in a CRP planting comes from a bag cannot change the fact that the seed carries the genetic information developed under the historic pressures of fire and grazing.
 
Troy,

Northwest Iowa here.. Is it possible to burn too often? every year?



My restorations are relatively small. 5 a. 8th year in.

quite easy to burn by myself..

Im fighting smooth brome infiltration. Burn, or chemicals early, before the NWSG green up?
 
You may suppress the brome with late burning, but a better scenario is to wait until a killing frost in the fall then spray with roundup when it's near 70 degrees shortly after. The NWSG should be dormant and incapable of taking up the chemical. The brome will still be growing and you'll take a bunch of it out.
 
Thanks, Thats what I needed to hear.

This should also take out the little CWR that I have also? (From initial seed mixture)
 
Red Dog, I did miss answering if you can burn too much. I guess the answer there is yes on many fronts. You need to leave some ground cover to protect the soil and retain soil moisture. Further, any management technique you use is selecting for or against plants and animals. Over do anything and you take the chance of throwing things one direction or another. Too much rest can be just as bad as too much manipulation. Learning to read the conditions and react to them is some of the "ART" aspect of management.
 
Troy, thanks again. Ive been battling with smooth brome from the start. Ive seen half sections of dense switchgrass get overtaken by brome over a period of ten years without intervention.

I did a light discing on my Tall grass prairie last year, and that helped considerably also. My tall grass was a brome field prior to me converting it.


Its my short grass that concerns me..
 
Today:

Wonder if I can train dogs there tomorrow?

20140522_125742.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top