Retreiver questions?

Thrasher

Thrasher

Member
Guys, I need a little advice.

I have a 14 month old Labrador-Weimaraner female. I have had her out after pheasant 9 or 10 times so far this year. The first 4 outings were on a 4 day trip to South Dakota where she could hopefully learn from watching my brothers labs. The first day she walked a few feet in front of me until the grass got to thick and then she walked on my tail. We shot a few birds and I tossed one for her, good retrieve. over the next 3 days she became more confident little by little and by the 4th day was out front 10 yards or so, checked on me often and just sort of went sight seeing.

The first outing back home (Kansas) had her flush a few hens by running over them, not knowing they were there. An hour into the second outing in Kansas a rooster got up behind us and I shot it. It was trying to run and fly and Molly was all over it. She used her body to pin it down and brought it back to me while being slapped in the face by a live bird. After that she started to put it together and actively hunted for birds. We kicked up a second rooster out of a corner and she retrieved flawlessly.

The trouble started on the 3rd home trip. We had 4 flushes that I give her credit for. I was to busy watching Molly and missed the birds. Each bird got up after she caught their scent, flushing between 15-30 yards from her as she tried to work the track. She winded one bird, found the track, and it flushed. She had another track that she followed for four or five hundred yards at a good pace, she circled back when she lost it, reacquired, and kept going. We never saw the bird, I think it flew from the crest of a high spot and we lost it.

The next hunt, she had a hundred yard chase on a bird that we did not find. Since then, during the last few hunts, she will find a scent and only follow it for 10 to 40 yards and then come back to me. When I try to get her back on the track she doesn't really go after it. It is almost like she figures that every time she scents one and tracks it, she can't find it, so why bother.

I am trying to figure out how to fix this and get her to follow a scent to completion. I thought about buying a few birds, making a scent trail to the planted bird, and hunt her into the scent trail. I figured I could start with a short track and then make longer scent trails, zigzags, the whole bit, just like an old rooster.

Another issue that she has, she will chase anything from mice to sparrows. She took off after a few meadowlarks today. She will break off of a chase when I beep her collar. I use it when/if she ranges out past about 40 yards. One beep and she comes back to me, checks in, and keeps hunting.
Any suggestions on correcting this or would it put her off all birds.

Last question, Her confidence is building each day out. She and I are learning as we go as she is my first hunting dog. She does not really quarter. There are times when she is off to one side or the other when a scent or something catches her attention, but a lot of the time she is directly in front of me. I try to walk in zigzags, thinking that she will subconsciously start doing it on her own. She will check on my and change her path to match mine. When the cover is fairly open she goes to the sides more often and her range increases as well. Part of it may be a confidence issue that will work itself out in another year or so. What suggestions does anyone have on building her quartering skills?

Any suggestions that will help either me or Molly get better would be truly appreciated!!!
 
Thrasher, I used tame white ducks to build the confidence on one of my dogs. I let it out and it really left a sent trail. Gave the duck a 10-15 minute headstart in the direction of a large pond. The duck made it to the pond about the same time as the dog, she followed and swam around that pond for close to a half an hour, about the time she was ready to give up I shot it on the water. It really made a difference in her determination.
I know it's different but maybe something along those lines.

By the way it sounds like you have a heck of a bird dog in the making, and should be proud of how far you have taken her already.
BDC2
 
Thrasher,

I wouldn't worry too much, sounds like the dog is about right for the age. The scenting conditions have been pretty horrid the last few weeks in Kansas. I was out this last weekend and my dog was having trouble picking up scent. If you also account for lower bird numbers, and warm temps, it was a tough late season for a dog. Also dogs, like humans, get bored when there isn't much action. As far as chasing meadowlarks, and rooting out mice, that will fix itself as you let the dog know that is not what we are hunting. Hell I told my son this weekend we ought to start hunting meadowlarks, I have never seen so many in my life in every field. Sounds like you are on the right track, just remember the dog is young and some outings will be better than others. I was real frustrated with mine last year, but at 2.5 years he is really starting to figure it out.
 
Thrasher I am going to agree with the other two posts.

Age of dog, she is doing what her maturity will allow.
If I get my pups walking behind me in heavy cover. I raise my boots up higher when I take a step. The slight bumping of the lower jaw on the dog when the boot hits it normally causes the dog to get out in front. Also after a couple of bumps. Try stepping to the side and using a high pitched happy tone. "huntem UP!"
Quartering. You are on the right track. But it takes time. Your dog checks back with you which is a real positive. Just keep the exaggerated zig zags going and she will get the drift. This is one area that I find a well seasoned hunting dog can help a younger dog learn faster. If you can find a good bird dog to hunt her next to, she will pick it up pretty fast.
Scent trailing. Try the duck trick above...I am betting it will work real well.
If your weather is warm and dry, just remember. That is tough on any dog to scent well. And yea a young dog who has not been exposed to a lot of birds will get bored.
I would also suggest thinking about going to a game reserve. Your dog will have access to birds that you know are their. I find it builds the desire to hunt and keeps the boredom at bay on a younger dog.
 
I'll give a big amen to the above post. Just finished training and hunting with my fifth Golden. He's 15 month's old and has had lots of birds in front of him.

First time out, he was wondering if we were going for a walk! Now he's a hunting machine!

Birds and more birds! Find a preserve and invest in chuckers or hen pheasants. The dog will love the action.

I had three trips to SD this season and about 8 trips to a game preserve; this was the most important investment that I've made in his young life; it's made a huge difference in his developpment.

Goog Luck.
 
Thanks for the advice, guys.

I am pleased with how she is doing, just got a little concerned as she is my first bird dog. After reading your replies, I thought back to the hunts when she was all over the birds. Those hunts were after that snow we had and most of it had melted. Lately it has been dry, and it makes sense that it would be harder pick up a scent.

I was going to try and buy a few birds to train her with, but it seems like the local places are out. I will try to find a preserve and get her on some birds. Hopefully the preserve has birds and will have for another few months. I would love to hunt her for another 2 months.

I have never been to a preserve, does anyone know the months that they normally operate?

Ducks seem like a good idea to build her confidence on a trail. I have never had her in the water over her stomach, but I think that she would go in after a bird.

I will keep you all posted. Thanks again!
 
Thrasher,
Controlled Shooting Areas are open until the end of March. There is a list of licensed CSA's somewhere on the KDWP web site. I wouldn't worry about getting your dog in the water this time of year, there's plenty of time for that later. I agree with everyone else , scenting conditions have gone downhill in the last couple of weeks.
I wish I could say I was as motivated as you; a couple of dogs ago maybe??? LOL
BDC2
 
If you're interested, there is a preserve in Clay Center that I use several times a year for brushing up and whenever I think the dog just NEEDS some bird contact. The price is pretty reasonable, I think. The owner is pretty flexible. He will set out how ever many birds you want for you, or if you tell him you are training a dog, he will give you a box-o-pheasants that you can plant yourself. He'll even show you how to plant them properly so they stay put but still flush well for the dog.

There is also a variety of cover types on the place, from some crop strips, to some plum clusters, heavy CRP grass, thinner pasture grass, a little draw, and also a small pond with a cattail slew below it. There is cover available for you to recreate just about any situation you would encounter while hunting.

I have just been searching for the best time to start taking Junie, my 6 month Brittany out there. But I have used him for years with Daisy and my previous dog, Rusty.

PM me if you are interested and I will get you his contact info. I am not one to give a blanket endorsement of anything, but I will tell you that my experiences there have been great. I got exactly what I paid for. The birds flushed and flew well, and I am confident that my dogs are better hunters (in part) because I take them there a few times a year.
 
Update: I emailed the owner of the CSA, and was told that he is out of birds.:mad: I don't know if he's done for the season or just temporarily. It looks like I may also be in the market for some birds unless he gets more:eek:.

@ Thrasher, I replied to your PM.
 
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