Pointing to far/ not moving in on running birds.

[Quailnerd]

Work the dog in on some launcher birds this summer down wind, which should create some up close points. Check for a flinch or avoidance when birds are flushed, if not you have an out of the box steady dog which is what people spend thousands of dollar to accomplish. You can work in a release command from point signal or verbal but the scent cone still exists. When you say dog points too far away are we talking 80 yards or 25? I’d much rather have a dog point from distance than 10 feet away, less bumped birds

 

[Weimdogman]

The dog I was talking about was an english setter. The main problem is he refuses to move up and relocate birds when they are running. He can be called off whoa in the yard just fine but in the feild he will not move. I was hunting with the same But I started hunting this spot were the state stocks birds because the wild population this year was worst than it ussaly is in my area. And he has gotten better at moving up on running birds and finding wounded birds. He is a little gun sensitive and I worked with a professional trainer for a whole summer a few years ago. It got to a point that he helped us train the dog for free, and we finally just went for it and shot over him and he handled it ok. More contact with birds is probably the only solution but I was trying to see if there is anything I could do out side of the season.

So here is my take away
Pen raised birds are a small part of the problem.
The real problem is the dog is still gun sensitive and has learned to point away from the gunfire. You may have accidentally taught the dog this while training to overcome the same problem.

The only fix will be going back to getting over the gunshyness and I doubt it can be completely overcome.

 

[Caleb Frank]

Work the dog in on some launcher birds this summer down wind, which should create some up close points. Check for a flinch or avoidance when birds are flushed, if not you have an out of the box steady dog which is what people spend thousands of dollar to accomplish. You can work in a release command from point signal or verbal but the scent cone still exists. When you say dog points too far away are we talking 80 yards or 25? I’d much rather have a dog point from distance than 10 feet away, less bumped birds

I've always been told pointing dogs should be within feet to pin down the bird. He points from 20 or more yards out. The main problem is when he goes on point I go and flush the bird but I can't find it probably because it is running. But the dog won't move up on the bird and the bird runs off. Or he won't move close enough so we never get close enough to flush the bird. He goes on point alot but only a quarter of his points brings up a bird. I wouldn't think it is old scent because he is 3 years old and should have figured that out by now.

 

[LittleBigHorn22]

I've always been told pointing dogs should be within feet to pin down the bird. He points from 20 or more yards out. The main problem is when he goes on point I go and flush the bird but I can't find it probably because it is running. But the dog won't move up on the bird and the bird runs off. Or he won't move close enough so we never get close enough to flush the bird. He goes on point alot but only a quarter of his points brings up a bird. I wouldn't think it is old scent because he is 3 years old and should have figured that out by now.

I think your expectations aren't fully realistic. Pinning a pheasant at the feet is a very hard challenge. Some dogs might be able to pull it off but I would much rather a dog points 70 yards away from the bird than one trying to get up as close as it can only to bump them. If the dog isn't releasing from the point, I think the bird is might actually still be there when you think it has ran off instead. If it is a quarter of points being on a bird, that's pretty darn good in my opinion (on pheasant).

 

[BRITTMAN]

You all have probably worked with more dogs than I have and probably with dogs that had the issue you describe, but I just do not see this being a bird shy or gun-shy issue....

I hate launchers, but agree that they reduce scent especially in the green grass of summer ... careful not to trigger a launch when the dog is too close (story #2 of 2 ... why my brother and I are not fans of pro trainers).

I would argue that planted game birds (that have not moved from where placed) also have a very small scent cone. I find dogs get too close to these planted birds vs. wild birds. I like to train my Britts to point and hold on planted birds when it is a bit breezy for that reason. That or give them time to walk about a bit.

 

[captainshotgun]

The best grouse dog I ever owned, (or saw, or anyone I ever hunted with ever saw), had this same “problem”. You could not hunt this hard going, small ES by himself in a place that had a lot of phez. He would not relocate on a running bird. But he was a bird finding machine! I would not try to “break” him of this. You are in a state that has way more grouse than my state of Ohio has had in at least 40 years. I would either take up grouse hunting, or sell him to a grouse hunter where his talent could be put to the best application, & buy another dog. If you take up ruffed grouse hunting, I guarentee that you will end up loving this dog. Mine would point grouse snow roosting in a foot or more of snow from as much as 20 yards away. Buy snowshoes, & go grouse hunting!