This is an outgrowth of my predator thread. Every question regarding predators brings a response of the nature that Habitat is everything. If there is enough Habitat, losses to predators are mnimal and exceptable. In a perfect world, with great unbroken tracts of managed, purposely or accidentally, superior habitat, I would concur. Our world is far from perfect. We have very few areas of this type left in the traditional pheasant belt, I would describe that as a township, 32 to 36 sections square. Think of that in the context of your experience. Question is with all combined habitat improvement programs accounted for, do we even break even with what we lose, to competing interests, there are government programs which pay to tile waterways, plow out hedgerows, irrigate marginal ground. In some cases we pay them to restore wetland areas of currently tilled fields, which 10 years ago we paid them to drain? Is it all an agricultural shell game? I don't think we gain an inch. Somebody got any statistics we can rely on, for both sides of the equation.
Habitat gain? loss?, MerryGoRound
- Thread starter oldandnew
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pheasantaddict
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We are on the losing side right now. Hopefully it will swing the other way. I was out today and came across a cut draintile line from a side hill flowing into the creek. It is unbelievable the amount of water coming out of the draintile. Especially when it's been so dry. More flooding on the way this spring for Iowa and states below us. I wish you southern states could send us back all our topsoil that we keep polluting your water with, though you can keep all the chemicals. It may take some lawsuits from the states we are polluting to make conservation mandated or a priority.
Boy, Pheasantaddict, you said what I've dying to say, but didn't want to sound like a critical outsider. Between the tiled and drained fields, hog confinement buildings on every quarter, it's terrifying. Seem on other issues Iowans are remarkably sensible, how do they ignore this wave of pollution, erosion, enviornmental destruction? Not that any of the rest of us are on any high morale ground, there are the same issues all around you. Missouri, Nebraska, Illinois. All of us pumping our wealth down the Mississippi River, along with a chemical witch's brew, building a growing dead zone in the gulf.
Downtown Bang!
Member
Certainly losing ground at this stage in the game. CRP acreage alone has fallen from 37 Million Acres in the mid 2000's to 32 million acres now.
High land prices and budget deficits have for all practical purposes brought public land acquisition to a halt.
Tiling companies have huge backlogs of work right now and the machines are running pretty much non-stop. Loop holes in the wetlands protection legislation created in this decade are being exploited fequently not to mention just complete disregard for them in the first place.
Virgin prairie is being farmed for the first time in the Missouri Coteau and other parts of the northern prairie pothole region. Not because it makes agricultural sense but because crop subsidies can make it profitable.
There are certainly some dark clouds forming. I still believe the outlook for the future was much worse 30-years ago but the farm crisis of the mid-eighties ultimately reversed that tide.
I also agree an even bigger concern than our hunting culture going away is the environmental damage being done. I work in construction now and if we let a shovel full of dirt hit a storm drain or public waterway we are subject to large fines under stormwater prevention rules in the Federal Clean Water Act. The same federal government not only completely exempts agriculture from any regualtion they actually undertake policies that encourage tons of soil & nutrients to enter public waterways. I realize this is food production we are talking about here and there has to be some common sense applied but the current model is not sustainable.
Drainage is also a major issue. Is it a big secret why we seem to have a "100 Year" flood in some part of the ag belt every year. How many tax dollars in the last 20-years have gone to clean up those issues.
Ultimately I think the country as a whole needs to abandon the idea that we are responsible for feeding the world. Especially at the expense of our own land and environment.
I cannot imagine that shipping tons of grain and other basic food commodities across huge oceans is the most effecient (and profitable) solution to the process. How about if we developed a reasonable, sustainable agricultural production model of our own and then took the model and expertise around the world instead of the end product. I'd hazard to guess the end product would be less expensive for developing countries and more profitable for us.
High land prices and budget deficits have for all practical purposes brought public land acquisition to a halt.
Tiling companies have huge backlogs of work right now and the machines are running pretty much non-stop. Loop holes in the wetlands protection legislation created in this decade are being exploited fequently not to mention just complete disregard for them in the first place.
Virgin prairie is being farmed for the first time in the Missouri Coteau and other parts of the northern prairie pothole region. Not because it makes agricultural sense but because crop subsidies can make it profitable.
There are certainly some dark clouds forming. I still believe the outlook for the future was much worse 30-years ago but the farm crisis of the mid-eighties ultimately reversed that tide.
I also agree an even bigger concern than our hunting culture going away is the environmental damage being done. I work in construction now and if we let a shovel full of dirt hit a storm drain or public waterway we are subject to large fines under stormwater prevention rules in the Federal Clean Water Act. The same federal government not only completely exempts agriculture from any regualtion they actually undertake policies that encourage tons of soil & nutrients to enter public waterways. I realize this is food production we are talking about here and there has to be some common sense applied but the current model is not sustainable.
Drainage is also a major issue. Is it a big secret why we seem to have a "100 Year" flood in some part of the ag belt every year. How many tax dollars in the last 20-years have gone to clean up those issues.
Ultimately I think the country as a whole needs to abandon the idea that we are responsible for feeding the world. Especially at the expense of our own land and environment.
I cannot imagine that shipping tons of grain and other basic food commodities across huge oceans is the most effecient (and profitable) solution to the process. How about if we developed a reasonable, sustainable agricultural production model of our own and then took the model and expertise around the world instead of the end product. I'd hazard to guess the end product would be less expensive for developing countries and more profitable for us.
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pheasantaddict
New member
Ag should be subject to same rules as everyone else.