16 Guage?

D

Duckdog17

New member
My first shotgun was a Winchester model 12 16 guage. I still have it and always will unless it gets handed down. I rarely shoot it now, but it's still one of the most natural pointing and comfortable shotguns I've ever shouldered.
Anyway, I've always felt that the 16 was a pretty darn good "do it all" shotgun.
So, why was it phased out? I'm sure there are plenty of theories floating around, but what's written in the books?
I'm a hardcore centerfire hand loader, but I've never loaded for shotguns.A lot of centerfire loading manuals give a brief history of the various cartridges, so I thought maybe there'd be something in a shot shell loading manual.

Since I mentioned centerfires,...there are a BUNCH of various centerfire chamberings, and you can still buy factory ammunition for a great majority of them,...right?
But the ammunition companies couldn't keep up with 5-6 different gauges? I know it's still available, but it's very limited, hard to find, and expensive!
Speaking of expensive,....4-10!!! Now THAT is just rediculous!!!
 
Other than non-tox, the 16 gauge is a good do-all.....but, so can be the 20 gauge and, especially, the 12 gauge.
Each of those can also do-more.
No 16 gauge skeet event.
16s represent a very small but satisfying niche.....I have an Auto 5 with a couple barrels and a Model 12.
But, I felt little loss before I had them....some, just not much.
 
What "more" can a 20 do over a 16?
But, this wasn't really intended to be a "which is better" thread.
The fact of the matter is, you can buy a .222 Rem, a .223 Rem, and factory ammunition for both. You can buy a .308 Winchester and a 30/06 and TONS of factory ammo for both. Ballistics of these are very similar and I could list a bunch just like that.
For the most part, we like variety and choices. With centerfires, if they had totally phased out every cartridge when the "next best thing" came around, there would sure be a whole lot less choices out there.
It just kind of makes a guy wonder why this has been the case in the shotgun world.
 
Yeah, you can buy loads for a .250 Savage or a .225 Winchester or a .25-20 WCF, but you're going to pay a premium to get it when compared to a a .30-06 or .243, the same comparison can be made for a 16 guage or 28 guage when compared to a 12 or 20. The ammo is available, just in short supply and at a premium price.

Joe Hunter shoots a 12 guage. Women and kids shoot a 20 guage. (I don't believe that is the extent of the ability, so don't flame me, just how it is 'perceived' in the non-gun-looney world, a 'man' shoots a 12 guage).

Joe Hunter buys 95% of the shells that are shot, he buys the cheapest promotional loads that Wal-Mart sells, takes them to the backyard of his buddy's house and shoots 'skeet' or 'trap'. When you explain he was just shooting clay pigeons, that skeet and trap are actual games on an actual course, he gives you a dumb look and shakes his head with a 'whatever' look.

You can argue that a 16 guage does everything a 20 guage does with a little more, but with that arguement, a 12 guage does everything a 16 guage, with a little more. Then of course a 10 guage does everything a 12 gauge does, and so on. At some point you've got to say enough is enough.

Why'd we settle on the 12 and 20 as the 'standard'? I don't know the answer, but I sure gave a wordy response didn't I? :)
 
Duckdog17 said:
What "more" can a 20 do over a 16?
But, this wasn't really intended to be a "which is better" thread.
Click to expand...

The 20 can be used in skeet competition....ie, increased sales.
The 20 can be found in ever smaller frame sizes, which some find important, especially for small bird upland hunting where ever-smaller in all aspects often implies skill today...ie, ego.
I would expect that economies of scale hurt the 16.
I've owned many 20s...now I don't....my comment was not addressed to "better", it was referencing the 20 gauge simply doing more with more offerings available....I dislike "better" threads.
More and better are not equal in definition.

Actually, I don't believe that either gauge is "better", I think they simply are different and each needs measured against any shooter's unique particulars of use or for what appeals and trips an emotional trigger.
10s, even in the short 10s, do not come close to the 12s in frame bulk or weight possible....that limits their sales despite an ability to handle much the same payload.
20s, on the other hand, easily counter and top the 16s in bulk and frame size, despite a few 16s sold on 20 gauge frames.

Reality and assumed reality appears to have most helped to eclipse the 16 in the minds first of the hunters and then of the scattergun/shotshell marketers and salesmen....add in the 3" 20 gauge shell, of course.
The marketers and salemen promoting that availability as an offering has the 20 gauge saturating a niche market for any new shooter wanting ease rather than understanding any other consideration.
That resulting degree of choice in the marketplace can quickly shuttle any product aside.

Metallics face a different market width.
 
I would like to have a 16 guage, ive been looking I think an auto would be cool and I think its a great gun for a woman or youth, I know the browning makes a ton in the A5 but I hate that old humpback looking world war 2 look :eek:
 
only a pointer said:
I would like to have a 16 guage, ive been looking I think an auto would be cool and I think its a great gun for a woman or youth, I know the browning makes a ton in the A5 but I hate that old humpback looking world war 2 look :eek:
Click to expand...

I was never a fan of the ol' humpback either. Never owned one until about 3 years ago. I had shot 16's when I was younger (a Mod 12 and a Rem 870) so after a 40+ year absence I bought a Citori 16 ga. I enjoyed shooting the 16 so much that I bought a 1960 Belgium A5 "Sweet Sixteen". That was my first A5 and I absolutely love it. I'm kicking myself for not owning one sooner. It's all I shoot now for pheasants. Don't give up on the old humpback until you have shouldered and fired one a few times. They point and shoot like a dream. So if you are thinking about getting a 16 ga. auto, be sure to give a Sweet Sixteen a good look.
 
16 gauge

Makes no difference to me "what gun does better than what gun, or what gauge does better than what gauge". Do you remember the '68 Camaro and the '69 GTO? Well, there is a "cool factor" that goes along with owning a Sweet 16 that is indescribable, and like the two beauties listed above, are a part of history. Buy one, and you'll feel better about everything, and you won't worry so much about habitat, what the farmers are doing with land that they DO happen to OWN by the way, 64 percent declines, license fees, and just about everything else. I lament the fact that of all the rifles and shotguns that I've owned over the years, that I waited until I was pushing 60 to get one.
 
I'm also a fan of the 16 and own three older dandies. If I ever become so logical and cold that I can't justify carrying an older 16 gauge now and then it's time to quit hunting pheasants and buy chicken at the market.
 
When I got out of high school in 1969 I bought a Riverside Arms 16 for $40 dollars because that was what I could afford. I have since upgraded a couple of times but it has always been a 16. I have never regretted it. Nice analogy on the old cars, my preference is the 67 Camaro, I bought one of those in 1968 and still have it, but there isn't that much difference.
 
Yep! It's good to see that some of ya'all can relate. I guess I've always been a fan of the different and obscure.
I guess, (thinking back on it now), maybe the fact that my Dad started me off with a 16 guage started me down that path years ago.
And now that's why I shoot a .17 Remington, and a .264 Win Mag. Heck, I even made my own "obscure" rifle last year,...a .204 Ruger necked down to .17 cal.
It's called a 17/204 and I absolutely love it!
It would be neat to see a little come back of the 16 guage!
 
Bought a 16 guage citori white lightning over and under this spring. Shot it this summer for sporting clays and also shot my 12 guage. Didn't notice any difference in my scores or leads. I love the gun and plan to shoot it at some roosters this fall just for fun and nostalgia over everyone else shooting the same guage. Just preference I suppose.
 
White Lightning

I bought the exact gun but haven't shot it yet. I sold it to my son so I can still use it. Concentrating on the Sweet 16 now because this will be my go to gun this fall. I'm starting to get a feel for it. The Citori is a beautiful gun. I got mine with oil finish and 28s. I'm sure I'll put some lead through it before I head out to SD.
 
Carrying a 16 is a matter of personal preference.
You're limiting yourself somewhat in the ammo availability - both potential (what is produced) and realistic (what you find on the shelves).
Anything above 20 will kill just as dead at realistic ranges.

The 16's niche was when it approaced 12ga performance at 20ga weight. Now 20Mags will approach the 12 in performance and offer true weight savings, it eclipsed the 16.

No matter - I carry a 16 because I like it.

Plus, you get some funny looks at the big box stores when you're looking for ammo. Been told that it was illegal, unsafe and imaginary at different times....
 
I do think that in most cases the 16 ga. with 1 1/8 oz. loads does pattern better than the 20 ga. and have a heavier payload than a standard 2 3/4" 20 ga. shell. the 3" 20 ga. with it's long shot string has never been know to pattern extremely well. But then every gun is different.

I've been shooting a 16 ga. (Citori and a Sweet Sixteen) for the past 5-6 years exclusively for pheasants and I can honestly say I really can't tell the difference in killing power from when I was shooting a 12 ga. in the past. Growing up I shot a 16 ga. and killed just as many pheasants, ducks and geese as my buddies shooting 12's.
 
My go to pheasant gun has always been a Winchester 101 12ga...until a couple of years ago when I picked up a Sweet Sixteen. The 101 has dropped many birds, but my boy Taz has had to chase several; the 16 drops them dead. It's not a scientific evaluation, but the dog sure likes the 16 with 1 1/8 6's.
 
JMc said:
My go to pheasant gun has always been a Winchester 101 12ga...until a couple of years ago when I picked up a Sweet Sixteen. The 101 has dropped many birds, but my boy Taz has had to chase several; the 16 drops them dead. It's not a scientific evaluation, but the dog sure likes the 16 with 1 1/8 6's.
Click to expand...

:thumbsup:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top