Notion on CRP

[BrownDogsCan2]

More of the same......

Reviewing 2020 CRP Enrollment

USDA’s Conservation Reserve Program is one of the largest federally administered private land retirement programs. Under CRP, in exchange for annual rental payments ranging from $10 per acre to nearly $300 per acre, farmers and landowners voluntarily remove environmentally sensitive land from...

www.fb.org

 

[KSnative]

“ Even as they note in the source you provide that "individual contract data is not available" for comparison purposes. Meaning - they cherry picked their data.”

No, it doesn’t mean that at all.

This has gotten absurd.

Incomplete data is cherry picked information in my lexicon, but if you are more comfortable with the term "flawed" - OK, we'll go with that. Can you at least recognize that the Farm Bureau just possibly might have an axe to grind?

I, like you, would personally benefit from higher CRP "rental" rates. But what would truly be absurd would be the reliance on patently biased and entirely unsupported (and very self serving) assertions to form conclusions that the facts simply do not support. Farmers are not economically clueless.

So, again - how much CRP money is actually being declined, and what percentage of the total does that represent?

 

[KsHusker]

Incomplete data is cherry picked information in my lexicon, but if you are more comfortable with the term "flawed" - OK, we'll go with that. Can you at least recognize that the Farm Bureau just possibly might have an axe to grind?

I, like you, would personally benefit from higher CRP "rental" rates. But what would truly be absurd would be the reliance on patently biased and entirely unsupported (and very self serving) assertions to form conclusions that the facts simply do not support. Farmers are not economically clueless.

So, again - how much CRP money is actually being declined, and what percentage of the total does that represent?

What do you or what did you do for a living if you're retired etc?

 

[KSnative]

What do you or what did you do for a living if you're retired etc?

BrownDogsCan2 says I'm an annoying bastard who doesn't know when to quit (or something like that), and when I think about it - probably sums up my career better than I could have. Only then, I got paid more than I could possibly have been worth for doing it; you guys get it for free!

See there, Brownie - credit where it is due.

 

[3car]

Incomplete data is cherry picked information in my lexicon, but if you are more comfortable with the term "flawed" - OK, we'll go with that. Can you at least recognize that the Farm Bureau just possibly might have an axe to grind?

I, like you, would personally benefit from higher CRP "rental" rates. But what would truly be absurd would be the reliance on patently biased and entirely unsupported (and very self serving) assertions to form conclusions that the facts simply do not support. Farmers are not economically clueless.

So, again - how much CRP money is actually being declined, and what percentage of the total does that represent?

Can I tag in??? Your correct. They can make more money farming than what the current or past CRP Rental rates are. Adding access will drive the signup down which will equal less nesting habitat and also less acres of highly erodible farm land that is protected. The state of SD has the CREP program which adds money on top of CRP in certain areas of the state to allow hunting and fishing. I really think thats the best route pus its not a ton of money either. I think its under 10 bucks an acre per year.

 

[KSnative]

Can I tag in??? Your correct. They can make more money farming than what the current or past CRP Rental rates are. Adding access will drive the signup down which will equal less nesting habitat and also less acres of highly erodible farm land that is protected. The state of SD has the CREP program which adds money on top of CRP in certain areas of the state to allow hunting and fishing. I really think thats the best route pus its not a ton of money either. I think its under 10 bucks an acre per year.

Glad you did (tag in, that is) - but are you sure about that? Assuming CRP funds are "awarded" only for the properties targeted - those that are marginal, or sub-marginal producers to begin with, that is. I think many have a tendency to compare CRP "rental rates" to yields (not net profitability) on fully productive farm grounds. That would incorporate inaccurate accounting with flawed comparative techniques.

To accept your premise, one would have to assume that farmers are either economic imbeciles or altruistic individuals who can afford to ignore the economic realities. Or are dropping CRP like hot potatoes (as has been opined here - although the USDA stats belie that assertion).

I'm guessing that you are knowledgeable and active in the field - and it would be refreshing to see some real world, business based analysis to lay out along side the red hot emotions that seem to surround the issue.

 

[3car]

Glad you did (tag in, that is) - but are you sure about that? Assuming CRP funds are "awarded" only for the properties targeted - those that are marginal, or sub-marginal producers to begin with, that is. I think many have a tendency to compare CRP "rental rates" to yields (not net profitability) on fully productive farm grounds. That would incorporate inaccurate accounting with flawed comparative techniques.

To accept your premise, one would have to assume that farmers are either economic imbeciles or altruistic individuals who can afford to ignore the economic realities. Or are dropping CRP like hot potatoes (as has been opined here - although the USDA stats belie that assertion).

I'm guessing that you are knowledgeable and active in the field - and it would be refreshing to see some real world, business based analysis to lay out along side the red hot emotions that seem to surround the issue.

You use big words... lol Thats our reallity tho. No-till farming practices coupled with better fertilizer/chemical plans and seed genetics allows for higher yields in those otherwise marginal areas and last year guys did really good considering the mess they have been in. CRP is still coming out to be farmed as soon as the contract is done. But really if you want an answer get a hold of your local District Conservationist from the NRCS and pose the question to them. I am sure they have other reasons why. It boils down to money.

 

[KSnative]

You use big words... lol Thats our reallity tho. No-till farming practices coupled with better fertilizer/chemical plans and seed genetics allows for higher yields in those otherwise marginal areas and last year guys did really good considering the mess they have been in. CRP is still coming out to be farmed as soon as the contract is done. But really if you want an answer get a hold of your local District Conservationist from the NRCS and pose the question to them. I am sure they have other reasons why. It boils down to money.

I have yet to be able to confirm wide scale withdrawals, or an ysignificant amount of money being left on the table. USDA web sites offer no substantiation (in fact, suggest the contrary) so I called USDA this AM and asked about it. It was a mystery to them, not a problem on their radar - but of course I just talked to one guy in DC, so no hard proof there. Kind of like asking your FaceBook friends - no science behind it.

FWIW, not clear to me how no-till (with its increased chemical requirements) or state of the art genetically engineered seeds would change the economic balance. Tons of chemicals and high tech seeds cost more; more input coupled with more output would equal a net zero gain for the most part. Furthermore - watch oil prices. Rocketing upward. That will translate very shortly into much higher chemical prices, and that won't favor working marginal soils by any means.

What I thought you'd overlook in your analysis (OK, that's kind of tricky - but you one upped me by not dong one!) was the one factor everyone seems to miss: risk. Or more precisely, lack thereof. Farming is, was and likely always will be a highly risky business. Everything from weather, to pestilence, to pandemics, to strained international relations, to God knows what all act to make tilling the soil a real crap shoot, each and every year. Yes - I may make double the net profit one year by planting soybeans, corn, wheat, alfalfa etc --- but I may also lose every dime of fuel, seed, chemical, equipment purchase or rental and capital cost - along with every labor hour of input. And often do.

With CRP that government check just keeps on coming in, no matter what. No risk, no worry, no labor. In business terms - that is an excellent deal. They are always welcome to send me more OPM (other people's money) if they wish, but I'm all in at current rates.

 

[BrownDogsCan2]

Ok so I am done after this.
"In mid-March, the FSA announced that the agency succeeded in enrolling 3.4 million acres into the program. Unfortunately, 5.4 million acres currently in the program will expire just as those contracts go into effect.

Here’s how this all shakes out:

22.5 million acres—or 2 million acres below the 24.5-million-acre cap—were enrolled in CRP as of December 2019
+ 3.4 million acres enters CRP in October 2020
– 5.4 million acres expire by October 2020
20.5 million total acres—4.5 million acres below the 25-million-acre cap—will be enrolled in CRP as of October 2020

This more than doubles the current acreage shortfall, and another 7 million acres is set to expire by October 2021. [It’s important to note that sign-ups are still ongoing for the continuous CRP, as well as CRP Grasslands, Clean Lakes Estuaries and Rivers (CLEAR), and the Soil Health and Income Protection Program (SHIPP), but enrollment in these programs will not make up the growing acreage shortfall.]"

 

[KSnative]

Ok so I am done after this.
"In mid-March, the FSA announced that the agency succeeded in enrolling 3.4 million acres into the program. Unfortunately, 5.4 million acres currently in the program will expire just as those contracts go into effect.

Here’s how this all shakes out:

22.5 million acres—or 2 million acres below the 24.5-million-acre cap—were enrolled in CRP as of December 2019
+ 3.4 million acres enters CRP in October 2020
– 5.4 million acres expire by October 2020
20.5 million total acres—4.5 million acres below the 25-million-acre cap—will be enrolled in CRP as of October 2020

This more than doubles the current acreage shortfall, and another 7 million acres is set to expire by October 2021. [It’s important to note that sign-ups are still ongoing for the continuous CRP, as well as CRP Grasslands, Clean Lakes Estuaries and Rivers (CLEAR), and the Soil Health and Income Protection Program (SHIPP), but enrollment in these programs will not make up the growing acreage shortfall.]"

"Expiring contracts" is not synonymous with a "shortfall", although FSA offices have been a lot slower than usual in getting around to renewing them (at least, such has been my personal experience). Due to COVID issues and widescale computer issues that compounded the inefficiencies attending "work at home". All at just the wrong time (for those wanting to re-up their CRP). Hence the shift to "continuous signups" instead of the customary annual one shot deal that, as the clip you provided explicitly points out, "is important to note".

It is not my objective here to be obnoxious, stubborn, stupid, racist or any other shade of naughty here so as to miff you (and maybe Remy and McFarmer) . Rather, to work toward a better understanding as to whether farmer bailouts from CRP is a significant problem for Kansas' hunting public. It doesn't appear to be.

Which does not mean there are not real problems with good hunting access for Kansans - there obviously are. These problems need to be tackled in an effective way, at their source. Starting with finding ways to ameliorate exclusionary leasing practices that exist primarily, it would appear, due to the success of KDWPT's non-resident deer tag marketing efforts.

And that is a problem that Kansas residents and voters can and should solve. Lets get 'er done.

P.S. I copied this to the "Trespass" thread in hope of expanding the number of viewers because this is such an important issue. Also, right above that, you may find the analysis as to why CRP will always remain in demand by farmers to be germane.